[S/Lay w/Me] The last temple of the first god

[shlo]

Hello,

Yesterday evening I had a chance to play the game with a good friend, so here is a report and some thoughts.

I don't know the original game terms because I have the book in French, so I will use my own translations: Move, Goal, Monster, Lover, Conflict, Climax, You, I, Good Dice and so on. I hope you will be able to guess which is what.


The story we did

I was the 'I' player, my friend Dave was 'You'. For his character he choose the hunted outlaw, bitter but still hoping. I don't know how it translates exactly in the original version, but I'm sure you can find which one it is. For his description, he added this sentence: "A tall man in his forties, dressed in red, one-eyed and scary." The adventure was to take place in "The last sacred place of the first god" and again, I don't know the exact English entry. His goal was to steal the Tablet of the Sacred Law.

Later during the game, we realized that his character had no name, but it wasn't really a problem to us. Still, in case we need it, he named his character Red.

I described the place as a temple in the middle of a rain forest, with giant trees and roots everywhere, crumbled walls and stones eaten by wild vegetation, and with snakes everywhere. The temple itself was a dome on columns, open to all winds, with incense, cushions and hangings. This was a temple to King Sssar, a god (and a living one at that, a giant snake, but I didn't tell that to the player yet) with several priests and servants of both sex. This king had a queen, Sonia, a beautiful woman from the closest city: the king took wife after wife among the years, and Sonia was the current one. Quite obviously she was the lover, but I tried to make things a bit more ambiguous with the presence of female servants.

I decided that Sonia would be innocent, forbidden, openly interested and an expert. I gave her a score of 2 because it seemed to make it easier for the player to beat the monster. As for the monster, he would kill Red slowly, directly, savagely and in group: he would summon thousands of snakes and let them poison the victim, wait hours then eat and digest him alive. I had no idea which score to choose for the monster so I went for the average with a 5. Sssar is a big, big and old snake, ten meters long and big enough to swallow a horse.

So now Dave had to describe an entrance for his hero: he told me Red was running away from the capital, with soldiers on his track. He spent some time in jail, on purpose, in order to contact someone, then he escaped on a horse and came for the temple. Now his horse was half dead but the temple was in sight, so Red jumped in a tree and waited for the pursuers to pass, then he killed them quickly, before heading to the temple.

Then Red came to the entrance of the temple and asked bluntly to a servant where he could find the tablet. She was afraid but managed to explain that he had to see the queen for his request, so she went to look for her. Red certainly appreciated the vision of Sonia coming to him, but still he was here for the tablet so he tried to buy it with diamonds. Sonia had only eyes for the tall man and didn't care for the diamonds. So Dave started the conflict looking for his goal, rolled one die and got a poor little 1.

Sonia wasn't exactly happy in this place and with Red she saw an opportunity to leave, so she was quite cooperative, and seductive too (and now I realize that she wasn't as innocent as I pictured her at first.) She led him to some spiral staircases going a dozen meters down in the heart of the temple, with at its center a long rope hanging from the ceiling and a big bell attached to it. The lower part of the temple was a big room with more hangings, cushions and incense, but also dark places and some galleries. Under the bell was a small altar, with the tablet on it. Suspecting a trap, Red approached cautiously. When he was about to grab the tablet, king Sssar appeared from the darkness at breathtaking speed, trying to tore Red's arm apart. Fortunately Red managed to remove his arm. That was the monster's attack, I rolled one die and got a 4.

Red took the rope and cut it, to be taken upstairs quickly (in my mind the rope was just attached to the ceiling but I was okay with a pulley system to allow this nice escape.) He went to found some oil and a torch and came back at once, walking down the stairs. Downstairs, he could hear king Sssar being mad at Sonia who let a stranger approach the tablet like that, sensing treason in her. I added this in order to make clear to the player that Sonia was on his side, and in trouble now. So Red came back, pouring oil everywhere, and when the snake tried to attack him again Red threw the remaining oil at the monster's face then set it on fire. He grabbed the tablet and started to climb the stairs again, with the snake behind him. Red grabbed the tablet, his goal, hence it was another die to roll, but again Dave was unlucky and he got a 2.

