[Absolute Destiny Apocalypse] Berlin 1939, Moths and Candles

[Filip Luszczyk]

We continued our Skype playtest of Absolute Destiny Apocalypse. The report from the prep session and the list of Dramatis Personae can be found here. The session lasted about three hours, plus half an hour of pre-game and an hour or so of post-game talk. (I hope to get a session or two more before the end of the month, and then I'll probably take a break from this game for some time, to return to one of my older projects. Then, I should have a fresh perspective once I digest the AP material and go back to Absolute Destiny Apocalypse.)

The players were Kamil and Jacek, so we were one player below standard maximum Troupe size. Since Sylwester wasn't available online for some days, and we didn't know what was up with him, we decided to play without him and his character wasn't introduced yet. Which means there were four Duelists total, exactly as many as I want to have in the initial setup in the next version of the game. As it turns out, it's just the right amount of characters for the start.

Since I wanted to check how establishing extra relations from archetypes in play works, I cancelled the last step of our prep and we started from their distribution, choosing them in clockwise order (using our "sitting order" on Skype). I chose Gudrun (Rosa Chinensis, Kamil's Persona), Jacek chose Katarina (Rosa Gallica), Kamil chose Edgar (Rosa Foetida, Jacek's Persona) and I chose Marliese (Rosa Mystica). We noted down extra relations defined in the archetypes, and I explained how at any moment anyone can establish one of these relations between the Duelist and the chosen supporting character, writing it into the context of the story or retconning as needed. With the round robin character creation for the entire Dramatis Personae I'll probably use in the next version of the game, the distribution will look a bit different - but for now this was probably the easiest solution.

Before the game I scanned the connections map and sent it to the players. Since there was not enough time to get used to possible online solutions, we didn't use any wiki or anything in the end, and instead I suggested for everyone to copy the map into the notes and modify it during the game as needed. This is our initial situation on the connections map:



Some rule changes

Since the Game Chef version of the document is already nearly two weeks old, I included some other rule changes. Not all of these came up in play yet. Anyway, here they are:

-No challenge scenes. A challenge can be issued in any scene. Then, the duel is put into "queue", before, after or between any previously appointed duels. Duel scenes are requested as part of the normal request order, and must be requested from the beginning of the "queue". No challenge was issued yet, but I think they are streamlined now in comparison with the old rules.

-Denouements are not scenes any more. They can occur as part of any scene. Basically, the idea of denouments having the status of scenes was redundant. However, we had no denouements yet.

-Only a single thing can be put at stake in one interaction scene (to have a complex stake, its components have to be put at stake one by one over multiple interaction scenes, and are later bid and resolved separately). This is how it was supposed to work from the beginning, but it isn't really clear in the text.

-It's possible to establish a stake that is not a goal of one's Duelist, as long as it's even remotely tied to her (e.g. to put a goal of an NPC or some outside occurence at stake). Another thing that is not clear enough in the text.

-The consequences tied to a shadow stake must come into play if it is resolved, regardless if the stake itself is resolved favorably or unfavorably.

-Any unspent Thorns the Dramaturge has at the end of the meeting are subtracted from his Passion with the start of the next session. Obviously, this rule couldn't come into play yet, and since we didn't generate any Thorns at all, it won't come into play the next time. However, it should give the Dramaturge a mechanical reason to award Passion.

-Suit effects can be used only once per duel. Swords increase Pathos by 3, Pentacles reduce opponent's Pathos by 3. This should make suit effects more balanced than they seemed to be, but I need to see more duels to be sure of this.

-No suit trading. Suits are distributed anew with the start of every duel. The whole trading idea was redundant.

-Page can be played as an offensive maneuver, reducing the advantage gain of the opponent in the following turn by two as the character retreats. It haven't been used yet, so I'm not sure about this effect - maybe it's better if I give Page some very weak effect that is offensive actually. A one card discard possibly (Bind's effect would discard one more card then, and I'm not sure if it's not too much).

The duel

Kamil proposed that we play out a mock duel before we start an actual session, to show Jacek how the dueling system works. However, since I already had an idea for the first scene, I suggested that the duel can be played out in its context. By the rules, it wouldn't be possible, but it seemed a good idea to me. I've been wondering how to include something akin to DitV initiation conflicts in the game, and this might be the way. I need to think some more how exactly to solve this, however.

