Building Farrenshire

[Valamir]

Noble titles tend to get a bit confusing.  1e D&D tended to portray them as a linear hierarchy of titles but in reality they are much more complicated than that.

The meanings and relative importance of noble titles change dramatically over the early to late period and also by country.

A very very rough primer:


The term Baron literally meant any noble who held his land directly from the king.  Thus, in England you'll see the references to "the barons" forcing Prince John to sign the Magna Carta.  Here the term "baron" was more of a collective term than a title.  A count who held his fief directly from the King was a baron.  A count who held his fief from a duke who held it from the king was not...though the duke was.

Traditionally the title of Duke was reserved for a noble with connections to the royal family.  This tradition continues in England where I believe there are only 2 Duchal titles remaining; Lancaster, which is held by the Queen, and Cornwall, which is held by the crown prince.  A Duke's lands may be vast making the Duke almost a mini King (as they were in France prior to the centralization of Monarchal powers), or they may be relatively small...even smaller than the holdings of a lesser baron.  In Italy, there were hundreds of Dukes as it was used more as a title of prestige than a title of land holding.

A Marquis originally referred to a noble who was given control of a frontier (march) territory.  As a result the Marquis was granted powers and authority greater than most other nobility.  He was essentially a warlord with quasi independent authority.  Later on, when the "frontiers" were no longer wild and threatened, the title lost most of its authority and became the equivelent of a Duke only without royal connections, making it typically slightly lower in precedence.

A count, given the continental flavor of Farrenshire is probably the most relevant title to use although one of the provinces might be a Duchy if held by a relative of the king (like the crown prince) and Denaile might have a Marquis given its border with Ouestenreich and Stahl which would probably be highly milterized.  A Count is the equivelent of the English Earl and roughly on par with the German Graf (although Graf is actually a much more complicated entity as most German nobility tends to be).  Most of us will only be familiar with the title Graf from the names of certain famous German Warships.

A baronet is probably the last title you were looking for.  It is not generally considered a noble title.  In England a baronet is not a "peer"  You are correct that it is a knightly title, but confuse it with Bachelor Knight.  A Bachelor Knight is knight who does not have his own lands and thus lives in quarters provided by his lord.  Since the knight does not have enough property to support a wife he must remain single, and hense the association of the word Bachelor with unmarried men.  Baronets are the equivelent of the German Ritter.  It would be inappropriate to think of them as mini barons.  The gulf between a knightly title and a noble one was as great or greater than the gulf between a noble title and a royal one.



So, I would organize your territories as follows.  I'd make the crown holdings a Duchy and give it a suitable name making the king not only King of Farrenshire but also Duke of xxxx (which would provide most of his personal wealth).  I'd make Southvine a Duchy as well, held say, by an appointed relative of the King as regeant for the crown prince (until the prince is of age) which will allow for some nice intriguing.  I'd make Cuthhill and Coastrock Counties ruled by a count and make Denalie a Marquessate ruled by a Marquis who is one of the principle military powers of Farrenshire.  I'd make the King's brother, however, Marshal of the Realm which will cause nice rivalry between the commander of the army and the Marquis who controls most of its military.

If all of these lords hold their title directly from the king then they are all technically Barons of the Realm and can be referred to as such ("the king and his barons").

The baronets would serve as senior knights and major landholders.  Since they'd have sworn fealty to their lord rather than the king they would not be barons...although in the true fashion of convoluted medieval politics I would not have the various baronets lands confined neatly within the borders of the territories you've established.  Some baronets might hold their title directly from the king (as opposed to from the king through his title of duke) as a reward from the king and a way to seed loyal folks throughout the provinces.  They would probably go by the title of baron to distinguish their royal patronage.  Further, baronets through marriage and inheritance are likely to acquire land in more than one territory and quite likely hold each territory in fealty to a different lord (very very very common before the centralization of monarchal power made everyone pretty much beholden to the king).  So I'd have far more than 14 baronets.  I'd have dozens and dozens...because the more twisted and tied and crossed they are, the more fun scenario ideas you can come up with.

What gets really fun is when the Count of Coastrock also holds lands from the king of Ouestenrich while one of Coastrocks most powerful baronets holds greater lands in Stahl.  Good stuff.


The next thing you'll have to determine is the status of the cities.  Towns and villages were part of the manoral system, but larger towns (i.e. cities) would often achieve independence from the feudal hierarchy.  The crown would generally grant this in exchange for royal taxes and favorable loan rates.  So you'll want to decide if the major cities of Farrenshire hold a royal charter or are part of the feudal hierarchy (or some combination).  In generaly cities holding a charter were more prosperous because they were governed by alderman and burghers and the like who were generally prominent guild masters primarily interested in making profit, as opposed to being governed by nobility primarily interested in wringing them for taxes.

