Computer games/CRPGs, effects on gamers?

[Domhnall]

What (if any) CRPGs do you play?

I loved Daggerfall and liked Morrowind.  Gothic II was excellent.


Do you think that CRPGs have affected the way people now paper-n-dice play?  Do CRPGs make gamers more impatient than they were 15 years ago (or am I just getting old?)?

[Doug Ruff]

I'm a sucker for buying more CRPGs than I can finish - but I always check out the manual to see what mechanics are "under the hood".

Favourite CRPGS include Arcanum, Planescape, Fallout, Neverwinter Nights. If console games count, add Fable and Final Fantasy VII to the list.

I don't know what impact CRPGs have had on the hobby. I suspect that Collectable Card Games have had a bigger impact, but the main thing in common is that both of these activities require less handling and prep time on the part of the player. I think that there's a resultant pressure on 'traditional' RPG designers to make their products more playable out of the box, which isn't a bad thing.

[JamesNostack]

Favourite CRPGS... Planescape, Fallout, Neverwinter Nights... these activities require less handling and prep time on the part of the player....  there's a resultant pressure on 'traditional' RPG designers to make their products more playable out of the box, which isn't a bad thing.

I agree with the favorites, I agree with the analysis.  The one thing CRPG's have taught me is that Dungeons & Dragons can actually be exciting, assuming your DM operates at 500 Megahertz or faster.

Also: I'd add the late 80's Ultima games to the list.  Ultima IV was such an unusual concept, where the whole point of the game was to improve the player as a moral human being.  Weird!

[Eero Tuovinen]

I used to play massive amounts of CRPGs. Unless you're familiar with everything from Rogue through SSI gold boxes through Dungeon Master to Ultima Underworld and Fallout or so, I doubt that you've played as many as I have.

But, interestingly, I've not finished one CRPG since... perhaps Might and Magic VII or something. Unless you count console adventures, in which case there's Final Fantasy VII and Paper Mario 2. In any case, for the last seven years or so, I've hardly touched CRPGs. Some little Morrowind (which I liked in principle) is all. I've largely come to "see through" the form, it grows repetitive and dull for me. All the more so in the console gaming form, which is the equal of a Snickers bar as far as I'm concerned.

CRPGs are badly written as fiction: bad dialogue, bad plot, worse characters, no issues. They're badly written as interactive entertainment: trivial strategy, no thematic choices, essentially linear. They're badly written as experiences: long passive stretches (dialogues, movies) interrupted by non-stimulating player-harassment (move that f***ing bastard of a character to the other side of the room so we can show you another 15 minutes of badly acted passive shit). I get the same kick out of NES Zelda I get from the nevest CRPG. Better, actually, because the storytelling is magnitudes better, action is skillfull and the player is not pampered throughout. Zelda I can present as a serious example of gaming art, albeit of a somewhat limited visionary scope, but the modern CRPGs... eh, my 4-year old nephew would write better ones.

The only positive surprise in the genre on this millenium was King of Dragon Pass, which breaks many, many conventions, and is clearly art instead of garbage. But then again, the game isn't really a CRPG.

As you can perhaps see, I've become severely disillusioned with the CRPG form, perhaps more so than any other single form of computer gaming. The matter gnaws me so much that I've written a longish essay on the matter for my portfolio, in case I ever get to work in computer gaming industry ;) I might play some such game now and then (Paper Mario was a positive surprise with it's high production quality and humor for the first five hours or so, after which it degenerated into the repeating, monomanic shit we're so familiar with), but I doubt that I'm going to finish any ever again. Other forms of gaming and art are light-years ahead of CRPGs. CRPGs are simply not where it's at.

As for Domhnall's questions... really, where does this legend of impatience come from? After spending 80 hours watching Final Fantasy dialogue, I would imagine that the average gamer would have developed a saintly patience. Patience is essential if you want to immerse into the numerous pointless, demeaning pavlovian tasks CRPGs present you with. Without patience you won't collect those pokemons or trading cards or elemental orbs or other macguffins, without patience you won't stand interrogating all 30 residents of the seventh little village, when 99% of them residents just want to tell you about weather and how their chicken just laid an egg.

If anything, I think that CRPGs have passivized roleplayers even further. Instead of considering the form as an avenue of expression, your average roleplayer assumes the role of spectator, leaving the entertainment up to the GM. That I can imagine as stemming from CRPGs, which should be properly consumed in a marijuana high, clicking lazily on the button that scrolls the prescripted dialogue ahead.

[Matt Machell]

I am currently losing time (mainly in sleep) to World of Warcraft.

I can stop any time I like. Yeah, right.


-Matt

[Andrew Morris]

I pretty much only play PlanetSide these days. I have an EQ account, but I don't like it as much. I usually only have an hour or so (at most) for videogames, so it has to be something that I can just jump into and start playing right away. PlanetSide is...well...okay for this. Most other MMORPGs are terrible. I hate walking for a half hour just to find the monster I need to kill. Drives me up the freaking wall. So, I'm already impatient, I don't know that CRPGs have made me less so. On the other hand, I only play games that give me gratification right away.

[ScottM]

I was in EVE for a while, but couldn't make myself care.  Otherwise, I'm not that fond of CRPGs-- I tend towards railroad & real-time strategy games.

Scott