The snake was burning but didn't pay attention to it. He chased Red on the stairs then managed to destroy them, Red fell with the tablet, Sssar jumping down after him. The man managed to land softly and kept the tablet with him. I rolled another die for this attack: 3.

Red saw that Sonia was right under Sssar's fall, about to be crushed. He grabbed her by an arm and ran for a small gallery, too small for Sssar. The snake fell and hissed at the entrance of the gallery, trying to slip in. Red walked with Sonia farther in the gallery, trying to find a way out. When things seemed to calm a bit, he took some time to examine the text on the tablet. Sonia was afraid, he promised her he would take her with him. Dave managed to investigate on his goal plus he made a promise to Sonia, so this time he had two dice to roll and got lucky: double 6.

And to our mutual surprise, Dave realized that he could end the conflict now by asking me to reroll my two dice, which I did. His sum was 15, with four dice, so of course there was no way I could beat him. I rolled 3 and 4, and Dave could only achieve one secondary objective. At this point we had no idea if we were supposed to choose the outcome right now, or to keep playing until Dave was in a position to choose between several outcomes. We decided to choose at once: of course Red would get the tablet, having the highest sum on the dice, but he would also heal or avoid any wound from Sssar. Sonia would die but not the monster.

For the next move I told him how thousands of snakes emerged from holes in the walls, from the standing water and from all the galleries but one. It was obvious that Sssar was waiting for them in that direction, so Red drew his sword and started to hack at the snakes in a direction of his choice, grabbing Sonia behind him. The tablet fell but Red gave it a kick to push it ahead. They both suffered from dozen snake bytes, Red managed to keep walking but Sonia fell and Red quickly saw that she wasn't going to survive, so he abandoned her. He picked up the tablet and made it to the end of the gallery, overlooking a cliff with a river far below. He jumped. He was sick for a few days then he overcame the poison and ran away.


Thoughts

I explained the rules after the character creation, going back and forth in the book to find the exact rules each time. I knew them but I wanted to be sure, because I like to play by the book and furthermore I didn't have a clear picture of how they would work during the game, so I didn't want to break something by misreading. We were both a bit puzzled by the game, because the text has more rules than flavor, we had no idea where we were going.

As you can see we ended with a single, long sequence. That was not planned, we just let the game drive us to this format. The place was quite small with not much to do or see, plus Dave was eager to take the initiative, and I guess it made us rush a bit.

At first we were mostly preoccupied by the sum of the dice, forgetting about the "good dice" and the secondary objectives. Dave told me that he wanted to start the conflict very soon, because if he started it that was one less die for the monster. Plus he jumped on the occasion to win the conflict, thus making the game quite short. After that we saw that the secondary objectives were of some importance, like saving the lover, and that winning the conflict was not all.

I'm not sure what the last objective is: "do something/fail", I guess it's any other task the hero wants to be done, like saving a city.

After this first game, it appears that having as much dice as possible, both for 'I' and 'You', is a better tactic. With more dice for 'I' it's easier to get one very small die, making it easier for 'You' to obtain "good dice". And with more dice for 'you', it is possible to achieve more secondary objectives, up to 4 of them: that takes 8 dice, 6 from the monster (if 'I' choose to give it  score of 6) and 2 from the lover (again, if 'I' gave it a score of 2). So with the initial scores, what 'I' is really doing is choosing how much secondary objectives 'you' will have a chance to achieve. Which doesn't sound very fair to me, but I can live with that. Winning the conflict seems quite easy if the player takes the initiative twice as Dave did: first to start the conflict and second to end it. But is doesn't seem to be the best strategy, it's just a way to get an automatic success with the goal and to be sure to avoid death. Well, this last one is important, I guess.