[Prince of Thieves]

Woo... (removes his school cap) Thanks Valamir, that was very informative.

I'm going to start reworking and polishing my notes with most of my original critical points answered, thanks alot everyone who posted. I'll post more of the work later, maybe someone else can use them to liven up a Farrenshire Campaign or adventure.

[Ian.Plumb]

Hi,

And thanks abunch Ian.Plump I'm taking notes!

Shoot, gotta turn off that webcam when I'm posting to The Forge...

Cheers,

[Tom]

Hey Tom.  Seeing that the site you gave is pretty much a calculator based on the S John Ross information from the site I gave, I'm wondering how your numbers came out so dramatically different than mine.

Did you perhaps make a math error converting from square miles to square kms?

Not square, but miles, yes. If I put 150 kilometers into the calculator, that's 22500 sq.km. and set it to "abundant", then it throws out 3 cities and a total population of 900,000 - pretty close to your numbers.

[Ian.Plumb]

Hi,

Noble titles tend to get a bit confusing.  1e D&D tended to portray them as a linear hierarchy of titles but in reality they are much more complicated than that.

The meanings and relative importance of noble titles change dramatically over the early to late period and also by country.

A very very rough primer:

An excellent summary.

If I may add a little something. If you want to model a strongly centralised feudal system then mid-14th century England is the way to go. If you want to model a loosely centralised feudal system then mid-14th century France is the way to go.

It is interesting to note that not everybody entitled to become a knight chose to become a knight. In fact in mid-14th century France many chose not to. While the cost was one factor the main reason was to avoid the obligations that came with knighthood.

For many there was little to be gained from being knighted. They already held ancestral lands. They were already noble. They had the prestige that comes with a distinguished lineage. They rode to battle in exactly the same manner as a knight with the same training and support. Knighthood in this instance simply added a new obligation.

Cheers,

[Prince of Thieves]

Hi,

And thanks abunch Ian.Plump I'm taking notes!

Shoot, gotta turn off that webcam when I'm posting to The Forge...

Cheers,

Oops... sorry about the mistype Mr. Plumb.  :)

[Prince of Thieves]

Here my vision of Farrenshire, first off though a big thanks to those of you who posted, it helped alot! Please share any further observations or advice/ideas you might have and of course feel free to use any of this in your own TROS adventures/campaigns.

I decided Farrenshire is 280 miles from Mouren to Denaile and (a generous) 93 miles from Ouestenreich to Anghard. Or about 450 km by 150 km. Using the Domesday Book and S. John Ross demographics (big thanks for those sites!) I determined these stats about Farrenshire.

It has a population of 2,678,000 people, with about 80,000 living in 6 cities.

Most of what follows is drawn from handouts I plan to give my players.

A breakdown of the land. (special thanks to Valamir here)

Duchy of Northshire
Spans the Northwestern area of Farrenshire including the capital of Mouren, a good portion (1/3) of the King's Road, from Mouren to a league from Wannore and a full 2/3rds of the coast; from North Bay to the Loch of Eagles. Also include the King's Castle of Kenlit
Ruled over by King of all Farrenshire, Aldwyn II.
Other Persons of Note:
Marshal of the Realm, Duke Ceolfrid Deormod
Bishop of Mouren Amos Medwin

County of Cuthhill
Spans the Northern center of Farrenshire, the only County to touch each and every other County and Duchy in Farrenshire. Covering a majority of the northern border, a small portion (1/6) of the King's Road and holds two of Farrenshire's six cities, Wannore and Attenborough.
Ruled over by the Count of Cuthhill, Baron Henry Cuthwine.

County of Coastroch
Covers the Southwestern corner of Farrenshire, enjoys the remaining southern coastline, the city of Noadam and holds a 7-league border with Ouestenreich. The only county that the King's Road does not pass through.
Ruled over by the Count of Coastroch, Baron Albert Eadmaer.

Duchy of Southvine
Covers the small, but very bountiful, Southern center of Farrenshire. Shares a 10-league border with Ouestenreich, and holds a small portion (1/6) of the Kings Road and the growing city of Freskin.
Ruled over by Duke Alfred Deormod, Regent of the Crown Prince Aldwyn III.