So, I framed the first exposition scene to introduce Alexa (Jacek's supporting NPC, The Instigator) and make a quick tour of the Academy. I narrated it from the perspective of a moth flying over all the important locations in the Academy, at sunset, and into the castle ruins on the hill, were the dueling takes place. There, it burned in a candle held by Alexa. I described her as one of the witnesses of a duel between two anonymous shadow figures, one of these being an agent of Thule Society (sacred order in this game) and one being a cultist. This duel might turn out important later, or it might not, but for now none of us knows its meaning.

Anyway, we played out this duel, Jacek playing the cultist, Kamil playing the agent, and me acting as the Second for both and narrating. There were no stakes involved, as it served only teaching Jacek how the dueling works, and no Passion was spent, as I was the only one who had any. However, this was the first opportunity to test special fencing techniques, so we assumed that the shadow figures use the same techniques as respective player characters. Techniques definitely spice up the dueling system, but I can already see that I'll have to do a lot of combat-only playtesting to make sure they are more or less balanced.

Playing out the duel took us nearly an hour, and that's twice longer than I'd like them to take. Skype was slowing us down a bit, it seems (players were sending me their maneuver choices via private messages, but it wasn't really the best idea, we could have go with the usual "honor system" just as well). The lack of Passion might have influenced it a bit, too. Also, Jacek had a great opportunity to finish the opponent somewhere in the middle of the duel, but he wasted it, not knowing the system well enough yet. Kamil pointed out that the struggle could have dragged due to his choice of techniques, mostly non-offensive, and this might be a signal for me to examine such techniques in terms of slowing down the confrontation. However, this was the only duel we managed to play during this session, and there was learning involved, so I yet need to see whether duels taking too long are a real issue. E.g. I remember our first games of Street Fighter: The Storytelling Game or Exalted, and it was the same.

The duel was fun, anyway. A lot of strategizing and jockeying for advantage. In the end, after both players used up nearly all of their options, Kamil managed to recover and knocked Jacek's rose away, using the opening.

I've been adding narration from time to time, describing their actions whenever someone pulled off an interesting tactical maneuver, and mentioning Alexa's reactions to the progress of the struggle and her frustration with the outcome. This made me involved in the duel, solving the issue of part of the table having nothing to do we've been dealing with in some games that feature prolonged one on one confrontations. After the game, we've talked a bit about that. Players commented that it wouldn't be possible for them to focus both on tactics and narration, so the idea of Seconds narrating fits well here. However, I wanted to know whether they actually cared about the narration, and as it turns out, it wasn't necessary for them in this duel. Their conclusion was that it should play an important part if it's about their own characters and not anonymous figures, but this is something I still need to check out.

[Filip Luszczyk]

Scenes

After the duel we played out quite a lot of short scenes, introducing Dramatis Personae and building up some issues between the characters. We didn't manage to do another duel, as it got late, but I suppose the situation will lead to one quickly in the next meeting. This took us roughly two hours, with most scenes taking five minutes or so on the average. Some of these were practically very short monologues (a minute or two at most), and some were longer, of course. There was some rules explanation needed, getting used to the scene requesting procedure took a while (Jacek had no contact with so formalized scene framing before), and we had some other minor delays - but generally, it all went at an expected pace.

Since it was the first session of the actual story, there was a lot of exposition scenes that introduced the cast, and only five scenes total featured conflict. However, I find it interesting that some exposition scenes were requested with adding color and building situation in mind. Before, some people complained that exposition scenes might be redundant in my game, as they don't feature direct conflict and therefore do not add anything to the story. Myself, I expected them to be used only to introduce new characters, and very sparingly later. However, as it turns out, expositions influence the story overall, and can be useful. Their function is slightly similar to the Confessional from InSpectres, and I think they worked rather well.

To reiterate, Edgar is Jacek's Persona, and Gudrun is Kamil's Persona.

There was a series of scenes before the entrance to the Academy that introduced Edgar, receiving a "friendly warning" about the duels from Alexa, and Astrid, trying to flirt with him. Then, Katarina was introduced, organizing a Party meeting, and Kamil introduced Gudrun, disturbing the meeting while on a walk with Astrid (Jacek had established one of Katarina's extra relations, deciding that in the past she used a forged diary to turn Hitlerjugend against Kamil character's little sister). I expect a duel between Rosa Chinensis and Rosa Gallica, pretty soon, as the hostility is brewing nicely. Kamil even put revealing the thruth about the diary at stake as part of this scene series. In the last of the scenes revolving around the Party meeting, Kai was introduced. The scene was basically a monologue, as I narrated how he stands with the orchestra and plays the drum so intensely that it eventually breaks.

