[Kry-Gothic] Questions about the RPG community + feedback on rule system

[boolean]

Hi all

A while back I found a ruleset for a table top wargame I started writing about 7 years ago on an old harddrive. After being poked and prodded I gave in and upload it onto a wiki page, pitching it as an open source real time table top wargame, where it got some really good feedback. Recently I started building a website for Kry-Gothic and just launched it yesterday, but I'm still a bit worried though as to wether this is a bit of a futile act. The amount of rule systems for table top rpg's and wargames is mind boggling, and even if the rule system is good, the chances of people actually downloading and reading the rules seems quite small. So I guess this post has two parts:

1. Even if I had a 10/10 rule system, is there really much chance of making some noise in the rpg community? Are there just too many out there for people to notice or care? Back when I was running webcomics promoting your product is easy, despite the fact that every single person on the net seems to run a webcomic. For them its easy because as soon as you visit the page BAM, the product is right there. In order to convince people to check out your rule system it seems to be asking a lot more of the visitor.

2. If people have some time to kill, maybe you could have a quick browse of the rules and let me know what your impression of it is. Some of the features (as briefly mentioned) are the fact that it is open source, allowing anyone and everyone to help develop and even sell the rule set. The gameplay is real-time through the use of an Action Point system, where both players actually play the game at the same time, owing to a much more tense style of play. There are Player and Developer rulesets where players can download and use a PDF version of the rules, while developers can focus on a moderated wiki page where changes are tied into the main website and forum. The rules are still in a very early beta mode. The main website can be found here

I appreciate any feedback on either of the two questions in this thread =)

[boolean]

Well, I guess I got my answer.

The sites only been up a few days, but maybe I should take it down. Just sucks a bit because I put so much work into it.

Oh well. I guess the market is just oversaturated, or the rule system just blows.

[greyorm]

Greetings boolean (do you have a real name we can call you by?),

I hope you do not consider this out of line, but I am going to give you some helpful advice: assuming the usual "speed-of-internet" is at work here is a mistake. It isn't. Here, the standard is to take time to post instead of just firing off replies. So you shouldn't assume outright anyone is ignoring you; perhaps they missed your first post (I did).

Or perhaps they are reading the rules and have nothing to contribute (and "whoa, cool man and that's all I have to say" posts are frowned upon here because they're empty of content)...or as you yourself pointed out, reading through rules and so forth require a higher investment and thus a longer period to develop feedback in.

Just because no one posted a reply does not mean your game lacks merit, it means it happened not to catch any interest right now. So, as appealing as it may be to indulge in, remember self-pity will get you nowhere on this site. If YOU love the product, if YOU think it is worth your time and energy, then it is.

However, the Forge will work much better for you if you have specific questions about your rules or design process, rather than "Here's my rules. Tell me what you think." So, do you have any specific points of your rules in your game you would like anyone to take a look at, questions about publishing and your design format, spreading the word about it, etc?

Specifcally in answer to question #1: if you poke around the forums here, you will discover the short answer is "no, the market is not oversaturated" or whatever that means. Notice the number of games developed and discussed on this site which are doing quite well, and the energy with which they are being embraced.

But this is a red herring, the real question is: does it really matter if it is oversaturated? Examine your reasons for your concerns about this and think about the reasons behind why it matters to you. Are you happy if two people play your game, or are you trying to compete with the big boys, hoping to become the next WotC or White Wolf with fame and accolade, and your name upon the lips of every gamer? What sorts of unrealistic expectations might you be carrying around?

Finally, you may not be receiving any response because this is a war game rather than an RPG. I don't know how many wargamers actively read the Forge, so you may just be appealing to the wrong market segment here -- yet another reason not to take the silence as an indication that your game is not worth while or the market can't bear it. Also, the Forge's specific focus is on RPGs, so you may also wish to privately ask the moderators whether or not your game is an appropriate topic here; I can't make that call.

[boolean]

Thanks for the reply greyorm :)

I'll keep working on the site then. I guess I'm just worried about investing so much time into something that may not get anywhere. But, like you said, "If YOU love the product, if YOU think it is worth your time and energy, then it is", and I really do think this rule system has potential. I think that what makes it tricky is that my site doesn't really move anywhere without a community due to the development model, so when I start seeing no community I get a little worried :)

But I’ll keep working on it and see where it takes me.

Thanks again greyorm.

[northerain]

I have a small suggestion about the website however. How about a small flash presentation(with illustrations) that gives the rundown of the rules in short and to the point phrases?
Like this: http://www.wizkidsgames.com/horrorclix/howtoplay.asp

[Rothe]

Hi boolean,
  Always interested in a new wargame.  You seem to have a tactical squad level game going here.  From a commercial perspective it has a long way to go, not so much on the formatting but on the exposition.  It does not feel complete.  I think what your doing is fine as a first draft but after getting out all your ideas a revision geared towards organzing the rules into sections might be in order. 
Correct me if I am wrong, but you are aiming for a tactical wargame?  If so don't be afraid to organize along the lines of wargames, i.e., numbered sections.

  Once you have things laid out, I'd suggest a section that takes you through creating a unit and play, that includes illustrations.  I guess this raises a question, how do you envision playing the game?  With miniatures, with counters?  I assume on some form of map.  Will it be hexagons, off-set squares, squares, etc.

  About the game market, yes it is a vast sea and your game could get lost but it needs to be finished, play tested and polished before you set sail.. Sadly, before you even set sail requires large amounts of work, so it has to be a labor of love IMHO.

  Personally from what I've seen so far it looks like an interesting game.  Initially, the setting turned me off but the Geiger-esque angle reminds me of the initial concet art for "Alien" (well not the initial, initial Chris Foss concept art ;) ).  It does seem like a game we always wanted to play with "Squad Leader" but never had the rules.

  I don't come to the Forge often but will remeber to look for this thread next time.

[boolean]

northerain: That is a fantastic idea. I'll have to look into that.

Rothe: Indeed it is a tactical squad level game, and yes PDF rules could do with some cleaning. The rule system is still in early stages though, which is being released at this stage because of the open development model. Rather than release a complete and finished system and then ask for feedback, I am trying to get a bare basic version up and develop the system with a group of like minded people. Because the rule system still has a fair way to go, the PDF version will get updated quite frequently and so formatting the PDF was put as a lower priority for a little while. Once the rules get more stable a prettier version will be released.

Thanks all =)