[Take1] New Idea?

[Jamfke]

Okay, this is my first post here at the forge.  I've lurked for some time now, and I have been working on my own game for years.  Well, I've had the idea for years, and am just now getting things written up.

Anywho, here's my idea.

Take 1.  This is an action oriented RPG that places the characters, who are up and coming actors/actresses in a position of survival.  They have signed a contract with a little known production studio and are locked into making an undisclosed amount of films over a period of five years.  The thing is, they go into their dressing rooms and find their costumes and props for their first film, and a bio of the character they are to portray.  Once they are dressed and ready, they step out of their dressing room into the film.  Seriously into the film.  It becomes their reality, and they must make it through the film in order to get paid in the end.

I believe this classifies the game as multi-genre, as each time they appear in a movie, it can be in a totally different setting.  Like going from filming a Western, straight to a Sci-Fi flick.

The mechanic is a simple 2d10 + skill level + attribute vs. target number.  The roll of 10s explode.

My questions:

• Is this idea unique enough to pursue?
• If so, is it something you think a lot of people would be interested in?
• Is the mechanic too simple?
• Or is it too much for quick resolutions?

I'd appreciate some honest opinions here.  Thanks in advance for any ideas!

[Shreyas Sampat]

This is going to sound like a non-answer, I fear, but it's not intended that way.

1- The uniqueness of the idea isn't what makes it worthy or unworthy of pursual, and I don't pretend to be able to say what does. However, I think that you've got a good seed for a survival-horror game. Is that the mood you were intending? It seems like the setup you have going is one where it would pay to have a strong, overarching mood that keeps the cosmetically-disparate movie segments connected.

3- Frankly, a dice equation doesn't really provide a lot of information about the mechanical workings of a game; think about the ways that White Wolf uses a (more or less) constant dice mechanic to derive noticeably different effects in Vampire, Exalted, and Aberrant, by manipulating the factors that surround that mechanic. Further, what's "too simple" mean? Without some clear accounting of your design goals, it's impossible to answer this question.

[Jamfke]

Sorry!  Like I said, I'm new to all this.  Anyways, the vibe isn't actually horror oriented, though a film could center around that element.  This is focused more on a twisted Twilight Zone kind of idea where the characters are themselves, but they must portray the parts they've been given until the end of the film.  I'm seeing it as a kind of mix between that movie John Ritter was in, 'Stay Tuned' I think it was, and the old D&D cartoon.

I'll go into more detail with the  mechanics a bit later.

[Rob Carriere]

OK, that helps. So here are some more questions. :-)

Are you thinking of a game where the focus is on the game as a unified whole (what Shreyas is saying) or are you thinking of a game that is a series of "independent" episodes--one for each movie--with the same characters featuring in all of them? Or some intermediate form?

Second question: how are you seeing these movies, as the audience will see them in the theater, or as the actors will see them during the shoot? "Take 1" seems to imply the latter, but your description looks more like the former.

SR
--

[Gordon C. Landis]

Hi Jamfke, and welcome to the Forge!

As a quick reaction - previous games to look at include Exterme Vengence, Dream Park, and maybe the Hong Kong Action Theatre! games (I understand the two editions of HKAT are very different, and while I briefly played one of 'em, I'm not sure which edition it was . . . )  Robots and Rapiers might be interesting to look at too, depending on how you plan to treat how the actors relate to their roles - which seems like a key design question to me.  Of course, Robots and Rapiers is currently only available as a "preview edition" from last year's GenCon . . . but there's been some discussion of it here at the Forge, so a search should turn up some interesting threads.

Fiction that spings to mind are the books Heroes Die and Blade of Tyshalle by Matthew Woodring Stover - but maybe that's just because I've always thought they contained interesting RPG posibilities.  Still, that actor/role relationship is a key feature, so I leave them as food for thought anyway.

The main thing people here are likely to look for from you are the magic words Shreyas used - "what are your design goals?"  I mean, I could take any of a dozen systems out there - GURPS, say - and run the game you describe.  What is that you are going to design that makes using what you're going to come up with better than that? (BTW, I bet you really can come up with something much better than that - I'm not saying "don't bother with this" here, just loooking for focus on the specific value of your game.)  There're lots of possible ways to answer that question, including following the Structured Game Design sticky thread at the top of this forum.  But that info in some form is what folks here are going to need in order to be of the most help to you.

Using preview, I see there've been a few posts since I started typing . . . I'm not familiar with "Stay Tuned" - just what about it are you hoping the game will evoke?  And same question for the D&D cartoon.  As I recall, the charcaters there were (mostly) focused on escaping the world they were thrown into, and I'm not seeing how that would apply to the actors and movies situation of your setting.

[Jamfke]

OK, that helps. So here are some more questions. :-)

Are you thinking of a game where the focus is on the game as a unified whole (what Shreyas is saying) or are you thinking of a game that is a series of "independent" episodes--one for each movie--with the same characters featuring in all of them? Or some intermediate form?

Second question: how are you seeing these movies, as the audience will see them in the theater, or as the actors will see them during the shoot? "Take 1" seems to imply the latter, but your description looks more like the former.