After this whole series of the scenes, Kamil requested an interaction scene for Jacek's character and Kai. Edgar, who's pretty teritorial, found him sitting in his "secret place" in the forest, repairing the drum. Kamil established another extra relation at this point, deciding that they are childhood friends who haven't seen each others for years. Now, that was pretty brilliant, as Kai, whether he likes it or not, is a Jew and now it's obvious Edgar knows his secret. Consequently, Kai begged Edgar not to reveal that they knew each other publicly. There was some confusion, as I've been sure it was supposed to be an exposition and not an interaction scene, but the scene type demanded for some conflict to be introduced and for making the development of events uncertain. So, Jacek put revealing their friendhip at stake.

Then, Jacek requested an exposition scene for Alexa, a flashback to highlight her grief after the initial duel. A short scene it was, as I narrated how after tossing a rock to the pond she sees some images on the surface of water, including an orange rose (belonging to Edgar) and then everything got covered with thorns. Since in the next request Kamil asked for an interaction scene for Gudrun, I established a relation between Gudrun and Alexa, stating that they are classmates and Alexa has some romantic interest in her little sister. Then, I narrated how Gudrun comes back to the room she shares with Astrid, and from behind the doors hears some sighs and giggles, and voices criticizing her. Kamil decided that Gudrun goes into Alexa's room, and leaves a broken rose and a warning on her desk. And he mentioned a painting with the unicorn hanging on the wall (heh, could it get more perverse?).

In the next scene, Alexa bumped into Edgar in the corridor, under a painting with a moth drawn to the candleflame, and he noticed traces of lipstick on her neck. Pretending it's nothing, she talked with him about her friend's problem with jelous older sister and asked for help. Jacek put Edgar talking about it with Gudrun at stake - but since he failed his virtue roll, I added a consequence, stating that they will hate each other if the stake is bidden.

In the last sequence of scenes, Marliese got introduced, as on Jacek's request I gave exposition to her relation to Edgar, narrating how her fear is reflected in the melody of her violin when he comes into the room while she practices. Since we've been slowly wrapping things up, Kamil made his last scene request, asking for an interaction scene without his character present, to check how setting non-personal stakes works. Since it looked like I had to role-play a dialog between Marliese and Kai with myself, I decided it's a good opportunity to try out the idea of one of mine Game Chef reviewers, and asked Jacek to take the role of one of NPCs. However, due to the late hour I wasn't thinking clearly, and we kind of messed up who speaks for whom, so I suppose we try this again some other time. Anyway, I established the relation between Marliese and Kai, stating that he has some insights into the human nature Marliese would like to know, but he doesn't want to share. Kamil put at stake whether Kai will be forced to help the violinist.

Generally, this part of the session was fun, although some potential issues came up. Scene requests and framing were rather smooth, once after the first round or two everyone got used to the procedure. Notably, I find it interesting how often players were requesting scenes for characters not their own - I think it's very good. The rule for skipping one's request was useful a few times, too, as it allowed us to avoid delay if someone was out of ideas.

All in all, we've introduced all the characters from the starting Dramatis Personae but Ralf and Mathias, and we've established most of the extra relations from the archetypes. Establishing these relations in play works great, I think, as we could see the connections map building before our eyes, in the context of actual story. However, over half of these extra relations is already defined now, so there will be less of this in the next session. I wonder to what extent it will be substituted by resolving stakes - we have five stakes total now, and each of these can potentially affect some relations.

Jacek commented that observing the build up of the situation and the expanding connections map was very engaging to him. He admitted that he cared about all the characters, and not only about Edgar, and I think it's great. At this point I can see how prep session and round robin NPC creation resulted in the whole Troupe's investment in the situation.

Here's the connections map at the end of the session:





Stakes

After the session we have five stakes total. There's quite a lot of shadow stakes, tied with some negative consequenced. The stakes are as follows:

Jacek:
-Will the friendship between Edgar and Kai be revealed, and how will Kai suffer because of this reason? (shadow stake - notice that if it's bid, Kai will suffer somehow, regardless of the resolution)
-Will Edgar talk with Gudrun about Astrid, and Gudrun hates him because of this? (shadow stake - again, if it's bid Gudrun will hate Edgar, regardless of the resolution)

Kamil:
-Will the truth about diaries be revealed, and Marliese and Mathias become enemies because of this? (shadow stake, the consequence works as above)
-Will Alexa and Astrid end their relationship? (self stake)
-Will Kai be forced to help Marliese? (self stake)

Most of the stakes were established with Love rolls. There were two Faith rolls, if I remember correctly, but they failed, producing shadow stakes, and I added consequences connected with relations anyway. I wonder if it remains like this, that is most stakes will be set using Love. It wouldn't hurt the balance of play in any way, however, as players can give their virtues any values they wish, anyway.

