Seeking advice for first-time printing

[jawood1530]

Hi All,
  A kickstarter project I started called Slayers of Arkaeus is about to finish up and I find I am in need of printing at least 25 copies (preferably more if they aren't too expensive) of a book around 160 pages. I have the document looking just the way I want it to in word and pdf, but recently I found out (to my surprise) that it won't be printed the way it comes out on my home printer if I send it to a professional printer. I've heard a lot of new terms this last week (layout, template, bleed, marks, layering) and I'm pretty sure my relatively simple document won't need all of them (it is entirely black and white, mostly text with some images embedded among the text), but I still have no idea just what I'll need to do to actually get it to print the way I want it to. I have quite a bit of experience formatting documents for desktop printing using MS word, but not with any other programs. So, any advice on either trying to do this myself or professionally would be much appreciated.
Thanks very much and have a  good day.
-James


James Wood
Aspiring game developer

[Eero Tuovinen]

Right. The first thing you need to do is to clarify your goals. Specifically, what level and type of quality are you happy with for your book. There are better and worse ways of executing a project like this, but the specifically best choices for you depend on what you're attempting to achieve by publishing. It doesn't make sense for me to just rattle off a bunch of relatively complex things that you should do as "publishing industry best practices" if your project doesn't need or even want to blend in culturally and artistically with what is considered "professional" in a traditional sense.

(The following is easier to follow along if you know that I'm sort of semiprofessionally involved in the field: I haven't formally studied book design, but my general culture industry work has led to me to do so much of this stuff that at this point it's fair to consider it my occupation, at least in terms of where I get the rent money, even if I don't singularly define myself as a "layout person" and go get a job at some newspaper doing it.)

The quick bird's eye view on the matter is that if you just want to have your text on paper, bound into a book, it is barely possible to achieve with the work-flow you've started with (doing the layout in MS Office, that is), but you probably should have somebody more experienced with book publishing look it all over with you before you submit it to a printer to ensure that there aren't any major issues or omissions. On the other hand, if you care about what your book will look like (and specifically, want to control it consciously for some specific artistic goals), I recommend either learning some book design or getting somebody to do the layout for you. It is a somewhat technical field with a number of pitfalls, as you've apparently begun to discover.

If you decide to do it yourself, you might expect to have somebody moderately experienced in the field spend a few hours validating your document (basically, looking it over to ensure that you've created something that technically passes muster). If you also need help choosing a printer and so on, you might be looking at say a couple of days of work, depending on how close you are to publishable right now (it'll take more time to fix if the current layout is a mess). Not too much work that you couldn't get somebody to do it out of camaradie etc. in my experience, if you're lucky enough to know somebody with the knowhow.

If you decide that you need a thorough overhaul (basically, your original workflow strategy sucks, and you need to rethink how you're bringing the book to print), you'll probably end up either learning to do layout, or hiring somebody to do it for you. For that type and scope of book we're probably looking at a week of study if you've already got the basics (computer use, literary history, efficient learning strategy etc.) - maybe half a week with a realistic teacher and a willingness to learn as you go. The layout itself will take another 3 days if executed to hobby standards (think low-end indie rpg book), or a week (plus any editing/revision time) if executed to mainstream book publishing standards.

Of course it all depends heavily on the particulars of the project. If you'll tell us more about your artistic, commercial and other goals for the project, I for one would be happy to speculate upon what you might wish to do next.

[Ron Edwards]

Here's the Kickstart which just funded and as of this writing has less than three days left: Slayers of Arkaeus, which has some roots in Forge thinking as it turns out. As you can see, it's been promised pretty quick, so I think the need for speed and efficiency is high. If I understand correctly, James is looking for a standard-size paperback with color covers and b-and-w interiors. Going by the estimates I get at Publishers Graphics, basic printing should only be about $5 per book, or a bit more. So the job isn't strange or weird - he simply needs concrete help with standard format, printer's marks, appropriate file design, and similar. A skilled layout person could probably do it in a day, given the specs, unless I'm missing something.

James, you have the pencil sketches already done, right?

Best, Ron

[Eero Tuovinen]

If you've got the current layout on hand, I'd be interested in taking a look. Much quicker to get a sense of the project that way. Who knows, you might already be practically finished with it.

[Justice Platt]

I can't match Ron & Eero's expertise or experience (even a little bit), so grain of salt for anything I say, but Kevin Crawford, of Stars Without Number fame, put together a short guide to publishing an indie rpg, with lots of specific reference to how to do a basic functional layout in indesign and some worked examples.  It is here:  https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B4qCWY8UnLrcVVVNWG5qUTUySjg&usp=sharing

He also offers the indesign files for the first chapter of his game Spears of the Dawn free at rpgnow to use as you please.

Maybe these will help.

