[Arc Dream Publishing] Wow!

[Ron Edwards]

I have just been the recipient of the single most admirable (financial) act I've ever witnessed or heard of in role-playing publishing.

Over a year ago, one of the companies which committed to primary sponsorship of the Forge Booth at GenCon 2003 was Arc Dream Publishing, specifically Dennis Detwiller and Shane Ivey. To make a long story short, I did not receive the $600 share they committed, nor did the company appear at GenCon, all of which occurred right up to the wire before the con. Dennis and Shane did promise me that they would pay the money.

That is not chump change in small press RPG Publishing. For many small companies, it's a deal-breaking amount, although not for Adept fortunately (for those who are interested, Adept rests on a nice cushion of a couple-three thousand bucks most of the time, based on ongoing profits and their relation to expenses).

I didn't hold my breath about getting repaid. I've seen too many minor debts appear and sort of fade into the small-press Bermuda Triangle, and by "small press" I include nearly anyone who's ever published a role-playing game of any kind.

I also decided not to make a big stink about it publicly either, as (a) it wasn't as if Arc Dream did attend GenCon and then reneged, and (b) it seems out of my place, as a person, to respond in any way besides simply avoiding doing business with them again.

Yesterday, I received an envelope from Arc Dream in my Adept Press P.O. box. It contained a professional, well-phrased letter from Shane and a check to me for $600.

I'm still reeling. It would have been so easy and, quite likely to many people's thinking, justified for Shane and Dennis to say, "Hey, we didn't even go to GenCon, so we really owe nothing." It is a demonstration of pure integrity - we promised it, so here it is.

I am also aware that you are similarly recompensing other folks who've worked with you in the past.

My heartfelt thanks, guys.

I ask that anyone who's interested please visit the Arc Dream website, do a little browsing and downloading, and please consider their products and programs. My review of Godlike is also available, perhaps as a basis for new discussions with others who've played the game.

Best,
Ron

[indiedog]

Hey, congratulations. I can imagine it feels nice to have $600 checks via post. :)

[Widener]

Wow, that is very cool. Good on them!

I wrote over 15,000 words for the Godlike Will to Power book, even got name credit on the cover, and never received payment for my work. I was a little bummed at first, but I considered it learning experience and was honestly just thrilled to get published. I know they were having financial issues at the time, so I didn't press it. I really like that game and just consider it a gift from me to them.

But then I wrote about 7,000 words for the new All Flesh Must Be Eaten Players Guide, and I didn't get writing credit (a special thanks, instead) OR get paid. Now I'm wondering if this industry is run on people doing free work. I mean, I love gaming and writing but it seems a little wrong to give away all your work. I don't know if I have the time to do that! I don't want to seem like I'm bitching; in all honesty, I didn't sign any contract, nor do I feel ripped off. I'm just at the point where I want to be rewarded for my work.

That's why I've decided to create, write, and publish my own game. That way I know I'll get paid.

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

Hey Widener - guess what? You are being ripped off and you are being screwed. And yes, much of the so-called industry does operate on a routine basis of screwing over the people who produce The Material for them. The means to do so are diverse and have well-known parallels in the film and comics businesses. A great deal of them rely on tricks like points and royalties, which rely on profiting eventually from the work and can be elided through cunning bookkeeping.

Role-playing, however, includes this nifty twist as well: I have been continually astounded at how many people sheepishly admit that they have not been paid for work they delivered to a given company (or several), and then say, "Well, I won't complain, because that'll get me a bad reputation, maybe." My reaction to this is always disgusted horror - what point is keeping a good reputation among assholes who don't pay you?

And contract, schmontract. We are talking about basic business ethics. If they said they were gonna pay you, and they didn't, then fuck them in the ear. "Out" them to your fellows, never work for them again, and find which companies will pay you up front for the work you do. Some of us do that, you see.

I hope Arc Dream comes through for you. My impression is that they are making a serious effort to do so for everyone who's worked with them, so I specifically exclude them from my above comments.