Kamil commented that it's strange for him that we have issues building up, but none of these are resolved yet. However, it's too early to say anything for sure yet, as we'll have a duel very soon certainly, and this can be observed only over more than one duel cycle. Also, Kamil normally tends to push for immediate conflicts and for things being resolved quickly, but he didn't had an opportunity to play a game with such gradual build up of issues structure. Myself, I like what I see for now, but only the next playtest can give me some definite answers.

Conclusions

-There's quite a flaw in the fanmail system. From the very beginning of the session, we've been screaming "Passion!" with almost every scene, but since no Passion was spent yet (I was the only one to start with Passion and I had no reason to use it yet) nobody had Thorns that would make it possible to award Passion. I felt like there might be a need for some additional Thorns generating mechanism, but now I see this is not the case at all. I think I'll add a rule that everyone starts each session with 9 Thorns.

-As a related issue, I think the Dramaturge might have too much Passion. I have 6 points now, and I'll have 12 points next time, while players have 4 Passion in stakes each. The income of two per player at the start of every session could be enough. However, I don't have enough data to say for sure yet, as we didn't use Passion at all yet (no surprise, as it's usually generated and spent in a duel). It may just as well turn out that the whole economy is completely broken, who knows.

-Cutting scenes and continuing them later as scenes of another type does not always work well. It can produce a kind of soap opera scene structure, but sometimes it breaks the natural flow of action. Some reviewers pointed out it might be problematic. I think I'll include an option of prolonging the scene and changing its type, at the cost of skipping one's next request. Technically, it's like requesting more than one separate scene in a row, by resigning from future requests. This should make it easier to establish complex stakes, too.

-Someone pointed out that if the player accidentaly chooses a character that doesn't really fit him (e.g. wrong position on the initial connections map), he won't have much fun. I think including a rule that allows changing one's primary Persona at the start of the session should solve this issue.

-The idea of using Major Arcana to represent characters on the relationship map won't work as it is described in the text. Handling it all would be difficult, and it's easier and more straightforward to simply write character names on the sheet of paper. I had an idea of making a board with a lot of lines that represent preset categories of relations, and then moving cards on the board so that their position determined current relations. However, I won't try anything like this before the next round of playtesting. Maybe I'll find some other way to utilize Major Arcana in the game somehow (I want to keep the corellations anyway, however loose they are, for an added layer of possible interpretations).

[ja-prozac]

Hi
I was playing Gudrun in this session. Thoughts:

- Duels will last longer than half an hour. It will also very much depends on a player.
One would force duels to last longer, just because of fun of them, another would think longer.
Other would want to "act" a lot during duels.

- It's easier to deal with players' characters issues and relations. I don't know how it will be
in longer term with npcs not exactly related with pcs or when there will be more characters
involved.

- We have to test, how and how many stakes will be resolved in duel. This will show
the way game pace should set and when or if it breaks.

- I liked the way the exposition scenes built ground for further stakes. I have to experiment
with them some more.

- Also there's a lot of stuff in prep. I want to know how many of it will be used in later game.
Especially about academy and relations.

- There's still problem that we don't know how the will be on the camaign level. How much
duels and their consequences will change whole situation and if they overwhelm the relations.

I really like the game anyway.

[Filip Luszczyk]

After today's playtest I can see that duels are taking way too long. Even if it's the learning process that slows things down, I need to find some way to make them resolve faster. Without losing the whole card-gamey tactical potential, cause it's too fun to simply cut it out.

I've been expecting that the use of Passion will speed the dueling up, but as it turns out, it doesn't work that way. Now I think the whole Passion & Thorns economy is completely broken. I obviously need to toss it out the window and write this part of the rules from scratch. (Geez, when will I finally write a working fanmail economy?)

I liked your suggestions that the system could be used for a game about tennis or the like, anyway. There's definitely a lot of things I could do with Absolute Destiny Apocalypse, and if not for the archetypes and setting creation, the game itself could be pretty portable, I think.

As for the prep, I can already see how creating the Academy was useful. It seems to me we're all on the same page about the setting and color. I'm pretty sure with a fully the prescribed setting we wouldn't reach the level of consensus we've reached thanks to the discussion. It made it much easier for us to envision situations and set the scenes. Basically, we have some recurring sets.

About the relations I'm not sure myself. Establishing relations in play works great. Mandatory relations with the supporting cast on the other hand boil down to creating these NPCs in an existing context.

Prep is another thing that needs to be made less time consuming, anyway.

