Armor

[The big blue ape]

My character currently has some armor made from dragon scales,
what would be a good armor value for it?

[Swordmagnet]

Brian, maybe you can help with this one. In OBAM Dragons, i.e. Wyrms, have a toughness of 12. How much of this is size and how much is scales?

[Brian Leybourne]

Uh, yeah, I had a complicated formula that I used to calculate that value... :-)

Seriously, if dragon scales are much tougher than solid plate, then you have zero chance of ever hurting one, so I say dragon scales are the equal of really good plate (AV6) or if you're feeling really generous, AV7.

Any more than that and you're untouchable anyway.

Brian.

[Caz]

Are you trying to make it balanced?  Or do you not care?
It's obviously been decided that dragon scales are not too thick, bulky, heavy or difficult to work to make armour from.  Also, if they're not magical, or have since been imbued with magic, then their are real life equivalents.  
   If they are magical, then give them any armour value you want, balanced or not.  
   If the dragon is a natural creature which can be worked into armour, then it would likely be functionally the same as, but far more expensive and prestigious as leather, horn or tusk armour.  But if the scales are large, the armour value could increase slightly, as long as they aren't too thick to be practical.

[StahlMeister]

B'cause here in Germany, my dealer doesn't have ObaM yet I would give a AV of about 8. But if Brian says AV 6 I would rather go down 1 or 2.

By the way, woudn't it be a goog idea to give (depending on what kind of armor) different AVs for punture, bludg. and cutting damage?

Only a thought. I think in Harnmaster or so it is handled like this.

[MonkeyWrench]

By the way, woudn't it be a goog idea to give (depending on what kind of armor) different AVs for punture, bludg. and cutting damage?

Weapons with special qualities are how thats taken care of. Ex: It's harder to hurt someone in metal armor with a saber or easier to puncture plate with a poleaxe.

[StahlMeister]

I've just read it in another thread. Thanks!
I've to study the weapons tables mor exactly when I'm at home.

Great game! :)))

[Mike Holmes]

Hmm. If the dragon's scales give it an AV of 6 or so, that means that it only has 6 for size. Which seems low. I think we're talking your leathery skinned little worm here. I'd give Dragons a way higher TO, personally (and then use the roll method for damage reduction to make it possible, if unlikely, to damage one).

In any case, I'm sure that there's variation in dragons, and moreso in the ability to make armor from their skins. As such I think that any AV would make sense.

If you want to have a lower AV, reduce the penalties and say that the armor is just made from the outtermost layer of skin and therefore very light for it's protective abilites. Think leather penalties with an AV of 5 or something like that.

Or have it have very similar abilites to some existing armor, but be impervious to heat.

Lot's of possibilities.

Mike

[Brian Leybourne]

Hmm. If the dragon's scales give it an AV of 6 or so, that means that it only has 6 for size. Which seems low. I think we're talking your leathery skinned little worm here. I'd give Dragons a way higher TO, personally (and then use the roll method for damage reduction to make it possible, if unlikely, to damage one).

Actually, something I've written for TFOB (but have not OKed with Jake yet, so may or may not exist in the book, thus I don't really want to talk about it much) would make a "size" TO of 6 completely appropriate for Wyrms because of the way larger creatures will take damage.

But yeah, other than that I completely agree with Mike. I said 6-7 because much more than that and you're untouchable in your dragonscale armor so what's the point anyway, right? :-)

Brian.

[Mike Holmes]

Brian, I think that at higher levels of power that Higher AVs and such will be perfectly fine. I mean it's going to be important to have an AV+TO= 20 if I'm to have a chance against, oh, say, a dragon? I think we tend to think a lot in terms of more human level conflict, and not down the road further with characters that have had more time in play (game's not old enough yet).

Anyhow, all this just argues for the variable defense roll rules, IMO. Once you put them in place, you can model any numbers you like.

Mike

[StahlMeister]

I invented a house-rule for TO reducing damage.
TO reduces damage only TO/2 rounded up. The rest of your TO value you have to throw a d10 and a result of 7 or lower. We're discussing if the TN of this coud be calculated from TO and Health.

Maybe 13 - ((TO+HT)/2)

So this would be a TN for a character with TO 8 and HT 6 a TN for 6.

My gaming group has agreed to that. Of course its still very difficult to fight against a dragon. But..  hey a DRAGON!!!
Only D&D players run against a dragon on an open field, right !? ;)

[Krammer]

just a comment on the "untouchable" thing. Even with his cool dragon armor, he has lost an arm, and no more than half an hour ago, he received a level 3 wound to the stomach..... from a guy with only 12 CP.... yeah, he is not "untouchable".