Raising Proficiencies

[Dan Sellars]

I've got a little question on proficiencies my group was discussing last night.

When I create my character I put 7 into Longsword. So I then get Dagger at 3 (I think it is -4 but if not, for arguments sake...)

If then during the course of play I spend spiritual attributes and put Longsword up to 8 does my dagger now raise (to 4)?

So I could then raise dagger to 5, then Longsword to 9, bringing dagger upto 6?

Or do the crossovers only apply in character creation?

I hope this hasn't been asked before.
Thanks in advance,
Dan.

[Brian Leybourne]

Hey Dan,

The way I play it is this:

Default proficiencies apply until you start training in something, and can rise no higher than 6.

So in your example, yes, the first time you raise longsword, dagger goes up, but since you then spent points in dagger, it stops defaulting from longsword and is its own proficiency. If you had kept putting points in Longsword only, Dagger would keep rising with it, but no higher than 6.

So, why would you ever put points into dagger instead of longsword in this instance, you ask? Because buying up dagger by itself would be a lot cheaper... :-)

Regards,
Brian.

[Dan Sellars]

Thanks for the reply this seems quite sensible.

So, why would you ever put points into dagger instead of longsword in this instance, you ask? Because buying up dagger by itself would be a lot cheaper... :-)

If you are wanting to raise Longsword as well then surely it is still cheaper to put all your points into Longsword? (cheaper, but slower for the dagger raise)

Also do you count points put in at character creation as stopping the cross over on subsequent raises. eg:
creation I have 9pts I put 7 in Longsword 2 in Dagger
gives me Ls 7 Dg 5

later in play I up Longsword to 8 do I get Dagger up one to 6 or is it counted as being trained from creation and thus not eligable for crossover?

Thanks,
Dan.

[Lxndr]

It always goes up.

At least, that's how I remember previous discussions on the matter reporting it.

[Brian Leybourne]

Also do you count points put in at character creation as stopping the cross over on subsequent raises. eg:
creation I have 9pts I put 7 in Longsword 2 in Dagger
gives me Ls 7 Dg 5

later in play I up Longsword to 8 do I get Dagger up one to 6 or is it counted as being trained from creation and thus not eligable for crossover?

What you explain is quite allowable, but that means you have actually trained in dagger, so it's not a default ptoficiency anymore.

That's how I play it anyway, YMMV.

Brian.

[Richard_Strey]

I think "defaults" represent the portion of your basic martial knowledge you can apply towards the use of any given weapon. So, dagger defaults from longsword at -4. This means that I can always use the stuff I know about longsword fencing with a dagger, the differences that I have to overcome reduce my pool by 4.

e.g. I have LS at 7. Gives Dagger at 3, by relying on my basic movements, judgement, timing, etc.
I learn extra dagger techniques to raise Dagger to 4.
I improve LS to 8. That would give me Dagger at 4, where I had it anyway.
I raise LS to 9, my further grasp of basics enable me to use dagger at 5 now, where my impeccable sense of timing and judgement outweighs the basic dagger moves I learned on the side.

[deltadave]

Let us not forget that most maneuvers are not useable from Default either. That alone is a reason to raise the proficiency on its own.

[Ashren Va'Hale]

also, its important to note how you are using the weapon when you apply defaults, I once had a pc pick up a club (hickory stick) and instead of defaulting to mass weapon he just went ahead and used it like a longsword with which he was proficient

[Dan Sellars]

How did that work?  did the pc state what proficiency he was using?  Did you penalise him?

Dan.

[Brian Leybourne]

I'm behind Ashren. It's not so much what weapon you use, but how you use it.

Swinging a stick like a sword wont as much damage probably, but proficiency-wise it makes sense.

Brian.

[Dan Sellars]

I was just wondering what was meant that was all I wasn't disagreeing, I was just in a bit of a rush ;-)

So do you mean that it would be ok to use the Longsword proficincy (and thus full CP) with the stick but use the damage from a club (or a abit lower)?  I had assumend that the default mass weapon proficiency (and thus CP) would be used.

Dan.

[Brian Leybourne]

The point is that you could probably use either, whichever was better. Having said that, if you used Mass Weapon I would probably be slightly more generous with the damage than if you used Longsword proficiency, since many moves with a bladed weapon rely on the edge that just isn't there, so maybe aren't quite as damaging as if you swung the thing actually like a club.

Brian.

[Salamander]

Yeah, that's about right. When we use wasters, which are basically long sticks, we use them as longswords. and let me tell you, them things can smart like nobody's business. A few weeks back my darling wife just about split my skull with one during a drill. She wasn't even going fast either...

I am behind the guys on this one for sure. It's not what you use, but how you use it. Just remember to apply common sense. No using a frikkin pollax with cut & thrust proficiency or any other nonsense like that...

*Please enjoy responsibly*
:D