[JackTheOwner]

Oh, I was Edgar.

Pros of this game:

• Combat (Duel) can played as separate game, like chess or sth. It's simple, but i don't think it can be played fast in this shape. Maybe with some small changes with influence of passion it will be faster and funner
• I love map relation! It's so awesome. I can sit whole day and discuss about who hate, who is loved by how etc.

But sth isn't right:

• Maybye it's because I didn't played before with such rules, but i finds difficult to put pressure on conflicts. I made too much empty scene. Maybe these were good, but they didn't created the plot. Some examples in books are very needed
• Another problem is map. It's very cool, but I can see clearly, that in the future play there will be too much correction and changes. It's fine to change relation on the fly but on the other hand, but there must be found new idea, how mark changes on the map. Card's I'm presume?

[Filip Luszczyk]

Well, it seems like I should welcome you to the Forge and all, Jacek

Combat (Duel) can played as separate game, like chess or sth. It's simple, but i don't think it can be played fast in this shape. Maybe with some small changes with influence of passion it will be faster and funner

Yes, I hope with the new Passion rules duels will speed up. If not, I'll have to fiddle with the maneuvers to make things resolve faster.

Maybye it's because I didn't played before with such rules, but i finds difficult to put pressure on conflicts. I made too much empty scene. Maybe these were good, but they didn't created the plot. Some examples in books are very needed

Basically, we've spent some time enjoying idle role-playing. However, this is what exposition scenes are for. The problems last time were interaction scenes in which we've been losing their main purpose (i.e. establishing conflict and putting things at stake) from sight.

I think the system might need a built in way for the players to signal that things drag. Like, a hand gesture or a phrase to communicate "Don't drag it further, it's a perfect moment to cut things and roll!"

And examples are needed, indeed. A lot of examples. A whole Actual Play chapter possibly.

Another problem is map. It's very cool, but I can see clearly, that in the future play there will be too much correction and changes. It's fine to change relation on the fly but on the other hand, but there must be found new idea, how mark changes on the map. Card's I'm presume?

It bothers me, too. Map is very important in the game, and I need to think up some better method for tracking all the changes. Not in this round playtesting, but next time, I'll probably try out a board with preset web of links (something like the enneagram surrounded by abstract rosy petals), with characters and specific connections moved around the board.

[Filip Luszczyk]

Another session of our Absolute Destiny Apocalypse playtest started a bit late and took about three hours. Again, there was only one duel that took over an hour. Things visibly slowed down after the introductory stage - only one new supporting character got introduced this time, no new relations got established, and scenes were generally a bit longer than before. There was quite a lot of idle role-playing and playing with color involved, too.

Each of us started with 9 Thorns, so that we could award Passion to each other - and although it noticeably motivated us (especially Jacek) to make things more interesting and fanmail mechanic was used all the time, as it turns out, it's completely broken as it is. More about it later.

I no longer remember the exact order of scenes, as we've been doing some of them achronologically. However, these are the most important events:

(Again, Edgar is Jacek's character, Gudrun is Kamil's character.)

I opened this session using the motif of moth again, describing like one flies into the vine cellars under the Academy and burns in a lamp held by a Hitlerjugend member. Then, I shortly narrated a Party meeting during which Katarina used the forged diary to put some suspicions on Astrid.

There was a continuation of Marliese's introductory scenes series, as Kamil requested exposition scene to talk with her. They spoke about Edgar a bit. During the game or later, Kamil mentioned that he's been pushing things towards a duel between his character and Marliese, and started building up the situation - but there was no challenge from either side by the end of the session.

Edgar met Katarina in the corridor, during a break, praising Kai's loyalty before other Hitlerjugend. They got into an ideological argument, and Katarina challenged him. We could have played out the duel immediately or very soon, but I wanted to see how things would develop with a duel hanging in the air, and possibly test the "duel queue" idea. Consequently, I've been delaying it and no one else requested the duel scene for over an hour. However, there was no other challenge issued during this session in the end.

There was an interaction scene between Edgar and Kai in the "secret place" in the garden. Again, an ideological argument, dealing with Kai's Jewish roots. Jacek put at stake whether Kai understands that his roots make it impossible for him to be Hitlerjugend.

Marliese's supporting character, Ralf, was introduced. Coming back from the garden, Edgar was followed by him, and finally they spoke at the courtyard. Ralf expressed his contempt for Jacek's character, gave him an insulting warning and went his own way.