I had some questions but after playing everything is quite obvious. For example is it possible to make several promises to the lover? I think so, 'You' can do it twice and get some reward for it, any subsequent promise wouldn't work though, and I see it as the lover getting tired of lies. A lot of pieces like that come in place after a first game, and at this point it is easy to see how well crafted it is.

We were still puzzled by the fact that both 'I' and 'You' can describe a move that doesn't give a die during the conflict. We did not see any advantage to it, so I think it's only for the case where one has no idea how to introduce an action concerning the goal, the lover or an attack from the monster, and he just describes something to move on.

We both want to play again. His character survived and looked quite good during the adventure (despite abandoning Sonia to the snakes) so we want to see more of him. Also next time I will be 'You' and Dave will be 'I'. I'm sure the next game will be more interesting in terms of tactics!

We both loved the fact that emergent tactics arise during play, this is a strong motivation to keep us playing. I think the text should give a better preview of the good time to come because as I said, we had no idea where we were going and it's only the trust and the sword & sorcery theme that made us play. The text should give more food to the imagination and not only to the intellect, but I understand that you want it to be a very short game and you don't have much place for more.

michael.

edited to fix minor formatting - RE

[shlo]

Oops sorry, I didn't properly close the bold tag and the preview wasn't working... Ron, can you please edit it, or give me a permission to do it myself?

Fixed! I'm leaving this message in to show newcomers how this sort of thing is supposed to be done - RE

[Ron Edwards]

Thanks for the kind words about the game! I think it has a steep learning curve, but it's not a tall curve, and there's nothing bad about being on it.

For example, rushing the fiction such that the whole story is basically a fight, is typically the case when both players are new to the game. And that's fine! The rules lend themselves well to "stretching" with each adventure, i.e., using the system for effects that you didn't even notice were possible the first time you played. I'm certain you'll discover them as you go along.

You're right about the dice – it's only partly about the sum, because the Good Dice matter too. I've seen people topple the tower even when they have a winning total, because they really want the "I" dice to show a lower value.

Your interpretation of "do something/fail" is absolutely correct.

My thoughts about your thoughts are pretty simple: you and Dave have learned that this really isn't a game about beating the other player, or more accurately, beating the other player is a means toward an end, not an end in itself, and it has very little to do with genuinely strategic 0-sum play. In other words, the "better player" does not get what he or she wants at the other player's expense. Your paragraph about this issue is also absolutely correct.

We were still puzzled by the fact that both 'I' and 'You' can describe a move that doesn't give a die during the conflict. We did not see any advantage to it, so I think it's only for the case where one has no idea how to introduce an action concerning the goal, the lover or an attack from the monster, and he just describes something to move on.

That's one of those things you'll discover more about as you continue to play. It will make more sense when you've both relaxed a little bit about "who wins, oh my God, the point is to win, how do I win, who's going to win."

Your decision to choose the explicit outcome that Dave bought with his Good Dice, right at that moment of play, before playing the final scene or scenes, was correct. The best way to look at it is that the ordinary Goes do not stop. They pause for a single out-of-fiction moment when the "You" player chooses (best thought of as circling what he gains and crossing out what he doesn't, for all the pairs), and once that choice is known, ordinary play resumes with the constraint that it must ultimately include that precise content, and without dice.

I am very interested in how Dave modified his character.

... I think the text should give a better preview of the good time to come because as I said, we had no idea where we were going and it's only the trust and the sword & sorcery theme that made us play. ...

I am convinced that no amount of reassuring or colorful text in the game itself will communicate this point to the reader, and that this game lives or dies strictly due to the passion and visual/imagined excitement each person feels. However, I think that perhaps what you're talking about can be communicated by example – by describing, when you do play an extended set of adventures, what happens? How does the character change? What kind of a romantic drama emerges? Ultimately I'd like an interactive service on the Adept website that permits people to fill out forms describing certain mechanical and fictional things for each session, and which could be viewed by others.

