[Donjon] Abortive First Attempt

[Luke Sineath]

First of all, we used d6s, because we didnt' have d20s in quantity (I have one).  d6s really do not work!  

One of the players was my girlfriend, who has never gamed before.  I talked her into trying Donjon because I thought it would be accesible to her.  After all, she likes to play video game RPGs, particularly Final Fantasy.  So, when she was creating her character, I suggested that she use a character from any FF game to model from.  But she actually didn't go for that.  Instead, this is what she came up with:

Canae, the dog person!
Virility: 1
Cerebrality: 3
Discernment: 6
Adroitness: 1
Wherewithal: 2
Sociality: 3

Abilities
Learn new Tricks*
Fend off physical attacks
Catch stuff in the air
Find stuff in the ground
Bite people

For possessions, she chose Brass Teeth (weapon) Fur suit (armor), and a barrell, like St. Bernards wear (I gave her +2 on provision rolls with this...probably a bit generous.)

*Learn New Tricks was inspired somewhat by Final Fantasy: in particular, the Enemy Skill materia from FFVII.  We decided that, any time an enemy used an Ability, she could spend an action to attempt to Learn that Ability.  If she did learn it, she would only have one die in the new ability.

I really liked this character...it was neat seeing what she came up with.  Unfortunately, she really didn't get into the gaming aspect at all.  She just doesn't get role-playing.  

The other person who played is an experienced gamer.  He decided to make a psychic duck:

Frank, he psychic duck!
Virility: 3
Cerebrality: 5
Discernment: 3
Adroitness: 6
Wherewithal: 3
Sociality: 4

Abilities
Psionics (Magic words: bend, mind, control, read)
Swimming
Flying
Distraction
Karate

I was a bit concerned that his secondary abilities were too general, but really, I can't think of a subset of "flying."  I was prepared to let Psionics be just a general ability, without Magic Words, but he really wanted them.  My thinking was that Psionics ought to work differently from Magic, and that Gathering Magic Power doesn't make sense in the context of Psionics (what are you gathering, exactly?)  I I figured that Psionics could just be used like any other Ability: if Frank the Psychic Duck wanted to control the mind of a goblin, I would have had him roll Psionics + Cerebrality vs. the Goblin's Cerebrality + Save v. Confusion.  

Both of them opted to roll their stats, rather than allot 21 points.  

I started running "A Fungus Among Us."  I described the basic setting, e.g., the town of Amerla, and the Crimson Forest ("inhabited by horrible goblins and wolves"...and my girlfriend immediately stated that she did not want to go into the Forest at all!)  They entered the tavern, where they saw a burly man drinking ale and a strange hooded figure.  Soon someone entered, screaming, "They stole the Gem!"  A bit of conversation ensued, and they were directed to Grizzold's mansion.  Grizzold was a short old man with a beard down to his knees.  They questioned him a bit, and he told them that it appeared that goblins stole the gem, with help from the Mushroom people.  The floor was covered with pollen and spores, and they could see several three-toed footprints.  Frank the Psychic Duck pulled out a broom and dustpan and swept up some of the spores, thinking he might use them later (we started to do a Provisions roll for this, but I figured Grizzold had that stuff lying around.)  

When Grizzold mentioned that the tracks led into the Forest, my girlfriend once again reiterated that she did not want to go into the Forest, because it is scary!  I asked her what she wanted to do, and she said she was just along for the ride...This was a sticky point, because the Hook here is that the characters should go into the forest to retrieve the gem, but she didn't want to.  

So the players went back to the Tavern to talk to some folks.  Frank the Psychic Duck tried to recruit the burly man they saw earlier, to no avail.  He then went out and flew into the air, then searched about.  He used his successes to state that he saw the hooded man from earlier walking into the forest.  He then started gathering magical power and then we quit playing.  

So that was that!  It doesn't look like my GF will be playing again.  But my friend is really turned onto Donjon now.  He was only marginally interested beforehand, when I has talked about the game with him.  But after making a character and playing with the system a little bit, he's all about it.  We'll probably play again soon.

[Christopher Weeks]

Psionics (Magic words: bend, mind, control, read)
Swimming
Flying
Distraction
Karate

I was a bit concerned that his secondary abilities were too general, but really, I can't think of a subset of "flying."  I was prepared to let Psionics be just a general ability, without Magic Words, but he really wanted them.  My thinking was that Psionics ought to work differently from Magic, and that Gathering Magic Power doesn't make sense in the context of Psionics (what are you gathering, exactly?)