Someone requested an exposition scene for Edgar, Alexa and Astrid. During lunch, Astrid approached Edgar and started flirting with him again on Alexa's eyes, making her somewhat jelous. Kamil wanted to role-play Astrid in the scene, and he portrayed his character's little sister as quite a bitch. The scene dragged a bit longer than it should, as Jacek got himself entangled in the innuendo (I suppose the system could use some built-in ways for players to signal that it's time to bring the scene to an end, like a cutting gesture or something). Finally, Edgar agreed to show her his "secret place" in the garden, and she came back to jelous Alexa's table, giggling. Things start to get more and more interesting, heh.

Kamil got an interaction scene between Gudrun and Astrid. When Gudrun came back to the room, she met Astrid sitting before the mirror, obviously getting ready for a date. Gudrun started asking her little sister some questions, but Astrid treated her like air. Kamil put at stake whether Astrid and Gudrun stay together, and his character left in anger.

There was an interesting interaction scene between Edgar and Marliese, too. They met in the corridor, and the girl got paralyzed with fear when she saw him, dropping a newspaper she was carrying. Edgar picked it up and tried to talk with her, and I narrated how suddenly the corridor seems to be empty - and silent, but for Marliese's loud heartbeat. Jacek tossed in a painting with storm into the scenery. Marliese was constantly avoiding eye contact with Edgar, and as he tried to talk, it made an impression like he was assaulting her. Since Jacek couldn't decide on his stakes yet, someone proposed that Ralf enters the scene. I narrated how the Hitlerjugend member came in and attacked Edgar, convinced he had assaulted Marliese indeed. They started to fight. Then, Jacek put whether Marliese becomes aware of the violence of Nazism at stake and suggested that we cut the scene and later narrate the conclusion of the brawl in a flashback, once the stake is resolved.

Edgar vs. Katarina duel

If I remember correctly, someone requested the duel scene just after that. Anyway, the duel between Edgar and Katarina was the last scene of the session, and lasted about an hour. Jacek played Edgar, I played Katarina and Kamil acted as Second for both of us. It was late and we've been tired, but now I can see that duels are taking way too long in general. Also, it fully exposed the weakness of the current Passion economy (i.e. in the current version it's useful only for finisher's re-rolls, and spent only near the end of the duel).

In addition to the stakes from previous session, Jacek accumulated two more, and Kamil got one new stake:

Jacek:
-Will Kai understand that his Jewish roots make it impossible for him to become Hitlerjugend? (self stake)
-Will Marliese gets aware of the violence of Nazism, becoming closer to Ralf? (shadow stake)

Kamil:
-Will Astrid and Gudrun stay together?

However, apart from the initial stake I choose when Katarina issued the challenge (the one about revelation of Kai's friendship with Edgar, with Kai's suffering as the consequence), only one more challenge was bidden on the duel. At some point in the middle of the struggle, Kamil bid his "Will Kai be forced to help Marliese?" stake. Basically, it shows that my current Passion rules are extremely weak - Passion isn't as useful as it should, so there's no real need to bid many stakes. Also, I think stakes should be the source of at least 50% of total Passion earned by players, and now it's not like that.

Other than it took too long, the duel was pretty fun. Edgar and Katarina fought surrounded by a circle of Hitlerjugend members holding torches, at night. Alexa attached the orange rose to Edgars chest and observed the duel with Astrid, and Katarina got her purple rose pinned to her chest by Kai. Kamil tossed in narration from time to time, and he did narrate some cool stuff - e.g. Kai observing how his leader fights with his childhood friend, clenching his fists so strongly that they bleed. I'd award him quite a lot of Passion, but I didn't have enough Thorns at this point (Jacek in turn forgot he can, as it was pretty late already). On the other hand, we did exchange some lines of dialog, earning some Passion from Kamil (I recall I got some near the end for Katarina's "You don't fight against me alone! You fight against the power of the Reich!"). In the end, I took advantage of some early tactical mistakes Jacek made, and knocked away his characters rose after a re-roll.

I decided to resolve the friendship stake immediately, and leave the one about helping Marliese for some later time. The resolution, was pretty strong. When Katarina stood in tryumph over Edgar, Kai shouted the name of his friend. I've left Edgar's reaction to Jacek, and he responded looking at Kai standing among Hitlerjugend and shouting "You Jew!" This shocked everyone present, as Kai turned around, moved away from the rest of Hitreljugend and covered his face in his (bleeding) hands. Katarina asked him why had he allowed Edgar to call him a Jew. "Is this true? Are you really a Jew?", other Hitlerjugend started asking. So, Kai looked at everyone, his face covered in blood and tears and shouted "Yes! I am a Jew!" And he run away into the night.