Best, Ron

[shlo]

Hi,

Two days ago we played again, with Dave. First I was "you" but my adventure wasn't very satisfying, mostly because the Color was more Lyonesse than Conan. We had time for a second adventure so Red, Dave's character from last month, was back, and this second adventure was far better. But it's a little bit late in the night for a report so I'll leave that for tomorrow and meanwhile I'll have a few questions and remarks.

I bought the pdf in English and had a chance to compare with the printed French version I have: the translation is actually very good. But this comparison also stressed that I had neglected one rule: the dice must be stacked vertically and not horizontally. With the French version only, I wasn't sure the dice had to be in a real column, I thought maybe it was a clumsy formulation. I was not. Up to now we always played with horizontal lines of dice. This afternoon I was wondering if the frailty of a high column was also an element of gameplay: why would "You" want to have no dice during the Match, if not because of the risk to topple his column? Yet there's no rule as to what happen if a column falls (incidentally or not) so I guess it is just not supposed to happen.

In the two last adventures my friend Dave was rushing, as in the first game, so I was always far behind in terms of dice count. Four dice for my character Virno versus five for him when I was playing "You", then seven dice for his character Red and only four for me when I was "I" again. I think both players must have the same pace or the outcome will be either a big failure (Virno only managed to survive) or a total success (Red got everything.) The "I" player should not be playing to win, which was what my friend was doing when I was playing Virno: Dave always managed to "land a hit" in his Goes, almost to the point where the story loses its credibility. Instead, he should be following "You's" pace.

When I read the conditions to begin the Match, I'm not sure anymore if the Go that triggers the Match gives a die. Does the Match start AFTER this Go, thus giving the other player the opportunity to get the first die?

Anyway, we definitively want to continue playing. I'll probably create another character because Virno's first adventure left us with a bad taste in the mouth, but Red is going to come back for sure. In the very first adventure he managed to steal a Tablet from the first God, and his new capability was to "control the impulse of fanatic people". He had a chance to use it in his second adventure, as I will tell you tomorrow. And wait until you see what his new capabilities are. =)


michael.

[shlo]

Two more thing:

1. Of course there's a rule when "You" deliberately topples "I's" column. But I was referring to a rule for when my own column crumbling while I was trying to had a die on it, or because the table moved, or because the die I rolled hit the column.

2. I was also quite unlucky with the dice: as "You" I rolled 1, 3, 4 and 1; and as "I" I rolled 2, 1, 1 and 2. It certainly doesn't help.

[shlo]

Here is the report for Red's second adventure. The location was "What remains from when they tried to dig to Hell", and his Goal was to find the Ring of Fools.

I decided that the Monster would kill fast, up-front, savagely and singly. The Lover would be wanton, approved, manipulative and knowledgeable. I also decided that the Lover and the Monster would be the same person, and that the Monster would the King Sssar, the god from the first adventure. The Lover is a succubus, possessed by the snake god. She would be unaware of the god's presence until it's too late.

I gave one point for the Lover and four for the Monster, wanting to try this short setting after having done the opposite in the first session.

I pictured the location as a fort, built in the middle of a dead forest, with a great hall to shelter the workers, a stone wall to keep the operation secret and some secondary buildings for the tools and the machines (some kind of giant drill, working with magic and slaves.) The attempt ended with a semi volcano eruption and demons everywhere. The ground below the fort is now a kind of mound, half soil and half volcanic rock. The fort is mostly burnt and crumbled, trapped in the rock. The forest was alive before the eruption, but now everything is dead.

As usual, Red made his entrance with a chase. This time it was him chasing three werewolves. He quickly shot them with silver bolts then stopped his horse to look at the fort.

As soon has he got closer, a giant demonic guardian jumped from inside the fort to block the entrance. While Red was considering the creature, the Lover made her apparition as well, behind the tall man: "His name is Sod, he is the guardian demon." The succubus introduced herself as Dira.

