Looking for a Game

[vertigo25]

I know this falls outside of the scope of these forums, but I'd like to ask all of you, because you know what I'm talking about here. I apologize beforehand, if this falls too far off-topic.

Does anyone know of any good narrativist sci-fi games that don't have an attached setting, or at least lend themselves well to designing your own setting?

I'm primarily interested in a system that has really good and detailed char-gen; something that helps make the characters *a lot* more than just a collection of stats.

I'd also like something that has a good system for making up alien races. My number one complaint about most sci-fi games is that they all have really interesting races, but give no details on how to make your own... not even suggestions.

Along with races, a good ship-design system would be a lovely thing. And, heck, while we're dreaming... a narrative-based space combat system would be aces.

I'm a fan of "tactical, but fast" combat systems. Not necessarily "rules light," but something where small fights go quickly, and fights with major bad-guys, can get more detailed.

I've heard some really good things about Burning Wheel, and plan on buying it to try out for a fantasy campaign. It sounds like the char-gen in it is very much what I'm looking for. What I've read about Burning Empires, however, doesn't really sell me on the game, as it seems *very* setting specific, and I'm really not in to the setting. Plus... no ship design system or guidelines. Not to mention that I wouldn't be able to afford that (albeit, beautiful and desire-worthy) book right now, anyway.

I'm also just not in to rules-tweaking these days. I'd like to find a good set of rules that I can learn so that I can just concentrate on story and world details.

I'm not opposed to a generic system at all, but I'd really like to find something that is narrativist by nature. I just don't know of any generic systems that are like that.

I know it sounds like I'm being picky, but... oh... well... I guess I am I just don't want to sink my hard cash in to something I'm going to be disappointed with, ya know?

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

You cannot post here in a way which violates the standards of the site, and make it OK by saying "I apologize in advance." That's a whole lotta no good.

If you want this thread to continue, describe whatever actual play, in your experience, has led you to look for a game like the kind you're describing. Otherwise it ends here.

Best, Ron

[vertigo25]

Sorry about that, Ron.

Unfortunately, I can't really rework the thread to an Actual Play scenario in the way you suggest, I guess.

There don't seem to be any discussions on the Forge which allow for this particular question. It's a shame, because I think the voices here are above average when it comes to the philosophy of roleplaying (kind of an obvious statement). The signal to noise with regards to a question like this on other forums is pretty bad. People have a tendency to have their favorite system, swear by it, and not understand why someone else wouldn't like it. The members of the Forge consistently ask good questions and give great feedback. I just kind of hoped I could tap in to that.

FWIW, I've been checking out stuff about Shock: and it looks promising. Just close (or delete if you can) this thread, and I'll take some questions over to the Shock: discussion.