Yup, pure angst ^_^

Basically, the whole dramatic tension that accumulated in the build-up phase exploded.

Resolving the stake, I changed Katarina's relation to Kai into Hate, and rewrote Kai's description to "A young Jew struggling to survive in the Academy" Then, we wrapped things up. The next day I became aware we completely forgot about the Revelation triggered by Edgar's defeat, but it was already too late to do it and we'd have to finish anyway. Here's the situation on the connection map at the end of the session:

[Filip Luszczyk]

Conclusions about Passion

After the session I came to a conclusion that Passion rules are completely broken as they are, and there's not much sense to try to fix them - it's better to write them from scratch. Basically, I wanted a fanmail system in which it would make sense to mechanically reward the GM or players one is in conflict with. So, an idea of "signed" fanmail came to my head. The new rules I'm planning to test the next time are as follows:

Every player, including the GM, has a number of "signed" fanmail tokens. Maybe everyone uses different color, or different kind of tokens, whatever (using real or artificial roses in different colors would be cool, heh). Probably, there's five or six tokens per player. These tokens are there instead of what currently is Thorns pool, and are given out as Passion to others.

When someone wants to spend Passion, the player who gave him this particular token has the right to veto the spending. So, it makes sense to award anyone, cause it never hurts the awarding player.

Spent "signed" Passion comes back to its initial owner and is available for being awarded again. There's only limited (and fixed) amount of "signed" Passion in the flow, so there's no need for currency bleed that I tried to provide using Thorns mechanic. Also, there's a "generic" type of Passion, generated by bidding stakes and the like. These tokens simply disappear after being spent.

I'll probably cut the Dramaturge's income to 1 Passion per player at the start of the session (but leave the 2 Passion per duel gain). 1 Passion for passing initiative should be enough now, and Salute special maneuver will generate only 1-3 Passion, I think (it was overpowered in comparison with bidding stakes anyway).

Also, I need to make Passion more useful (also, spent more often, as currently it only makes sense to hoard it til the end of the duel). Probably, I'll tie Passion to suit effects and change its other uses as follows:

-Virtue re-roll for 2 Passion (it's going to cost, as I want it to be possible but only used in critical need).
-Setting death stakes and the like for 2 Passion.
-Acting against relations at the cost of transfering 1 Passion to the pool of whoever pointed out the violation first (I think giving the point to the other player makes more sense than spending it, as it might create interesting dynamics). Possibly, I'll include a similar rule for acting against Desire and Shame.
-Forcing another player to immediately resolve one of the stakes he won for 1 Passion (this should solve potential problem of keeping won shadow stakes unresolved forever to avoid the consequences).

(I feel I need some additional use for Passion outside duels, something that would be done rather regularly, so that there was some more flow of fanmail. However, I don't have any good idea for such use. Maybe Passion could be spent to take control of a secondary Personae or Dramaturges authority til the end of the scene, or the like?)

-Pathos re-roll for 2 Passion.
-Pathos +2/-2 for 1 Passion (Pathos +3/-3 if Swords or Pentacles respectively is one's suit).
-Recovering a card for 2 Passion (possible only if Staves is one's suit).
-Using Passion twice in the same turn or two turns in a row for 1 additional Passion (possible only if Cups is one's suit).

(At the convention last weekend, I did some mock dueling with Kamil to check these new rules, and they seem to work well - however, I won't know for sure without more playtesting. Also, I don't know how well these rules will write itself into the whole flow of the full session.)

I'm not sure how many "signed" Passion per player there should be. With 9 Thorns in starting pools, everyone was able to award 3-4 Passion per session, and it wasn't enough. 3 "signed" tokens per player is minimum, and more than 6 would definitely be too much. However, I need to find a good number that will make it possible to give awards pretty often, but without making Passion too easily regainable.

This is connected with limits on Passion awards per scene - I'm starting to feel they might be too bothersome and too dificult to remember in play, so I'm considering removing them. However, if I make it possible to award any number of Passion per scene, and spent tokens will be immediately available for being awarded again, there might be a problem of "infinite resources well", and fanmail Passion could overshadow Passion gained from stakes. Maybe it would be solved if spent "signed" Passion came back to its owner only at the end of each scene - but this in turn makes it too likely that when the duel starts nobody has enough "signed" Passion to award.

So, maybe spent "signed" Passion could come back to its owner at the start of the duel?

Other conclusions

-I suppose it could be a good idea to include some signals in the game (e.g. hand gestures or keywords) that could be used to communicate to other players the direction they should take with their narration ("you're dragging things, start wrapping the scene up", "cool, focus on this part more", "make things more/less detailed/graphical/dramatic" and the like). I need to think about it some more, however.