[ndpaoletta]

Hi James,

If you're looking to print only 25 copies right now, and you already have a PDF that you're happy with (regardless of what software you used to create it), you could use a true print-on-demand service. These let you upload your PDF, preview what it's gonna look like, and give you lots of info about troubleshooting things on your end. So, the upside is that you can learn by doing, and you control the pacing of the process on your end until you get to the actual print-and-ship stage. The downside to such services is that they're more expensive, per-page, then using a short-run digital printer (like Publishers Graphics, which Ron mentioned). Also, their support tends to be hit-or-miss.

Recommendations: a lot of indie folks use lulu.com, there's also createspace.com (which is owned by Amazon), and you can set your PDF up on DrivethruRPG.com and turn on a print-on-demand option (they use a printer called Lightning Source for their POD)

If you want to save on your per-book cost, but enjoy the dubious joy of dealing with printer representatives, you can go with a short-run digital printer. Ron mentioned Publishers Graphics (http://www.pubgraphics.com/). I have a good relationship with 360 Digital (http://www.360digitalbooks.com/), and in the past I've used Fidlar Doubleday, which is now know as Brandt Doubleday (http://www.brandtdoubleday.com/). In these cases: use their online quote form and/or contact info to give them the basic info about your book, and then once a rep gets in touch with you, get them on the phone and explain what you have and what you're looking for. They should be able to review your existing document and let you know if they can work with it or not as part of the quoting process.

Just based on what you've posted here, if you're not doing any images all the way out to the edge of the page (aka "Full Bleed"), and you're printing in black-and-white, you really don't need to worry about crop marks and bleed settings. If your PDF is the size that you want it to print (that is, if you want an 8.5x11 book, and you have a PDF at 8.5x11), you should be able to send that to a printer. Save or export it at as high a quality setting as you can.

The cover can be tricker, and handling it depends on how you're printing. Lulu and the like will give the dimensions that your full wraparound cover will need to be once you upload your file into their system; they also usually have an option for you just to create a front and back cover, and they'll give it a solid color spine. Digital printers will be able to give you the spine width once you've settled all the details, but you'll be on your own to create the wraparound cover file.

Hope some of that helps a bit! Googling is your friend for the basic concepts and terminology, as well. Keep asking questions when stuff doesn't make sense, and it'll start making sense!

[jawood1530]

Wow, I never expected so many great responses so quickly, thanks so much.
So the kickstarter is over now and I'm still adding some finishing touches, but I can definitely give some more details on the project.
The document is all black and white (even the cover), I never envisioned doing any full page bleed effects, and my preference is to do a 6X9 size. Its also the first rpg I've put together, so I think in terms of professional standards I'm in the area of simple, low-end indie rpg. I've gotten a few quotes from publishers, and the best so far looks like Publisher Graphics, but they also said: "Files must be print ready and meet our Template Standards for accurate printing", so I want to make sure the document is up to snuff before sending it.
The kickstarter also earned a bit more than I thought it would, so I can (hopefully) hire someone to do a bit of layout at this point. Any idea how much that usually costs? The document is mostly just simple text and tables, with about a dozen pencil sketches embedded among the text. I have all the pencil sketches done and scanned already, though I did get a couple from my artist recently that I need to add to the actual document. I was also hoping to do a 6X9, but I've been worrying that could present formatting/printing problems, so I'm willing to go with 8.5X11 if necessary. 
I'd definitely be interested in learning to do layout (and maybe a program like indesign), but for the sake of the backers I should probably hire someone to get the document print ready at this point.
I went ahead and checked out lulu and it looks super convenient, but I would like to do a run of about 100 books (maybe 200 if I can afford it) and their prices were a bit high. That said, not knowing exactly how much layout would cost its hard to figure out the cost-benefit. If someone would be willing to take a look at the formatting I have now that would be a huge help, and if I can afford to hire you to do the layout it needs I would certainly be happy to.
And thanks again for everyone's help, I think I've at least doubled my knowledge by reading your posts and links!

[Eero Tuovinen]

Regarding costs of layout: here in Europe (especially Finland, being my best point of price knowledge)  you'd pay an hourly rate of e.g. 30 € for professional work, up to 50 € in specialized circumstances. However, it is not uncommon to get the work cheaper from variously interested parties - somebody wants to do it for fun, or they're a student, or whatever. (For example, my own "hobby rate" for projects I want to support without going completely pro bono is usually 10 € /h.) I understand that the American prices are substantially cheaper, especially with the consistent plummeting that the dollar has been doing for years now.

If you'll post your current layout (or send a link, whatever) I can take a look to form an opinion on whether you need outside help with the layout, or if you'll be able to bring this home yourself. As Nathan says, it is possible that a Word file could suffice well enough to make it not worth doing a re-layout, assuming the illustration situation is simple and so on. Looking at the file also makes me able to offer you a quote on helping you bring the book home; I suspect that what you need here is not to pay somebody to do the layout for you, but depending on how much I love the book and how much work it'd take, it's possible that we could find a sensible common ground in the matter.

Considering Ron's points about the Kickstarter, schedules and the amount of work involved, I agree with him - you could maybe expect to make this a short and snappy project, effortlessly out of the door. I can't imagine that the state of your layout is so hopeless as to make it a massive project to massage it into publishable shape, considering the cultural context here.