Well, I think the point is that it doesn't need to be a logical subset of flying so much as a discrete function.  Using flying for recon is fine and give the player access to a method of fact generation.  But the he can't also use it to swoop into battle and gain extra dice like a charge.  Swimming might be fine as is, but you need to watch for the same kind of overuse.  I think distraction and especially karate are too wide.  Consider "karate" v. "chop enemies with hand."  The latter is the scale that it should have.  Is it "distract enemies in combat" or "distract merchants" or what?

And I think your friend was right about using the magic system.  First, it's nifty and fun to use and it's easy to make it up for psionics.  And you're gathering concentration, or mental energy, or atuning yourself to the state of the ether, or whatever.

Sounds rough with the girlfriend!  Do you know what exactly she doesn't get?  Was she really just blocking the event because she didn't want to be there?  What does she do with a Final Fantasy game that only leads into a "scary" place?  Those games are even more linear than a Donjon adventure.

Chris

[Luke Sineath]

 I think distraction and especially karate are too wide.  Consider "karate" v. "chop enemies with hand."  The latter is the scale that it should have.  Is it "distract enemies in combat" or "distract merchants" or what?

I'll keep this in mind, and have him restrict Distraction next time we play.  As far as Karate goes, we agreed that it essentially is "chop enemes with hand:" Karate is merely a form of hand to hand combat.  So, we're being precise with the use of "Karate;" it doesn't mean the same as "martial arts" in this context.

Sounds rough with the girlfriend!  Do you know what exactly she doesn't get?  Was she really just blocking the event because she didn't want to be there?  What does she do with a Final Fantasy game that only leads into a "scary" place?  Those games are even more linear than a Donjon adventure.

Chris

Well, even though she agreed to try it, she really didn't "go along" with it.  I think she just decided from the outset that she wouldn't like it...which is too bad.  She never actually played "make-believe" when she was a kid, either, which is unusual.  It's interesting, though, that she didn't have any problems with character creation.

[Christopher Weeks]

 I think distraction and especially karate are too wide.  Consider "karate" v. "chop enemies with hand."  The latter is the scale that it should have.

As far as Karate goes, we agreed that it essentially is "chop enemes with hand:" Karate is merely a form of hand to hand combat.  So, we're being precise with the use of "Karate;" it doesn't mean the same as "martial arts" in this context.

I think as long as it can't be used for both attacks and defensive moves (or anything else -- looking cool, healing, mastering mind-controlling magics), you're OK.

Chris

[TonyLB]

This was a sticky point, because the Hook here is that the characters should go into the forest to retrieve the gem, but she didn't want to.

Well... yeah.  I wouldn't want to either.

It sounds like... heh... this is so common an answer on the Forge I can barely manage to type it without laughing... it sounds like an issue of poor communication about the social contract, and possibly creative agendas.

I don't know Donjon as well as I'd like, but the characters and situation make it sound as if it's a somewhat tongue-in-cheek game.  Maybe your girlfriend just needed to be told that.

"There are going to be certain situations that scream 'No sane person would do this!'... and those are the things that these type of characters throw themselves into.  They're crazy.  They're supposed to be that way.  Do you think you'd find it fun playing that sort of lunatic?"

Just my two cents.  Hope it helps.

[Luke Sineath]

It sounds like... heh... this is so common an answer on the Forge I can barely manage to type it without laughing... it sounds like an issue of poor communication about the social contract, and possibly creative agendas.

Perhaps...she definitely doesn't understand why people role-play, or what people do when they role-play.  And she said later that she felt stupid, that she just isn't "good at" roleplaying.  So I'm thinking that the issues here are "prior" to ones about social contract et al.  The issue is understanding the Project at all.  

Luckily, she's not uncomfortable with the fact that I play role-playing games.  I probably shouldn't have railroaded the game into Playing the Adventure, and just let her explore  what she wanted.  Hopefully there will be a next time!

[Callan S.]

I'm thinking she needs some structure, one which has a clear goal. Remember, you've roleplayed for a long time, you may have forgotten that some people enjoy an activity by winning and/or being good at winning. No way of winning = lack of enjoyment.

Just set up a goal, set up various stepping stones toward it. And I'd seriously recommend giving a point value to each stone and a win value required to reach the goal. Sound ghastly to you as a RP'er? That's okay, were not trying to please you, just her. The best bet is to break her in slowly with various approach methods to the stepping stones/mini missions. The opening up of approach vectors will probably blow her mind eventually.

Last note: It might sound like some call to the forrest is a goal. Not really, you gave a choice about it. Video games don't do this and in RP scene framing is a buetiful art. Well, that's what I think anyway.