Lots o' games

[Kirk Mitchell]

Ok. I have a game that when I finish I want to publish commercially. It is fairly short and rules lite, but I plan to have a fair amount of artwork and short stories in it. However, I have another game that when I finish I want to publish commercially. It is fairly short and rules lite, but I plan to have a fair amount of artwork and short stories in it. But wait, I have an idea for a game that when...

All of the concepts for games that I have are ones that I have gone through and thought about, knocked up some rules for and gotten a basic feel of, not just ones that I just decided to make out of whim.

I intend on developing all of them to be published commercially. However, as a said, they are all fairly short rules wise, but can be fleshed out with artwork and stories. The rules for some may end up having to be longer and made a product on their own but for the moment I want to just consider the shorter ones.

I have been thinking, that the games could be available on line in PDF format, but could also be available in an anthology in PDF or printed. Any thoughts? What is the commercial viability of bizarre and obscure little paperback games on their own? And does anybody take those tiny little 1+ page games that you can find on the internet seriously? And I don't mean any criticism to those who do make little games, because some you have some really awesome ideas.

Kirk

[Ron Edwards]

Hi Kirk,

How short is short? Your descriptions of your games put them well above 36 pages, given art and stories or so, right? But then you seem to shift gears to 1-pagers. So I'm having a hard time understanding what you're asking about.

Also, by "published commercially," what do you mean? I presume you mean a physical product (book, whether perfect bound or stapled), but do you also mean distributed in game stores?

And finally, by "take seriously," well ... I guess that means nothing to me at all. Are you asking whether people can be expected to pay?

Best,
Ron

[Luke]

Hi Kirk,

if I were you (and I am not), I would focus on one idea. I would put into some kind of distributable format (tape-bound photocopies with black  covers are my favorite form of low budget books). I would then take that solid piece of game with me everywhere I go for a year or two and force everyone I know (and some people I don't know) to play it with me. I would play no other game but that game. People would love my game. It would be great (I hope).

During the 12-24 months of constant play, I would take notes and revise my game.

At the end of those 12-24 months, if I still liked my game I would revise it again, put it down and then come back to it in six months. Then I would pick it up and reread it. If it still made sense and I still liked it, I would "publish" it for free or very cheap (pdf and/or POD). I would then go to all conventions and game stores and cheerfully make people play with me the greatest, most awesome game they have never played.

After another year or two of that, I'd perhaps do a traditional press run with new art and additional revisions to satisfy the demands of the raging fanbase that I/you have built up through our tireless efforts to promote your game.

After that, it's retirement, interviews and lecture circuit.

Again, I am not you, so the above model might not work for you.
-Luke

[Kirk Mitchell]

Ron:

Yeah, above 36 pages would be about right for my games. I was probably exaggerating when I said 1 pagers, but what I meant was can people be expected to pay (either PDF or POD) for small rules light games, especially considering the amount on the internet for free. "Commercially" I meant to sell, either PDF or POD.

Luke:

Sounds good, but I really have a hard time sticking with just one idea or game. Maybe during that 6 month period that you set it aside a new game could be developed. Sounds cool though, I might just try something like that (it might help to keep my mind on the game, and not wander off towards the next shiny light that I see).

I seem to spend a lot of time explaining myself. I think I really need to start thinking more carefully about how I say things.

Thanks,
Kirk

[Valamir]

Sounds good, but I really have a hard time sticking with just one idea or game. Maybe during that 6 month period that you set it aside a new game could be developed. Sounds cool though, I might just try something like that (it might help to keep my mind on the game, and not wander off towards the next shiny light that I see).

The secret to solve that is spending money.  Hire an artist, work up some initial layouts with a layout guy, hire an editor to edit your draft, do some web based advertising, Whatever.  When your $600, $800, $1200 in the hole on game A, its amazingly easy to stay focused on completing game A and not getting distracted by other shiny things.

[smokewolf]

To give you an idea...

I did a 240 page game, published POD for $25.99 and PDF for $15 and it is selling well. Mind you it is not even D20. I started selling it in December and within 3 months I was in to a profit with it. I have already had my 2nd POD printing and at the end of June will be doing a third.

Check out www.RPGNOW.com for other examples of games and the prices they are selling for. They even have an e-publishers forumn setup where you can talk to other pdf publishers. They also do the POD with no setup fee, just pay per copy. The 240 page, perfect bound with 4 color cover costs me $7.20. A little high, but without the setup fee its worth it.

I would advice not giving away everything for free though. Even if one person purchases it, thats more money you would make than if you gave it away. Now if you do, lets say 5 of these short game, you might want to offer one for free and charge for the others. But there is no reason not to make some money at it now. If you give them away, you will not make a dime.

[Kirk Mitchell]

Valamir, that would be really great, except for the fact that I have no money. Sure, I have a bit (not much at all), but is in tiny little Australian dollars. I certainly don't have any to spend on gaming.

I'll check out RPGNOW in the meantime.

Kirk