-Kamil complained that exposition scenes are too inclusive, and suggested that I break them down into pure color scenes and situation build-up scenes. The more I think about it, the better it sounds. Also, I need to examine the division of narration rights. We had some scenes that were requested by players and winded up as the Dramaturge's monologue (mostly very short, but still) - some scene types (color, development) could definitely be framed by the player.

-I'm still wondering whether the game really needs the GM-figure, anyway. Or, maybe making it could be a good idea to make it possible for different player to take the function of the Dramaturge with every session?

-The way shadow stake's text is currently formulated is sometimes bothersome. I think I'll clearly separate the stake (which can be resolved however the player wants) and the consequence (which must occur regardless of how the stake gets resolved), instead of artificially cramming it all into one sentence.

-It occurred to me that denouements might be problematic. I've been aiming at making it possible for the denouement to be somewhat interactive, but now I can see how it requires more precise narration rules. I think the player resolving the stake will simply say what he wants to happen, and then it will be either narrated (if there's no need or place for interaction) or role-played like a normal scene.

-Bidding stakes currently involves only stating, that one bids the stake. However, it occurred to me that it might be a good idea to require some narration that explains how the stake suddenly becomes important in the duel. As a Second, Kamil was narrating some stuff that would make for a great introduction of some stake.

-Also, currently the rules require that the player sets stakes that are tied to his character, and bids stakes that are tied to the characters participating in the duel somehow. I came to a conclusion that it won't work very well. I'll probably allow for unconnected stakes are set and any stake is bid on any duel, but require justifying it in narration and tying things retroactively if needed.

-Just before the duel, we had four stakes per player, and it was quite a bit. Maybe limiting the total number of stakes the player can have established at a time to five or six could be a good idea. Such limit would ascertain that nobody accumulates unmanageable amount of stakes, and prompt players to push towards more duels, faster.

[ja-prozac]

Few things:

- We were preparing for a duel on this session and there was enough issues and stakes in the game
that creating more wasn't needed and would only make this more soapoperalike.
- Idle role playing; maybe because we had to warm up in the begininng. Anyway, two duels
during i\one sessions are hard to echieve to me. Maybe if there was enough stakes gathered
before and situation really called for this. It's more a matter of scene framing and players' goals.
- I wouldn't call it angst, it was good dramatic moment. Even weirder because we were almost
dead tired in the end.
- I was pushing Jacek while playing Astrid to do something. In this scene misunderstanding
could be seen. FOr me it was build up scene, for Jacek color scene.
- Passion is troublesome and while I agree doesn't work right now I don't konw will new mechanic
will be ok. I need to see it in the game.
- Drivimg instructions and other aids are a must. I still don't know exactly the right pace for it and
toy with mechanic and scene framing.
- Stakes in duels needs working out. I can see the problem with more than two stakes resolved
in in one duel and narration of this

Kamil Wegrzynowicz.

[Filip Luszczyk]

- We were preparing for a duel on this session and there was enough issues and stakes in the game
that creating more wasn't needed and would only make this more soapoperalike.

Yeah, we should have went for the duel just after the challenge. However, anyone could request the duel scene at any time once the duel was in queue - personally I've been dragging things mostly to see if another duel emerges.

- I was pushing Jacek while playing Astrid to do something. In this scene misunderstanding
could be seen. FOr me it was build up scene, for Jacek color scene.

I wonder if there's still a potential for such misunderstandings if I formally separate build-up and color scenes. E.g. someone could request a color scene, and in a natural way, some situation build-up could happen. Dunno how changing the way narration is divided (e.g. giving all narration rights to the requesting player in color scenes) would affect it all. Now, I'm wondering whether leaving one scene type for build-up and color but requiring that a general direction was clearly communicated in the request wouldn't be enough. Anyway, we need to see it in play to know for sure.

- Drivimg instructions and other aids are a must. I still don't know exactly the right pace for it and
toy with mechanic and scene framing.

Basically, I won't be able to write these without playing the game more first.

- Stakes in duels needs working out. I can see the problem with more than two stakes resolved
in in one duel and narration of this

Yes, I need to examine what I have in the text, what I have in my head and what we're doing in actual play, and make appropriate readjustments.

Hmm, I had an idea. Duels are slowing things down, and right now I'm not sure if I can make them resolve faster without cutting out neat tactical bits. However, I could completely cut out the duels, putting in some temporary, faster mechanic for now, to easier observe the whole cycle of build-up and resolution.