SR
--

The game will be a series of "independent" episodes, as you say, that involve the characters struggling in the film world as they see it.  It will become a reality to them.  In my previous example, say the characters find themselves in a Western.  They each step out of their dressing rooms and BAM, they're on an old wooden sidewalk stepping out of the general store or the barber shop or saloon!  The "set" becomes a real town with the "extras" being the actual denizens of the town.

The adventures will be set up like a movie script telling what can happen in each scene.  The final scene is where the bad guys are trying to gun them down, the OK corral so to speak.  In order for the characters to get out of the film, they must either defeat the bad guys or be defeated.  How well they do determines how much money they receive after the film. 

Money will be the advancement points used to increase the character's talents.  They'll also be able to purchase some of the props they've used in the preceding films, and will be allowed to carry them into the next one.  Of course, if they use a six-shooter in merry ole England in a Robin Hoodesque film, they'll turn it into a B movie/most likely a comedy, and get less money in the end.

Each character will have a safety 'out' to use if they get into serious trouble.  If the Director tells them that the actions they are about to take could cost them their lives, the player may call for the character's stunt double.  The stunt double is a one time replacement for the character in deadly situations.  If the character used the stunt double in an honorable fashion, sacrificing oneself to save the others or an important NPC, then the stunt double will return at the end of the film.  Otherwise, the character must "hire" a new one by spending their earnings between films.

I hope this stuff isn't too silly sounding!

Thanks,
Jim

[knicknevin]

There's a good old British children's show called Mr. Benn, where each week the title character goes to a costume shop and tries on a different costume, but he leaves the changing room by a different door to the one he came in by and finds himself in a genre-related world (medieval fantasy, western, cavemen, space opera) and he can only get back when the door re-appears at the end of his adventure... I liked that show when I was younger, so I like this idea!
   What Traits/Attributes do the PCs have? Are they constant or do they change with each new scenario? Are they objective, so a PC survives on their 'real-world' capabilites? Or subjective, so they might have Traits like Action Hero, Exposition, Detective, Fantasy/SF, Comedy, Romance, etc?

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

Two other games you really ought to examine are It Came from the Late Late Late Show, and the Tales from the Crypt WEG game. Of the games mentioned so far, the one that comes closest to what you're describing is the first edition of Hong Kong Action Theater.

I recommend these to you not to say, "It's been done," but rather, "Learn from how they did it" so you can make the best design decisions for your game.

Best,
Ron

[Jamfke]

There's a good old British children's show called Mr. Benn, where each week the title character goes to a costume shop and tries on a different costume, but he leaves the changing room by a different door to the one he came in by and finds himself in a genre-related world (medieval fantasy, western, cavemen, space opera) and he can only get back when the door re-appears at the end of his adventure... I liked that show when I was younger, so I like this idea!
   What Traits/Attributes do the PCs have? Are they constant or do they change with each new scenario? Are they objective, so a PC survives on their 'real-world' capabilites? Or subjective, so they might have Traits like Action Hero, Exposition, Detective, Fantasy/SF, Comedy, Romance, etc?

Though I've never seen the show, this sounds identical to my idea! 

I have so far come up with a set of four attributes; Physique, Reason, Essence, and Persona.  The first three are randomly generated, and the fourth is gotten by averaging the first three.  Each attribute will range from 2 to 10, and I'm thinking I'll go with a random roll of 2d10 and drop the lowest die to get the score.  So far, this has generated scores between 5 and 8 as an average, and occasionally a roll below 3 or above 9.  Any suggestions to a better random technique would be appreciated. 

I'm calling skills 'Talents' to go along with the theme of the game, and they are the same through every adventure.  They are based on what the character knows in their real world outside the studios.  They can purchase new talent levels and new talents between films using the monies earned.  This reflects the D&D cartoon reference, where they are thrust into this new world and have to rely on their own wits to survive.  Talents will have skill levels ranging from 1 to 5, I believe.  Again, any better ideas are welcomed!

[Certified]

It sounds like game play is meant to be quick, so having a fast character creations sounds good, random dice rolls are good for that. Also, will Actors be able to start with talents at the beginning of the game or will they only be earned though play?
It sounds like the actors can at least to a limited degree interact with the "real world" or break the 4th Wall. Allowing them to buy props is the best example of this as it's been described so far. What this makes me think of is will characters have something akin to Fame? Something that would could grow or shrink after each film that would offer them some type of meta-control over the movie.
That is to say, a actor just out of school and fresh on the set is at the whim of the writer and director, making due as best he can, while a seasoned vet can "re-write" a scene if he doesn't like how it's going. Say in the cowboy example, the townspeople are trapped in the saloon, outnumbered and outgunned by outlaws only one of the actors is still up and gunning to save the town the others have been wounded, and things look bleak, suddenly the Calvary arrives driving off the outlaws. As the bewildered townsfolk wonder what happen one of the actors says "I wired the sheriff over in Dodge he's an ole friend of mine." Meaning that he used his fame to change the outcome.   

[Jamfke]

During character creation, the players will receive a number of character points to purchase some talents.  This will reflect real life experience.

I've been toying with the idea of fame points, but I'm weighing the options.