County of Estlee
Spans the full eastern edge of Farrenshire, shares an 11-league border with Ouestenreich and a 12-league border with Stahl and contains the last portion of the King's Road before it winds through Denaile into Stahl. Denaile is the only free-city in Farrenshire, having recently purchased a charter for self-governance. Estlee also houses many powerful fortifications, some new castles such as Castle Hargreave and Castle Estburh even rival the might of the Kings own Castle of Kenlit
Ruled over by the Marquis of Estlee, Baron Owen Hargreave.
Other Persons of Note:
Duke Eckgard Cuthwine and Duchess Ecgwynna Deormod
Archbishop of Denaile Julian Erardon
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Cities of Farrenshire

Mouren and Castle Kenlit
   Castle Kenlit sits on a majestic bluff overlooking the sea and Mouren, which gracefully winds its way down to the coast. Mouren has a population of 19,000. No where is the prosperity of Farrenshire or the fairness of its just rule more plainly seen then in the beautifully vibrant capitol. The people are healthy and full of good cheer, enjoying many gaieties such as festivals and the grand tourneys that Mouren oft hosts.

Wannore
   90 miles east on the King's Road, at the southwestern edge of the County of Cuthhill is Wannore, a small city (population 9,000) brought to life by the road traffics. This city bustles with business but is uninspired and unbeautiful, except for the massive Cathedral of St. Vannora, for which the city is named.

Freskin
   80 miles east of Wannore, at the northeastern corner of the Duchy of Southvine is Freskin, a city of 11,000 souls who enjoy being the neighbor of prosperous Denaile. Freskin is a colorful and merry city, which is pleased to host many Tourneys, almost as many as the capital city Mouren. The guildsmen of Freskin look to the future and plan to follow Denaile's example of independence, they now petition their lord to hear they offers for a charter.

Denaile
   Recently granted the right to self-govern, Denaile is a bustling city full of wealth, trade and much joy. There are many visitors from Stahl, Ouestenreich and Cyrinthmeir arriving to sample and purchase Farrenshire's sweet wine and hearty brandy. Likewise many bold Farrenshire folk make their fortunes delivering spirits to said neighbors.

Attenborough
   This northernmost city, deep in the County of Cuthhill, is small (with only 8,000 people) but has the distinction of being Farrenshire's sole producer of domestic iron. Attenborough, which depends on a circuit of nearby towns to mine the ore deposits, rolls out numerous caravans loaded with iron ores and timber, which is also plentiful.

Noadam
   Farrenshire's only other large coastal settlement is found within the County of Coastroch. Noadam a city of 8,000 souls has in the past enjoyed friendly relations and trade with Ouestenreich. But recent treaties with Gelure have caused trade and prosperity to wane in this city.
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Other places of note

The Giants Dance An ancient circle of standing stones about 80 miles east of Mouren. Despite pressure from the Church, many locals still flock here and to other less known standing stones for old ceremonies and heathen druid rituals.

Loch of the Eagles A sea inlet about 30 miles north of Noadam, which is feed by many rivers and streams and dotted with numerous craggy islands, which each bear an eyrie of eagles that gather here each year. The eagles are known to foretell of prodigious events by all of them emitting a shrill scream together.
(Based on Lock Lomond as described in Arthurian Legend)
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Thats enough for now, hope you all enjoyed. Tomorrow I'll try to post the very brief history of Farrenshire I've come up with and the most important part, my players and their PCs.

[Sir Mathodius Black]

Wow, thats a good description.  I think the real interesting thing now is getting all of the relationships/conflicts between the areas and nobles ruling them.  I don't know if you've got those mapper out, but i think those conflicts are what make having all of these territories worth while.  
Good Stuff

SMB

[Ian.Plumb]

Hi,

Here's my vision of Farrenshire...(SNIP)

The Giants Dance An ancient circle of standing stones about 80 miles east of Mouren. Despite pressure from the Church, many locals still flock here and to other lesser known standing stones for old ceremonies and heathen druid rituals.

I look forward to the scenario where the Church demolish the standing stone circle, build a church there, name one or two locally famous deceased druidic leaders as Saints of the Church, and absorb selected icons of that druidic Faith into the regalia of that particular church.

Cheers,

[Prince of Thieves]

Wow, thats a good description.  I think the real interesting thing now is getting all of the relationships/conflicts between the areas and nobles ruling them.  I don't know if you've got those mapper out, but i think those conflicts are what make having all of these territories worth while.  
Good Stuff
SMB

Thank you Sir Black. I've got some likes/dislikes allies and enemies mapped out along with some other plot points, but at least one of my players visits the Forge every now and again so I won't go into details.

I look forward to the scenario where the Church demolish the standing stone circle, build a church there, name one or two locally famous deceased druidic leaders as Saints of the Church, and absorb selected icons of that druidic Faith into the regalia of that particular church.

Actually that is sort of my idea for the Cathedral of Saint Vannora. See Vannora was a druid leader from long ago and the people of Wannore were slow to accept the church, so you can figure out the next steps. I plan to fill the Cathedral with alot of unusual icongrapy drawn from the druidic faithes. As for the Giants Dance the church is not eager to destroy it because of its possible magic. If fact two local monastaries are going to have an interests in the Giants Dance, one is wants to understand the curative magics the stones are reputed to hold and the other... well they've adopted more then alittle of the druid faith themselves.