Best,
Ron

[Widener]

Thanks, Ron. I think I'm done writing for other people, though. I'm just going to putter away doing my own thing and self publish, reputation be damned. I'd like to be able to pay rent!

[daMoose_Neo]

I will concur with Ron.
It was almost shocking to people back when I was looking for my initial artists for Twilight, stating up front they WOULD be paid, had artists who could testify they were paid and then, guess what, they were paid!
After that, I will sheepishly admit, I have a studio who produced some artwork for the expansion who have yet to be paid in full. Money is slowly building for them, but my only way to get it to them is to wire it (They're in Poland, me in Michigan!), which costs me $40 per transaction :P So, I made sure no more work was being done until I caught them up, and I won't ask for more work until it is.

Artists or writers, look for peeps who are reliable and who do take care of their contributors. I make sure my artists get the recognition and payment they're deserved and when possible drive them traffic to them at Cons (At GenCon I got one of my artists a fair bit of business for his shirts and smaller prints this way, and he sent some new gamers my way as well!)
And guys, authors, take care of your contributors! It pays you back in so many ways! My artists whom I regularly use have no problem right now doing a piece at a drop of a hat, because they know in quick order they'll be paid up. Plus, they're better and quicker about revisions and redo's. AND, if this isn't enough, the quality of the pieces draws attention as well, AND because of how the game turned out I have people agreeing to contribute a piece or two to later sets to get their name included because they believe it is a fair investment.

Making sure paychecks get to where they are is a good thing for everyone and helps publishers more than most can guess!

[Paul Czege]

...but my only way to get it to them is to wire it (They're in Poland, me in Michigan!), which costs me $40 per transaction

Have you looked into Western Union International Money Orders? I believe they'd be substantially more reasonable.

Paul

[jdagna]

I'm not sure what's off-topic for this post, but...

Widener, I'd highly recommend sending the companies that owe you money a bill.  State who you contracted with, how much the bill is for, when it was originally due (with an aging chart to show how past due it is).  Send two copies of the bill every month (one by mail, one by fax), for up to three months.  On the fourth month, send the bill with a note stating that they have until x date (say a month from the date you send it) to resolve the unpaid debt before you send it on to collections.  This, combined with several phone calls and a reminder letter just before the deadline, can often work wonders.  If there's no response, look around for collections agencies in their state.  Many will take the job on with no up-front cost and may only take 30% to 50% of the amount they collect (and half of what you're owed is better than nothing).  However, many companies will pay before letting it go that far.  (This technique recovered well over $1500 that I'd basically given up on, from several of my old web design/hosting clients.)  This is especially effective if you do a little calling around and find out the name of the person who writes the checks for the company, and address it directly to them.  Never just shrug it off and chalk it up to getting known... because when a future company checks your references, they may very learn that you can be made to work for free.

daMoose_Neo, there are some other ways to transfer money cheaply.  Citibank has a program where a debit card is tied to an account.  You deposit money into the account (with no fee) and the owner of the account (your contributor) can use the card like a credit card (no fee to him) or as an ATM card (very small fees to him).  It handles currency conversion automatically, like any credit card, and does not require the person to have a bank account or anything else.

[Jonathan Walton]

There is always some risk to whoever puts up their half of the bargain first.  I've often done preliminary web design work on a project and then never gotten paid because the client changes their mind and decides to do something completely different, with someone else.  This has led me, when working with artists, to pay them everything up front.  With most of the artists I've worked with, like Antti and Hive, they have been fabulous at jumping through hoops and getting stuff done when I needed it.  However, I also have over $400 worth of artwork that's never shown up, due to the full schedule of another artists who took on more work than I think they could handle at the time.  No clue if I'll ever get that money back in any form, but that's just something I have to deal with.

Like any other business, good relationships rely on trust, communication, and fulfilling your part of the bargain in a timely fashion.  And that goes for anyone involved, whether you're talking about paying someone or turning in some work.

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

We should bring the issue of negotiating up-front payments and delivery of work to a new thread.

Thanks guys,
Ron

[daMoose_Neo]

Have you looked into Western Union International Money Orders? I believe they'd be substantially more reasonable.