--

You are correct in thinking that Lulu is a bit too expensive for a 100 book run; what you have there is not properly a "print on demand" situation, despite the way marketers like to wrangle terminology. Rather, you have a "small print run" or a "short run". My point is, it is not unexpected for a company that specializes in single-book printing (like Lulu) to not be as cost-efficient at the 100 copy range as a proper small press printer.

For comparison's sake, I have a lot of experience in the exact scope of printing you're doing here (200 copies is about right for the Finnish-language rpg market), and the printers I end up using are always either small digital print shops, or big hybrid houses that do both short run digital and traditional off-set. Both of these types of companies consistently outbid the proper print on demand options like Lulu and such. (With the advances in off-set printer workflows the borderline between the cost efficiency of digital printing and off-set has been coming down, too: it used to be that you needed to be printing in the thousands range to consider off-set, but nowadays it seems that e.g. a 500 copy print run can be affordable to print at a traditional off-set printer.)

The typical ideal strategy developed in the Forge days for your kind of situation is to hybridize flexibly according to your strategic needs: first print whatever you need immediately at hand for your funders, con schedule, whatever, with perhaps 20-50% of excess to establish a comfortable supply for the first year. Then move to true POD with Lulu or wherever for the long tail, if you don't feel like maintaining a constant inventory. By using two entirely separate printers at the two different stages of your publishing project (initial sales push, and the consequent long tail) you can benefit from the best prices available to each type of publishing.

(If the above seems obvious, I should note that the traditional thinking is wildly divergent: in the traditional model you attempt to estimate the entire life cycle of your product, and match your initial print run to that. This optimizes your overall expenses, as it's always cheaper to print all you need at once, but it also makes you vulnerable to investment risk - what if you don't sell as much as you expected - and causes more logistical work on caring for your inventory, which might not be worth it for an indie hobby publisher.)

--

Regarding Publisher's Graphics (which I haven't worked with myself, I think, but I've heard that many have been satisfied with them), the templates they refer to are on their website, and mostly concern the correct layout of your book covers. It's pretty simple stuff, but only if you have the layout know-how, so that's one bit where you'll probably benefit by having somebody else look at your cover stuff to make sure it's right, or even outright put it right for you.

Also, PG apparently offers the capability in their workflow for collating arbitrary color pages into an otherwise black and white book. (This isn't a given in digital printing; usually you'd have to pay to have the entire book done in color.) You might consider that in your layout plans; without knowing about the details of the project, the occasional dash of color seems like something that I would very much love to play with myself in a low-end indie book like this. It's an easy way to achieve a distinctive look :D

In more general terms, looking beyond this project: I tend to encourage indie designer/publishers to learn to do layout and related tasks themselves, because our needs are generally simple, and layout skills are by their nature such that you'll benefit most from the early effort. In other words, it's entirely possible to get to the level of skill you actually need for your projects with quite minor amounts of study. Not relevant for this project right now, but you might consider improving your skills for the next one, increasing your self-sufficiency and ability to adapt to the various little curve balls that publishing project tend to throw at you.

[Ron Edwards]

6x9 is a standard size and will not present any problems with production. If you've designed the text at that size already, then you should stay with it.

Here's what I did with Publishers Graphics, and I think most POD companies will be willing to do it too. I gave them the list of backers' addresses, and they printed the books, packaged them, and sent them. They billed me for packaging, labor, and postage.

From what I'm seeing in your posts, I agree with Eero that you may be close to ready. Would you mind adding the final art, setting the pages at the size you want, and letting us take a look at it? You could email a copy to Eero or to anyone here who wouldn't mind. I ask anyone reading it to put his or her design ideals on the shelf and focus strictly on physical readiness for print.

[jawood1530]

Eero and Ron, thanks so much, you guys have been real life-savers on this.
I'd be happy to send you the current file to check out. I don't immediately see a way to post it here, but I'll go ahead and e-mail it to Ron. Eero, if I can get your e-mail I'll send it to you right away. My e-mail is jawood1530@yahoo.com.
I also went ahead and changed the size to 6X9, but that messed quite a bit up. I thought it would just shrink down everything and have the same amount on each page, but of course it did not, lol. It also increased the number of pages by 110, so it might be just about as practical to get it printed in 8.5X11 (I mostly wanted 6X9 for the cost savings).
Eero, I'm hoping you like the book and I can qualify for your "almost pro-bono" rate, or maybe point me to one of your cheapo American counterparts, lol. I'd be happy to hire you if you think the job is doable, and if you would like some creative input that is totally cool with me. I'm more concerned about the rules and gameplay, as long as the visuals are relatively pretty and don't come out blurry or in the wrong place, I'll be happy.
Oh, and please forgive the rough state of some parts of the document. I've yet to do my final run-through for typos and consistency, and I have one last chapter still in progress that I need to add (guide to the world of Arkaeus). Other than that, though, this is pretty much what I envision the book looking like in print.