Heres my a brief history I made to give the royal family and other nobility some background, not to mention Farrenshire in general.

1384
The king of Farrenshire, King Cynemaer III, following the example of the other northern kingdoms ceases tribute to the empire.
The Archbishop insists Farrenshire remember its place and is exiled from the Kingdom. The folklore say as soon as the Archbishop crossed the boarder the Hag appeared in the Kings court, she was ugly and hunched and gave the impression of impossible years. Her wrinkly skin was black as pitch her hair white, without color. With crooked finger pointed toward the King these words did she speak:

"Your line will end with you young King and you will be the last true king Farrenshire shall know; until days and tides dark bring the Conqueror."

1385
The following year the Archbishop's exile is resended as he pledges to be a servant of the Church alone, not in service to the Empire.

1416
King Cynemaer III is a good king but he sires no hires. At the age of 58 he dies. Without an heir apparent a succession war begins.
Two men seem to be the strongest candidates Eadwold Tatfrid and Sigeric Deormod

1418
Sigeric is slain by treachery. Eadwold seizes the throne and is crowned King. So begins the rough years of the Tyrant King.

1424-1425 The first and second son of the late Sigeric Deormod die, one after the other, in campaigns against King Eadwold.

1428
The Tyrant King Eadwold and his closest ally Baron Dawin Cuthwine are slain at the Battle of Aetta's Keep, by the forces of Aldwyn Deormod (third son of Sigeric) and Henry Cuthwine. (Dawin Cuthwine's nephew)
With the King again dead and no heir, the lands prepares for another war of succession until Cuthwine the Younger surprises many by backing Aldwyn.
Later that year Aldwyn I is crowned King of all Farrenshire, later he weds Eadwold's widow Ecgwynn.

1429
Aldwyn I sires a son.

1449
Aldwyn the First lives just long enough to see his first grandchild born and dies (at the age of 49); his eldest son Aldwyn II (age 20) is crowned King.

1465
The Dowager Queen Ecgwynn dies at the late age of 62.

1467
The current Year. King Aldwyn II and his father's rule have returned peace and prosperity to Farrenshire, but war again looms on the horizon. Oglub, King of Gelure declares himself Emperor. The Gelurise Fleet blockade's Farrenshire harbor and Ouestenreich explores treaties with Gelure to allow Gelurise armies to march through its lands into Farrenshire.
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From the history two names come into the game: the Royal line of Deormod and Henry Cuthwine, who happens to still be alive (at the ripe old age of 59) as my game starts.

How did you like the Hag? Spooky or over the top? since TROS often has the threads of destiny and such I wanted to tie in something to make the players wonder what things I have planned for Farrenshire and for them.

And Last but not least my players or rather their characters.

Sir Cadwin Trismus is the third son of Trismus family sent to study in the monastery, Our Lady of Sacred Sight in Denaile. When his elder brother, Segwin, died in service to the Crown Cadwin stepped forward to serve Farrenshire as a Knight.
Cadwin is handsome young man with a glowing reputation, he is burden by his vows to the monastery which he still plans to honor as he answers the call of duty.
SAs
Conscience
Passion (To King and Country)
Passion (blank currently, proper encouragement for me to place all sorts before him to inspire love/loyalty/hate.)
Destiny (Undiscover for now)
Faith (Three-Become-One)

Martin Riverwood is the 2nd son of the Baronet Nothelm of Riverwood, taught to love the hills, woods and rivers of Farrenshire as well as its people. His family has secretly keep the Old Ways alive, remembering an acient druidic tradition. He has traveled extensively through Farrenshire and the neighboring Kingdoms. He loves the outdoors but is strangly uncomfortable indoors(phobia of enclosed spaces)
SAs
Destiny (To die defeating a great enemy from within. Yes the player made this one up himself, he's very fatalistic, I love it!)
Passion (To Serve Land and Country)
Faith (The Old Ways)
Luck
Conscience

Sir Branor Arden, born a yoemans son, but excepted by a knight bachalor as his squire. Branor proved his valor by dispatching three men in defense of his wounded master during an ambush. (Which happens to be the same battle in which Sir Cadwin's brother was slain.) and was knighted on his return. Branor is young and very healthy(quick healing) but his might, skill and youth lead him to be overconfident and headstrong.
SAs
Consience
Luck
Passion (Loyal to the King)
Drive (Defend the Weak and Innocent)
Destiny (Undiscovered)

Well there we go, hope everyone enjoyed the read. If people are intrested I'll try to post the adventures as they unfold. Once again I look forward to hearing any opinions/advice.