[D&D 3.x] looking for ideas for Magic systems

[sarendt]

An on going problem I have with D&D and many similar systems is the magic rules.

In a recent game in which I was GM''ing one party member was a 1st lvl sorcerer that had chosen for his two spells charm person and prismatic orb I believe.  The character background is similar to a wild mage, as he is simply a farmer's son and he and his whole village has little exposure to magic.  The player is a long time D&D player and seems completely happy with the current system, these are my own personal concerns.

We had one encounter early in the RL day with some skeletons, in which he blew through all of his spells for the day throwing orbs.  The effects were mediocre, both in description and effect.  I attempted to describe the effects of the orbs smashing into nearby walls but it didn't really seem to paint a picture of magic I wanted.  After this encounter there were more various situations in which the sorcerer could have cast spells had he had any that were useful and available. 

My concern/question then is two fold. 

Are there any suggestions for describing the effects/side effects of magic to give it more of a 'graphic, mystical, magical' sound to it? 

Are there any systems/rules for magic/magic users that allow them to be more free form with their magic?  What I would really like to see is a system were a player could say I would like to attempt to do X using my magic.  I as the GM I would consider the difficulty of doing X, and give some requirements, similar to a skill check.  I would also like to see a consequence associated with the skill check that would build over time.  This would be the 'equalizer' so that a magic user couldn't cast spells forever.  Im not sure how that might work, but I am thinking something hit point/constitution related (maybe non lethal dmg) were if the wizard was still standing he could try to cast another spell, but might pass out or do real damage if he fails.
This sounds like a working system, but what I am afraid of is that at higher levels the magic users would over power all other classes, which I don't want to happen.


Any help or suggestions would be great.

-Scott

[Andrew Cooper]

There's a free RPG out there called Earth of the 4th Sun that has a nifty magic system that might be what you're looking for.  I think it could be tacked onto D&D.  If you'll PM your email address I'll send a copy of the game to you.

[Michael Huxley]

I'll offer this suggestion with the warning that I have not fully playtested this system, nor do I believe it to be complete - the only use it has seen is through my Druid who only uses to cast healing spells, but it has worked for us for several sessions now. It mostly as you said, making magic a skill, with consequences for casting too many spells.

Here's a link to my wiki page that explains the system.

[Michael Huxley]

Sorry my link didn't work in the previous post here it is:

http://www.huggin.net/wiki/index.php/Alternate_Magic_System#The_Classes

I hope this helps, or at least gives you some ideas!

[James_Nostack]

Are there any suggestions for describing the effects/side effects of magic to give it more of a 'graphic, mystical, magical' sound to it?

Yes: let the player describe the spell.  If the description has some suitably "magical" detail, give him 20 XP. 

Are there any systems/rules for magic/magic users that allow them to be more free form with their magic?  What I would really like to see is a system were a player could say I would like to attempt to do X using my magic.  I as the GM I would consider the difficulty of doing X, and give some requirements, similar to a skill check. . . . This sounds like a working system, but what I am afraid of is that at higher levels the magic users would over power all other classes, which I don't want to happen.

I think what you've outlined seems to be a pretty good system, but I suspect tinkering with the D&D resource system is asking for trouble.  There are, however, a couple of "official" alternate magic systems:

* General Variant Magic Rules
* Incantations
* The Binder, the Shadowshaper, and the True Namer from The Tome of Magic each use different spellcasting rules.
* Monte Cook's ARCANA UNEARTHED/EVOLVED still uses the D&D resource slot system, but is a little bit more flexible: you can slap a template (gained through a feat) on a spell, and do different things to it; also, most of the meta-magic feats are available simply by using two spell slots.
* The Arcanist, in Monte Cook's IRON HEROES is apparently pretty free-form, though also apparently kind of broken

[sarendt]

Thank you all, I will look into them and see if I have any additional comments.

-scott

[Michael Huxley]

I tried replying to your PM Scott, but it says I'm not allowed to send PM's for some reason. Yeah something does seem to be amiss. Not sure what it is, I haven't got that error message before. I'll look into it and get back to you when I figure things out.