Alphagraphics has been doing some serious ball-dropping (http://glyphpress.com/talk/) with reprinting Shock:
I was pretty happy with where we were at before, when they were RPI. I thought a reprint would be easy. Instead, it's cost me lots and lots of time and possibly money I really can't spare right now. They've got my money and I don't have books I can sell.
Unfortunately, the measure of a printer is often in how well they make good on mistakes. So far, no good has been made. I'll post here anew if they make good unexpectedly, but in the meantime, I'm recommending against them.
Now I'm looking for a new printer. Shock:s form factor is Lulu-friendly, but they don't offer enough options. I'm looking for a printer who can:
- print 7.5" x 7.5"
- do matte laminates or varnishes on the cover
- use specific stocks for cover and text block
Any recommendations?
Bully Pulpit Games' experience echoes yours so far. We're sticking with them through our immediate print run but then, who knows. If you find somebody reliable let us know.
One potentially good thing about Alphagraphics is that they have the capability to print cards - they are, in fact, printing and shrinking the cards for our current run of The Roach, so we'll let everybody know how that turns out. Our (new, sigh) rep sent us some samples of decks of cards - on laminate stock with a nice heft, rounded corners, standard 2.5 by 3.5 dimensions, and they look great. We're still waiting for a quote on that stuff.
Hi there,
This was the topic of a relatively recent thread, Problems with RPI/Alphagraphics? (http://www.indie-rpgs.com/forum/index.php?topic=21618.0). I made some strong recommendations in it.
Best, Ron
Josh: is your rep still Larry McGoff? We had problems with Will Sinclair after the transition, mostly in the form of communication breakdowns and really slow progress on our reprint. Ultimately, I had a conversation with Reid Baker, who is (I assume) Will's manager. After that, Will's focus was better and he's been much more responsive and helpful. It's unfortunate that it has to be like that, but maybe talking to Reid will get things straightened out for you as well.
Failing that, Ron's points in the other thread are solid. I used the bid request system at printindustry.com and got a number of quotes, ranging from impressive to ridiculous. Ultimately, we're continuing with Alphagraphics for now.
Larry retired when Alphagraphics took over. I'm using a guy named Jim Namba, who's really not asking enough questions. I should have a proof of the new books by Monday or so; since they lost all my info from before, we're basically starting the project over again, so I need to know what it is that they're making.
I only got one response from the printindustry.com thing and it was prohibitive.
We got about 4 or 5 responses from printindustry, and of those only two were really competitive with Alphagraphics. Those quotes were from Publisher's Graphics (http://pubgraphics.com) and Fidlar Doubleday (http://fidlar-doubleday.com). The others might be more reasonable with higher print runs.
Publishers Graphics did excellent work for me under very adverse conditions; I called them in a frenzy, basically "do this now, my way or don't." They have continued to do so under more normal conditions too.
Joshua, I dunno what to tell you except that sticking with a printer under the conditions you've described borders on, or has crossed the border into, idiotic. I'm being blunt because you are (lovably)stubborn.
Best, Ron
My recent experience (I just got off the phone) with Publishers Graphics has led me to think that they'll do a much better job than Alphagraphics is doing.
I say this because I just got a proof from Alphagraphics and it's total crap.
Quote from: Joshua A.C. Newman on November 30, 2006, 05:29:24 PM
I say this because I just got a proof from Alphagraphics and it's total crap.
Crap how? (If you plan to dissect its crapness on your blog or something, that's cool, but I'd love a link)
Fred:
The "matte" laminate is shiny as a mirror. The spine is not only off by a quarter inch, but wrinkled. The cover is extremely curled.
The curling covers are a frequent problem. I don't know why. A couple of the first run were really bad and I put them in a stack for months to get them flat. But it's just terrible. I can't sign off on these.
My rep has been extremely conciliatory. I'm supposed to get some laminate samples tomorrow. If they're good, I'm going ahead with this print run. That'll buy me time to switch to Publisher's Graphics and Fidlar for the next run.
Final update: After screwing up shipping and laminating a piece of paper fiber into a cover, they're dropped and supposedly I'll be receiving a refund check in the near future. We'll see how that goes.
I've received attractive quotes from both Fidlar Doubleday and Publisher's Graphics. I'll start a new thread when I have proofs to discuss.
I've heard good things about Avalon Team (www.avalonteam.com) in the past but never used them myself. Their website infers that they can create books at any size you like. It might be worth contacting them for a quote.
Ash
Quote from: Joshua A.C. Newman on December 06, 2006, 05:58:50 AM
The curling covers are a frequent problem. I don't know why. A couple of the first run were really bad and I put them in a stack for months to get them flat. But it's just terrible. I can't sign off on these.
The curling problem is caused by humidity. The cover stock swells as it sucks in moisture while the plastic doesn't. It's a very annoying problem. What you did with pressing is the answer. There is another fix but it costs more. If they can lamiate the inside and outside of the cover it ends the curling problem. They will have to trim out the film at the spine (which isn't that hard to do) so the cover won't pop off. This is how I do paper backs now. The result is a tough serviceable book.
Good luck with the printing!
Chris Engle
Hamster Press = Engle Matrix Games