Can't really say I have.
When setting up the arrangement with them, I asked for a couple possibilities and they gave me a webservice they normally use...and it was complicated as all get out, wanted physical photocopies of my credit card and would take almost a month to be authorized...and they needed the money quicker than that to take care of a few bills, so for the first batch of artwork I wired them~
Have to get on the horn with them again suppose...see about something else then...$100 every so often is better than nothing for a long time.

[Alex Jurkat]

<<But then I wrote about 7,000 words for the new All Flesh Must Be Eaten Players Guide, and I didn't get writing credit (a special thanks, instead) OR get paid. Now I'm wondering if this industry is run on people doing free work. I mean, I love gaming and writing but it seems a little wrong to give away all your work. I don't know if I have the time to do that! I don't want to seem like I'm bitching; in all honesty, I didn't sign any contract, nor do I feel ripped off. I'm just at the point where I want to be rewarded for my work.>>

I messed this one up.  When Matt first contacted us with his material, I thought it was great and forwarded over to our One of the Living author.  I also promised him writer's credit.  

Unfortunately, due to a series of delays, that book was over two years in the making.  I forgot about my promise in that time.  Once I got the materials from the primary author, I just accepted his special thanks mention of Matt (p. 11) and did not query whether Matt should be included in the contributing authors.  The author also informed that he no longer had Matt's email so we couldn't locate an address to send him a comp copy of the book (which was not promised but seemed like the right thing to do to me).  Matt noticed the material when the book came out, contacted me, and we sent him a book.

As Matt notes, Eden never promised to pay him.  The reality is that profit margins are razor thin (or nonexistent) in the RPG biz, and we have a very strict set of budget constraints.  One of the Living was always viewed as a product in which uncompensated contributors would play a large part.  I don't feel that Matt was mislead or "ripped off" and my impression was that Matt did not feel that way either.

We take pride in being a place where new creators can get published.  We let them know what they are getting into and they choose to contribute or not.  When we make promises, we do out best to fulfill them, even if it takes a bit of time to do so.

Thanks,
Alex Jurkat
Eden Studios
www.edenstudios.net

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

[This message was composed early yesterday afternoon; the brief Forge brown-out delayed its posting]

Matt and Alex, it's very simple, for you and any other publisher-contributor situation.

1. If the publisher promised or even implied payment, and didn't pay, then he is bad news. [Same goes for contributor who accepts payment and fails to deliver]

2. If you did not make any such promise or implication, then you are OK.

Resolving which is happening here is totally between the two of you. Your presentations differ. Each of you will have to make whatever professional decisions you make about that on your own.

The public side of such a discussion is important too, but I think each of you has presented exactly what you should, and so the public side is concluded, at least as far as this forum can handle it.

Best,
Ron

[Shane Ivey]

I'm obviously late to the discussion and don't want to make too much of it, but I do want to defend Arc Dream where possible.

Matt wrote his sizeable and excellent chunk of "Will to Power" for Hobgoblynn Press, not Arc Dream Publishing. After Dennis and I formed Arc Dream we bought the remaining stock of Godlike and Will to Power from Hobgoblynn and took over publishing those books; but any outstanding debts from the production of those books are Hobgoblynn's, not ours.

Now, we've heard stories like Matt's, and it has been our intent all along to use profits made by Arc Dream to compensate any contributors to Will to Power who haven't been paid for their work. Why? Because we hate people not getting paid for their work, and we don't want our signature property to have that kind of stain, no matter how it got there.

Unfortunately, seeing profit from Arc Dream has been a -- ahem -- challenge, and obviously we have to pay our own debts before we pay someone else's. So, months tick along. And it takes a year to repay Ron for his goodwill. And we're taking our own sweet time on Wild Talents, a killer game that EVERYONE wants to see, because generating the print funds is so slooooow. And so on.

Anyway, Matt, the stuff you did for Godlike was first-rate, and I look forward to seeing what else you do. And Ron, thanks for the kind words. I'm glad we could finally do right by you.