Re-layouted damage tables (and more)

[Tom]

In addition to the maneuver cards, I've also worked on the damage tables. For the impatient, the download link is http://web.lemuria.org/tros/.

Different from the quick-reference things, these are the actual tables, with full content from the book (Jake has given his ok to publish them). They are not abbreviated, they just use a different layout.

The advantage - all types now fit on a double-page, so no more searching through page after page of tables.


I've made two minor changes compared to the book:
* Bludgeoning, Zone VI, 4 (Groin, Female), lvl 2: Pain should probably 6-WP, not 16-WP as in the book
* Bludgeoning, Zone VII, 2-3 (Forearm), lvl 5: Text changed to "ripped off" instead of "cut off"


Enjoy. If you find any errors, please post so I can correct them.

[Poleaxe]

awesome!  Thanks.

Hey does anyone know why Jake used a different numbering system for the Zones with swinging vs. thrusting attacks?

Wouldn't is have been easier to just use zone I-VII?  I would use the thrusting order though, it's more consistent with Jakes philosophy of, "higher location on the body means higher number."

so...
I      lower legs
II     upper legs
III    groin
IV    body
V     arms
VI    overhand/chest - neck and clavicle, you know what I mean
VII   head


Or does this not matter to anyone really?  It seems like the different numbering is just to reinforce, "hey, one of these sets of tables is for swinging, the other for thrusting."

Does anyone use a different number system for the zones, or is it just not worth it?

-Alan

[Dain]

If you're correcting a misprint on the groin pain thing, then that's probably ok...but if you're commenting that men should have a 16 - WP but women should have a 6 - WP, then you might want to poll your women players before they string you up. While it is inconceivable to me that the pain could be anywhere near comparable, in the few unexpectedly heated conversations I've had with several women on the topic they've informed me it hurts them every bit as much when they get hit down there as it does when we get hit down there. Being somewhat on the timid "avoid conflicts at all costs" mentality, I took the Monte Python approach (almost soiled my armor while fleeing and yelling "Run away!...run away!") and dropped the subject. I suppose I could have described the pain and asked if that was comparable, but didn't have enough investment in the topic to make it worth while. If I had been constructing rules for something however, I would have braved the danger and had the discussion to make sure I got it right.

Just an opinion...that hopefully will prevent you from refreshing your memory of that kind of pain at the hands of a highly insulted female player *grin*

[Tash]

When I was younger my little sister and I trained together in the same martial arts class under the same Sensei.  He insisted we BOTH wear groin protectors when sparring.  She forgot hers once and took a shot from her partner to that region....it sure looked like it hurt as much as if I'd gotten hit there!

Anatomically the reason that area is so sensitive has nothing to do with sexual organs (though it does hurt when you get your "equipment" pummeled), there are a large number of nerves and pressure points there because of the intersection of two major limbs with the trunk of the body, and the end of the spinal cord in the pelvis.  

All things considered a shot to the groin hurts like hell for either sex, but I think its prabably easier to land a telling blow on a male due to anatomical arrangement.

Edit: Just to add, most good self defense and martial arts teachers will also explain that a shot to the groin is a bad one to use in a combat situation (with only a few exceptions), the reason being that, while painful, its rarely crippling.  If you hurt an opponent and don't cripple them, then you've just made them want to hurt you MORE.

I've only trained in one system that taugh groin shots as crippling moves, and that was in Bando where vertical toe kicks are aimed at the very base of the pelivis.  Sharp, pentrating kicks with the toes to vital areas are common in that system, and one to this area stands a good chance of causing severe bleeding and internal injury, certianly enough to drop almost any attacker, and that will work on either gender.

[Jake Norwood]

Or does this not matter to anyone really?  It seems like the different numbering is just to reinforce, "hey, one of these sets of tables is for swinging, the other for thrusting."


-Alan

You got it!

Jake

[Tom]

If you're correcting a misprint on the groin pain thing, then that's probably ok...

Yes, I do believe it's a misprint. Look at the progression, in the book, pain goes 4-16-10-12-13. I'm sure that 4-6-10-12-13 makes much more sense.

[Stephen]

Just to add, most good self defense and martial arts teachers will also explain that a shot to the groin is a bad one to use in a combat situation (with only a few exceptions), the reason being that, while painful, its rarely crippling.

Perhaps I'm just a wimp with a low WP, in TROS terms, but whenever I've gotten hit in the groin, I was pretty much levelled -- and anybody I've ever seen take a serious hit in the groin (granted, never in an actual 'combat' situation, only sports or by accident) basically dropped like a stone in agony.

That seems as close to 'crippling' as makes no nevermind in my book.  Am I using the word incorrectly?

[Tom]

Perhaps I'm just a wimp with a low WP, in TROS terms, but whenever I've gotten hit in the groin, I was pretty much levelled

Yeah, but that is exactly what Pain means in TRoS - you're out cold, but no permanent damage like a broken bone or slashed off head.

Remember, when your CP is down to less than 0 through pain, you have to make a knockout roll. When it's at 0 or very low (1-2), that's a pretty close approximation of "levelled" as you write it above. You may still be able to weakly fend off something (i.e. a 1-die parry), but that's about it.

[Tash]

(granted, never in an actual 'combat' situation, only sports or by accident)

That's the big difference, in an actual fight the adrenaline levels would be pumping high enough that there is so much potential for variance that you are better off going for something else.  There are easier things to hit that will drop someone faster.

Oh yeah, by "crippling" I meant "there is no way in hell this person has even the slightest chance of hurting me before I can get away".  In TRoS terms that would be 0 CP for at least 1-2 rounds.  In real life it basically boils down to unconscious, unable to stand or breath, completely under control via a lock or simillar move (and these are risky because you can't really "get away"), or dead.