Red was surprised by her apparition but she didn't seem to be ill-intentioned so he asked her a few questions about the guardian. She wasn't very helpful, though. Red tried an illusion but the demon wasn't fooled, so instead he shot two bolts at the demon's eyes and, when the creature protected its eyes, Red ran between the huge legs to enter the fort, knowing that is Goal was inside. Before taking the entrance, he turned to Dira to promise her he would come back to take care of her. So Dave started the Match, seeking is Goal while making promises to the Lover: he rolled two dice and got a pair of 2. I only had one Go before he started it! Probably because the location I described wasn't very interesting, with few things to do. I'll be more careful the next time I need to create one. I'm not sure the action toward the Goal was a valid one, he certainly got closer but that was an indirect consequence.

Red then discovered the place, with a giant drill abandoned close to a smoking hole. A quick glance at the hall and the other buildings, and also a quick glance behind because Sod would come soon. Somehow Dira was already here, close to the hole. When Sod came, Red climbed down. I didn't find a way to attack with the Monster, I wanted to surprise Dave with the Lover turning into a Monster, but first Red had to go to the succubus and he wouldn't do that because he already had the one and only die coming from the Lover. No die for me.

Red went down the hole and found a nave. He new he needed to find a special dagger somewhere in this nave to get the Ring of Fools, so he started looking for it. A few minutes later, he found a chest with the dagger inside. With this dagger, Red got closer to his Goal so he rolled another die and got a 1.

Again, Dira was here, telling Red that she would be very grateful to him if he would take her away from this desolated place. When Red asked how much grateful she would be, she came to him, embraced him and kissed him... and turned into a giant snake at once. Red was trapped, suffocating, with several bones already broken and the giant mouth coming to him. Then he passed out. Now I was happy, I could turn the Lover into a Monster. I got a die for the Monster's attack and rolled a 2. Notice that I forgot to add a die as I should have, since Sssar was a Monster from a previous adventure. Stupid me!

Red woke up in a flat, empty, infinite desert under a white sky. Far away, Dira was running to him, waving. Red thought he was dreaming and tried to wake up. Then during a few seconds he was back in the Sssnake's belly, hacking with the dagger, and found the snake's heart, and in a flash he saw as a ring, but he could not grasp it. So the snake's heart seemed to be the Ring of Fools, somehow, and now Red knew it. Dave rolled another die and got a 3.

Then the pain was too strong and he passed out again, went back in the desert and found himself making love with Dira. Later they walked in the desert and found an oasis with a tent, where they rested a few days. Even with Red hurt and inside the snake, it wasn't really an attack, more like the consequence of the previous attack, so I took no die for this Go.

Recovered, Red wanted to explore this world inside Sssar. They walked and found an abandoned city in the desert. Inside they discovered a library with a book containing information about the Ring of Fools: the heart of Sssar was actually the ring. A confirmation about the Goal, so Dave rolled another die: 6!

But then venom started to ooze from the walls, covering all the surfaces. The book itself was covered with it. Red had no choice but to throw it and run away from the library with Dira. Outside, the city was plunged into the darkness: looking above, they saw a gigantic object falling from the sky. They ran for their lives and Red barely escaped the city before a huge snake fang smashed the whole city. Dira was nowhere in sight. Maybe it was two Goes instead of one, since escaping the library already represents a forward-moving event. Anyway I rolled a die and got a 1.

Red woke up in the fort, to find Sssar cut in half by Sod's ax. Apparently the snake wasn't in the guest list either and the guardian demon managed to cut him while the snake was digesting. Red quickly took the heart and flew from the fort. A few days later he found a tavern where he rested several days, trying to discover how this heart could be turned into a ring. To me the giant fang was an attack, but Dave so it as the allegorical world crumbling because Sssar was badly wounded, which was fine by me. His die rolled a 3.

In the crowded dining room of the tavern, five hooded figures emerged around Red, armed with sacrificial knives. Their faces were hidden in shadows but Red could see bright snake eyes shining. One of them already had Red under hypnotic control, making him too heavy to move, while the others were coming close to stab him and cut his throat. Fortunately Dira appeared too and managed to kill the one who had Red under control. That was another attack from Sssar's disciples, I rolled another die: 1. Of course I invented those fanatics on purpose, giving Dave an opportunity to try Red's new capability to control impulses of fanatics.

