Hello Everyone

[TheAntiSummit]

Hi everyone.  I'm new here and this is my first post.  So, hi.  Now that I'm done with my little introduction, I'll get on with my question.

I stumbled across this place while doing research for a game I am creating whose initial conception was influenced in no small part by "Pirates of The Caribbean", but since then I have been watching other movies like "The Adventures of Robin Hood" with Eroll Flynn, "The Princess Bride", "The Man in The Iron Mask" and other musketeer movies, (as well as some truly strange ones like "The 13th Warrior" and "Crouching Tiger...") to try and really capture the swashbuckling style and feel of these kinds of movies in a game mechanic (I am mostly dealing with combat right now), and not just the same old "I hit you, you hit me" style of most standard games.  I think I have been doing a pretty good job and would be happy to share my progress with anyone interested (although right now I don't want to clutter the post so just e-mail me if you are interested) but I really have one specific question.  This is the biggest problem I have come across in the design process and I wanted to get some input and advice.  How do I deal with damage to specific areas (Body parts, limbs, etc.)?

I have considered several options, including simply allowing characters to direct their strikes to a specific area once they have hit (which is a much more difficult and involved thing than in something like DnD) but then I realized there is nothing to stop characters from simply lopping off heads and hands in every encounter, which would significantly detract from the feel I am going for (long elaborate duels cut short by the removal of an opponents head on the first strike simply isn't stylish) as does the unrealistic assumption that every blow lands squarely on your opponents chest.

 I have tried to make a percentile system, assuming that you have an unmodified (before taking into acount skill and circumstance on either side) fifty percent chance to hit a torso before any modifications, but that didn't work out.  Does anyone know of any material, free or otherwise, that has good rules I could use, borrow, or simply be inspired by for this sort of thing?  I would apreciate any help or suggestions offered.  Thanks alot.

The Anti Summit

[Brian Leybourne]

There are many games with good hit location mechanics (such as The Riddle of Steel) and there are many good swashbuckling games (such as The 7th Sea).

I can't offhand think of a game with both elements (but I'm sure someone else will be able to name 7 off the top of their head), but you could do a lot worse than checking both games out. TROS, at least, has a forum here at the Forge, and can certainly be played in a Swashbuckling manner).

Brian.

[greyorm]

For unmitigatedly cool cinematic swashbuckling action, you can check out Jolly Roger Games' "Swashbuckler." Really. It's awesome.

[iago]

The guy I designed Fate with (see my signature below for a link) and I are really deeply into swashbuckling-style action, and I think our "exchange based" combat option is pretty well suited to that kind of action.  If nothing else, we run through a bunch of ideas in our combat section, which might fit well into your research phase.  Check it out; it's free!

[Mike Holmes]

See also Zenobia. I recommend thins game because it does dramatic swashbuckling by having combat be mostly a positional sort of thing. Instead of I hit you, you hit me, it's a back and forth battle of position until one participant can finally deliver the final blow. This is totally in the cinematic style, wherin all combats are about continued fencing back and forth, perhaps with trivial "near miss" cuts for drama, but no real injuries until the telling blow that ends the combat.

Also, do you want to make combat a matter of player skill at all, or will it just be character skill? TROS, mentioned above, is a great example of the "player skill" sort of game if that's interesting to you.

Mike

[pete_darby]

Lace & Steel is my all-time favourite swashbuckler... combat is through a simple card game with modifiers for both skill and emotional investment.

[Ben Morgan]

Seems to me like you need a system that encourages attempting daring and flamboyant actions in combat (swinging on chandeliers, carving a quick Z on your opponent's chest, cutting a rope to send sandbags plummeting down on your opponent's head), but also rewards players who work to whittle down an opponent rather than simply go for one-shot kills every time (or even a series of exchanges that go on without either combatant landing a hit, like Inigo and Westley at the Cliffs of Insanity). Haven't had time to develop this idea further yet, but you might want to check out Hero Wars (now HeroQuest) for the action point system.

Also, bear in mind that with the source material you quoted, a more cinematic feel is desired. Consequently, things like attacks to specific locations may best be handled simply as special effects.

Feng Shui has an interesting idea that might fit with the style you seem to be going for. The game differentiates between mooks (nameless thugs and guards that go down after one hit, so your characters can mow through armies of them), and named opponents (major villains and rivals, who follow the same damage rules as PCs).

-- Ben

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

I'm posting merely to agree with Raven (greyorm). Swashbuckler is absolutely required reading and playing for anyone designing a cinematic fencing or derring-do game. In fact, I'd really have to be blown away by a game design in order to keep from saying, "Wanna play this sort of stuff. Just play Swashbuckler."

Best,
Ron

[Luke]

my game is self-avowed anti-swashbuckling -- if you don't end up rolling around on the ground with your opponent trying to slash his throat with a knife, then it wasn't a fight -- but the combat mechanic is different than most of what is out there (though Ron mentioned to me that it ain't terribly far from the Swashbuckler school).

you can check out the sample pages of the Burning Wheel for some info:
http://www.burningwheel.org/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=Downloads&file=index&req=viewdownload&cid=3

and go to the About page to see a sample script:
http://www.burningwheel.org/about.html

I don't think Riddle is swashbuckling at all, but that's just me.
Anyway, just another viewpoint.
-L

[Brian Leybourne]

I don't think Riddle is swashbuckling at all, but that's just me.

No, you're absolutely right.

It can, however, be played as a "swashbuckler" without too much work.

But I certainly agree that the game Swashbuckler is probably your best fit, I should have thought of it myself.

Brian.