Item & Equipment Details ????

[Autocrat]

OK then, lets see how fast this one goes......

  So you have a huge list of potential equipment, (to cover your post apoc setting with umpteen types of skills and equipment types LOL),..... yet what sort of things do people generally want/need as a minimum for Role playing, and whats the maximum people think they would use?

You have the following sort of things;
*Weight
*Size
*Cost
**Concealability
**Encumbarance modifier
**Availability

Then for things like weapons, you can add;
*Range
*Reach
*Damage
**Accuracy Modifier
**Defence Modifier
**Recoil Modifier

For Armour you might add;
*Absorbtion Rating
**Evasion Modifier
** Individual Attack Type Modifiers

For Vehicles, you might include;
*Speed
*Handling / Manouvreability
*Cargo
*Seating
*Defence Rating
*Absorbtion Rating
**Acceleration Rate
**Decelaration Rate
**Total Cargo Volume
**Weapon Mount points
**Potential Weapon Mount Points

NOTE:- a single * marks a standard stat, a double ** marks an optional or not to sure to include it stat.

So, does that cover the normal things, or have I missed something out?
Or is there too much?
Please remember, this is for roleplaying, not narrative or story only, the game does have stats and numbers, not text descriptors or guides.

[anonymouse]

Please remember, this is for roleplaying, not narrative or story only, the game does have stats and numbers, not text descriptors or guides.

Before I overflow with righteous fury, I'm going to assume you mean "this is for a tactical combat game where precision and objectivity is important" and not some malignant attempt at "my gaming is better than yours."

In which case, the list you have probably suits fine. ShadowRun seems like it'd be an awesome template for you to work off of, since its equipment details (Cannon Companion and Rigger 3 are the 3E books you'd look at specifically) seem to have the same kind of playstyle you're looking for.

[erithromycin]

I'd also sound a note of caution in determining these things too solidly, not least because in a post-apocalyptic game I'd expect quality, utility, and more than anything else price, to vary wildly between transactions. It might be better to have a mechanic for determining these values, rather than a vast tome of values for every eventuality.

drew

[Ole]

A ranged weapon without an ammo rating is either very good or very bad. What I`m trying to say is that ranged weapons should have an ammo rating.
The minimum number of stats is 0 really, you can get by with a description for any given item. How many stats you assing, and more importantly, actually use, should be determined by what you want to focus on.

[Autocrat]

Alright, lets see.......

... anonymouse ...

No, it was not an attempt to state a better style... believe it or not, as I get it rammed down my throuat when I mention my style of play!!!!!!!!!!
All I was doing was adding some clarification so that I don't get a load of
  "you don't need any stats"
sort of posts, removing potential posts that aren't of use to me!
So please, don't take offence!  
Also, not particulalry a tactical game, just one that ofers various detailss, and I'm wanting to know what people consider as the juicy bits that they really want!



... erithromycin ...

Good point, and I agree.  Can't be too honest though, as I get shouted down when I put the truth of my system down... yet it's already taken care of.
Any more ideas... or other holes you can see?


... Ole ...

Thank you... blindingly obvious, and I forgot to list it!
Also, the clip size and that sort of thing should also be listed, along with Fire Modes for certain weapons.

Also, thank you for suggesting no stats, yet as I tried to clarify, (and in doing so upset anonymouse, I have stats, and am wanting to know what ones people feel comfortable with, and more importantly, which ones they feel uncomfortable without!
Yes?  No?  Anything else you can suggest?

[Shreyas Sampat]

It seems to me that in a post-apoc setting, you need weaponry to have social impact; rather than concealability, I'd give weapons "Coolness" or "Intimidation" ratings, to simulate that phenomenon in the post-apoc realm where you can evaluate the badassosity of a person at a glance.

In other words, you are restricting your options with narrow thinking; a weapon is more than just a thing that hurts people; a suit of armour is more than just a thing that stops you being hurt. They are, among other things, fashion statements, implicit challenges, elements that reveal character.

[Valamir]

Shreyas,
excellent point.

I was immediately reminded of Road Warrior.  That little sawed of pistol shotgun of Max's immediately established his on screen cred as a bad ass (well that and the car and the black leather).

It was completely irrelevant to the issue of badosity, that the gun had no working ammo and was essentially...a club.  It was the intimidation factor that matter.

In a similiar vein you have the weapons of the gladiators in The Running Man.  Any attempt to do a Running Man game where those weapons were stated out in some meticulous fashion would be to miss their entire point....which was to generate ratings by how flamboyantly and uniquely you could kill someone.  Any weapon in this game should have Ratings Potential as a stat...a stat that has a HUGE impact on the reward system of the game and is the reason why a simple submachine gun isn't good enough.

[Callan S.]

I think your talking about 'genre rating' Valamir.

It would be an interesting exercise to have guns main stat (perhaps only stat) is it's genre rating. By main I mean you'll get the most system value out of it.

Then, even though its a post apocalyptic setting, let players choose whatever gun they want to start, and buy any gun they want latter. Because the big ass guns just don't have the same effect that crappy little stubby shot gun have.

But I get the feeling this wont match the posters original play style desire.

[Ole]

Lets assume there is a detail - playability scale. More detail means less playability, and vice versa. How many stats you use for every piece of eq then becomes a factor of how much playability you are willing to sacrifice to detail. With playability I mostly mean low timeconsumption, atleast in respect to the issue at hand.

Often related aspects of a piece of eq can be boiled down to one stat. eg. its possible to provide separate values for concealability, encumbrance modifier and weight, but is the extra detail worth the extra time used?
You can provide four different ranges for every ranged weapon, but its more convenient to give standard ranges for groups of weapons, eg. handguns, rifles, shotguns etc.
Separate values for price and availability might be perceived as adding detail, but isnt really the first a function of the later?

For a post-apoc setting I imagine that one worry will be the chance that any given eq will stop working. A mechanic to cover malfunctioning eq seems in order, but does every eq have the same chance of malfunctioning? Perhaps a malfunction modifier is in order? And when it fails how hard is to repair, and how long does it take, what is the chance that spare parts are needed, what is the chance that after repair any of the other repair stats are affected? Or could the last two points be ignored, and the rest represented by a single stat?

For any given aspect of an eq you can come up with a great number of stats, the question is, how much time is the extra detail worth?

What do I prefer? In my system all weapons falls into a broad group, the group dictates range and damage rating. Armour can be one of two types and are rated 1-5. No eq list other than that.
Works excellent :).

[Autocrat]

Ok..... lets see......

I love the idea of a a intimidation/presence/bad-dude sort of stat, just for the sheer hell of it.... it's workable, can be used in various ways for various things.  Great!

I can't believe I missed out on a malfunction stat!  I have mechanics for durability, yet hadn't gone any further.  Thank you for pointing out the obvious.

So I can add them to Ammo/Clip type+size and Fire Modes, good.


... Ole ...
I can understand where you are coming from in regards to the number of stats influencing time of play etc., yet it all depends on how the stats are used, when they are used and why they are used.
If you don't want to play with those stats, then you don't.  What I'm trying for is to generate the Base Stats for equipment, then apply the additionals and optionals so as to permit others more depth, feel or just the occassional tid-bit for strange things.


So, any others?

And just for appeasement, the game is flexible, and hopefully permits people to play at the level of detail they want..... so you can play with a feww basic stata or with a multidude of detailed ones.  Also, you can play with general item groups, (swords), or with more specific versions, (AK47 with folding stock and laser sight!).