So Red used his new capability and the disciples quickly started to argue, seeing each others as heretics and killing them, Red just had to finish to last one. Dira was able to come back because Sssar was weakened by Sod's attack. She had time to read the page on the book in the library and saw what Red had to do: stick one of Sssar's own fang into his heart. Another precious information, Red is getting closer to the Ring of Fools. Another die, a 5 this time. While writing this report, I realize that this Go has two forward-moving events, we must be more careful next time.

Red went back to the castle and found the remains of Sod and his ax. No sign of Sssar. And again, Dira disappeared: the snake probably recovered. Red then went to explore the crumbled hall, making a torch and wandering in the darkness. Sssar managed to surprise him by attacking from the ceiling: he landed on Red (ouch!) and started a battle with him. The fourth die for me and thus the last one. Roll, roll, roll... another 2.

It was time to calculate sums:

* Me: 2, 1, 1, 2 (nice!)
* You: 2, 2, 1, 3, 6, 3, 5

We had a winner, with four options available. So Red would obtain his Goal, recover from his wounds, eliminate Sssar and save Dira.

Final fight, Red and Sssar rolled on the floor, fighting. Red managed to escape underground but without a fang. He came back to Sssar and jumped on him, trying to cut a fang with his long sword, but the sword shattered. Sssar then turned to Red and bit him. Remember that he is a giant god snake: that hurts! Three of his fangs were deep inside Red's body, pouring poison, but the fourth one broke on the dagger Red had found in the nave. Grabbing the fang in one hand and the heart in the other, Red stabbed the heart, to saw Sssar melt and die. When it was done, only Dira remained on the floor, unarmed. And, instead of a heart, Red found a ring in his hand: the Ring of Fools!

Red and Dira left the place, went back to the tavern to tend to Red's wounds. The snake being dead, his venom lost all of its virulence and Red, solid has he is, healed in a mater of weeks. After that, they left this place and never came back.


Having killed the Monster, Red added a capability: he can now turn anyone into a fanatic. The combo looks a little bit too powerful to me but the rules giving much freedom on the narrative, it should be easy to prevent Red from overusing it.

Also he reached his Goal, so Red added some social power: he is now the prophet of a new, growing religion.


As you can see, there were a few mistakes here and there, and the game was as rushed as possible. At least it wasn't one single long combat. We will try to have a better adventure next time! Still, this one was really pleasant.

michael.

[Ron Edwards]

Hi,

The dice column is a bit of a joke on my part, fun when it works but also subject to inconvenience. You are perfectly free to place the dice horizontally on the table if you want to. Also, accidental toppling is not rules-mechanics toppling, so if it happens, put the dice back the way they were.

Your game looks like fun! Red is turning into a great character, and the visuals of his adventures make me happy, as an audience member, with all the sex and snakes.

I think you might benefit by not stressing and strategizing so much about the number of dice each person is getting. When you're the "I" player, concentrate most on playing the Lover, the Monster, and other characters, and less about opposing or combating the other person. You'll get to the total number eventually, quickly or slowly as you feel, and that is OK. If you want to bring productive tension to the other player's experience, then there are lots of ways to do this without simply attack-attack-attack to rush through the Match. I would prefer to let the two of you discover these methods on your own.

On a related rules point, I may have mis-read you or you have written it too quickly, but as your post is written, you two are giving away too much at the Climax: the "you" player gets a victory option for every  two full Good Dice, not for each one. So Red gets two options (in addition to the Goal), not four!

Best, Ron

[shlo]

Well actually Red had six Good Dice, my lowest die was 1 and he had six dice above that. So that's three options and not four  or two. I said four because I had the Goal in mind, but it was an automatic (and free) success since Red won the Match.

I agree that the Lover is too much absent from the story. It was the same for Virno's adventure. I guess we don't spend enough time when preparing the setting, and it's hard to improvise a character like the Lover on the fly. And of course the Match comes much too soon, we don't have time to explore a relationship between Hero and Lover. Also for my next Monster I should try something more human, with social power, and opportunities to talk with the Hero.

I think we'll keep using horizontal dice, because our dice are small ones. =)

michael.

[Ron Edwards]

I realized I forgot to answer this question:

When I read the conditions to begin the Match, I'm not sure anymore if the Go that triggers the Match gives a die. Does the Match start AFTER this Go, thus giving the other player the opportunity to get the first die?

The Go that triggers the Match does give a die.

You're right, I mis-read both the dice and your phrasing - if you include the Goal, Dave did get all four things.

I'm interested in why Vrno's second adventure was so unsatisfying. Lyonesse vs. Conan doesn't make sense to me as a criticism, as both are perfectly viable inspirations for S/Lay w/Me. Your post also implies that more was unsatisfying than mere genre convention - "a bad taste in the mouth" is pretty strong language. You might want to point out to Dave that this game is intended to bring pleasure to both participants.

I mentioned that trying to match paces isn't really the best tactic for an enjoyable game, and I think it'll be useful to state what is: to honor the fiction each person has presented. If one person describes a cool action with lots of potential, and the second attacks him with a hammer-wielding troll, the first responds with interesting dialogue directed toward the Lover, and the second attacks him with a hammer-wielding troll, and the first uses his Goal to open a portal in time and space, and the second attacks him with a hammer- ...

You see my point, I hope: the second person is playing badly not because he's rushing, not because he's not matching the pace, but because he's simply playing badly. He's not listening to what the other person says and developing it into phantasmagoria.

From the text: "We always build upon what has previously been stated." Every word in that sentence is carefully chosen.

We = both of us, not one of us
always = means always, every single time anyone says anything
build upon = develop, change, reveal, deepen, extend - not "repeat"
what = a character, an event, information, location, even metaphysics
has previously = prior to the current turn
been stated = said out loud, not imagined privately or planned

One another thing: in Red's second adventure, that particular combination of traits for the Monster + that particular combination of traits for the Lover is damned fun, isn't it?

Best, Ron

[shlo]

Thank for the reply about the Go that triggers the Match.  That's how we played it, but I had a doubt when reading the rules again.

I'm not going to detail why the game with Virno was not satisfying because it's a mere misunderstanding between Dave and me and I'm sure we're going to solve this, we already exchanged thoughts afterward. There's nothing to blame your game for.

I do love Lyonesse but that's not what I want when we are playing S/Lay w/Me, I would rather use Dying Earth for such a setting. With S/Lay I want, it's Conan or Elric I have in mind. So you are right, it wasn't a criticism but rather a feeling.

It really looked like the hammed-wielding troll you described, only it was several ax-wielding minotaurs, a bit too much for my poor scholar. This part was simply badly played, as you said, but I'll sort this out with Dave. I guess I have been GMing too much and we're both a little bit rusty when switching roles.

Sorry I'm not following you, what combination of traits are you talking of? The fact that Monster and Lover were the same person? Or the scores I gave them? Both?

michael.

[Ron Edwards]

... the Monster would kill fast, up-front, savagely and singly. The Lover would be wanton, approved, manipulative and knowledgeable.

This is what I was talking about. Merely reading that is exciting.

Best, Ron

[shlo]

That's an excellent menu indeed, something you would like to read on the back cover of a Sword & Sorcery novel! That's why I really need to spend more time to develop both Monster and Lover, if only to try to keep up with those expectations, because it's easy to forget the list during play.

You did really well with those options, this checklist is a sure way to tell "I" what is expected and what is not. It reminds me of the list of ingredients to be found in a Dying Earth story: "you want your story to look like one of the original stories? Just make sure you integrate those five things." It's not easy to provide such a list, first you have to be able to put your finger on the exact components of the genre you want to emulate.

michael.