[Charnel Gods] Primal Twilight Epoch/Setting

[Old_Scratch]

Primal Twilight

The land and the verdant forests that cover it are ancient and untouched. Great trees tower towards the heavens, their roots reaching down too deep, and their boughs burdened by the millennia. Beneath these dark eaves prowl animals bloated in size and age and power. But this is a land that is damned and its fate sealed, for the instruments of its destruction have only recently appeared: humanity and the weapons that call out to mortal souls. And thus the world and its forests enter their primal twilight, but not peacefully, but with a vengeance, for the creatures and the forest itself begin to stir...

I'm hoping to play a bit this summer and want a few epochs lined up for the future. I tend to overdevelop a setting, so I'm trying to provide a rough sketch - this is where I'm asking for you to help. I'd like to hear your first thoughts and contributions...

What does the above description suggest? What does it evoke? What would you populate this world with? What kind of characters do you envision? What sources or inspirations would you recommend?

Basically, I'm just looking for different perspectives on this setting than the one I already have...

Thanks!

--==--
Garett

[Judd]

It reminds me of the Corum series, books that I have just recently gotten into re-reading.

Its first paragraphs are:

"In those days there were oceans of light and cities in the skies and wild flying beasts of bronze. There were herds of crimson cattle that roared and were taller than castles. There were shrill, veridian things that haunted bleak rivers. It was a time of gods, manifesting themselves upon our world in all her aspects; a time of giants who walked on water; of mindless sprites and misshapen creatures who could be summoned by ill-considered thought but driven away only on pain of some fearful sacrifice; of magics, phantasms, unstable nature, impossible events, insane paradoxes, dreams come true, dreams gone awyry, of nightmares assuming reality.".

I picture a boy in the forest who has never aged, carrying a katana that used to be made of living wood but has died recently, so now the wood is petrified, hard, sharp and brittle.

A Lady in the Lake who holds a sword she has bequeathed to countless kings with her right hand, still clad in finest samite, her left hand, nothing more than a bloated tentacle was always deep underwater.

A woodsman who has killed countless cities in the name of cities and civilization.  Now there are no easy trees left to cut down, only old, brutal bastards and his axe, it hungers.

A decrepite lion, last of his ilk, with only one eye and whose teeth have fallen out of his head.  His roar can still summon all of the creatures of the forest but when he summons them, will they listen to their ancient king anymore, now that he is old and dying?

Cool shit as always, Old Scratch.  Some day we've gotta game together.

[Old_Scratch]

Thanks Paka for the feedback. I was hoping for some more ideas and the like, since I've sort of found myself running down a single track. I particularly like your focus on potential PCs and NPCs. (Paka: Hope you're enjoying Corum, I really enjoyed the first trilogy - it gave my the idea for our first Sorcerer game. And as for meeting up and gaming - if you're ever out on the West Coast, I'll take you up on that offer! Likewise, if I make it out to NY any time soon, expect a drop-in player!)

Anyhow, I hope more of you contribute. Here were my rough notes on the setting:

World is young – for mortals that is... For the animals and the forests, they waited with dread for millennia for humans to arrive – and the animals have not forgotten their long period of dominance, they have awakened, and they fear the weapons and secrets that the humans will unearth.

The Animals

Powerful, fell beasts, centuries old rule the forests, the mightiest of them giant dire creatures, some with the powers of speech and reason.

Giant animals who speak laboriously from dark caverns or from the hearts of darkened forest glens.

Most animals can not speak, but can act through the will of the Elders.

Some animals are needy – ancient rivalries still torment them, animals craving to become the eldest, who might turn to humans to undo their rivals.

Animals can fall under control – become Tainted in a sense and rejected – bands of these rejected animals become a menace to others...

The Forest

Giant trees towering above the mortals – trees thousands of years old with no time or patience for the younger races... Some have turned dark and menacing as their roots dig into the Charnel Fields – and thus the old forests are the most dangerous. Sometimes pools of dark fluid, god and monster blood rise to the surface – what if an Elder Animal partakes of it? Some animals, perhaps dying, go there, and come back transformed and monstrous.

Some of the ancient trees have roots that run deep... very deep... so deep they feed off the dead gods and have awakened with terrible knowledge! What do they urge the creatures of the forest to do?

The People

Many human societies have totems, worship the Elder Animals who make demands of them: no writing, no venturing into the Old Lands from which the animals and humans came. Old, haunted creatures guard the entryway from the Old Lands. Those foolhardy souls bringing back artifacts from the Old Lands are reviled and pursued from their people. The people of the forest may live in the bared root systems of trees, in tree houses, or in great communal mounds from which they war against the People Who Have Forgotten.

The People Who Have Forgotten are those who mine and till the soil and make crude iron implements. They cling to the mountain and hillsides and have emerged from their caves in the hillsides, some bearing terrible weapons and knowledge. Using these terrible weapons as inspiration, they burn down forests and rip up the earth in an effort to create similar weapons with which they war against their own kind and forest.

The Nameless

The Nameless lurk, revealing secrets – a trail of footprints may lead to the Charnel Fields, or an ancient crone may offer prophesies to entice and command.

Some Inspirations:

These have images or ideas that contributed in some small manner to the setting...

Princess Monoke and the giant boars

General Woundwort from Watership Down

H. R. Pufnstuf

The Pig Head and The Beast from The Lord of the Flies

Nicodemus from Mrs. Brisby and the Rats of Nimh

RE Howard's Conan vs. the Pict stories.

Hunter and the Beasts in Gaiman's Neverwhere (Chapter 15).

I want to include The Land of the Lost because it would be cool to have some creepy reptilian Sleestacks running amok beneath the forest, but I want to avoid any giant dinosaur type things. I like the idea of the Sleestacks being survivals from a past epoch and working against humanity in an attempt to stave off the inevitable...

[hardcoremoose]

Yep, I was going to say Princess Mononoke.  I was watching Miyazaki while Charnel Gods was coming together, and I think the imagery in Mononoke is well-suited to the game (plus the hero is badass with that bow, and has a cool animal companion to boot).  

One of these days I'd like to track down the original script to that film and find out what Gaiman did to it.

- Scott

[Judd]

Aye, Old Scratch, what are the one-sheet details?

Humanity?

What are demons and what are sorcerers?

You know the drill.

I'm curious, what is the conflict in this game?

[sirogit]

One of these days I'd like to track down the original script to that film and find out what Gaiman did to it.

Always suspecting poor little Neil. Never let the poor white-fro'd man have a chance.

Humanity?

What are demons and what are sorcerers?

If this is Charnel Gods, they'd be set to "Doing good for the world", "Fell weapons" and "Their wielders", right?

For some reason, this really makes me think of Kurosawa's Throne of Blood. Paticularly the contrasting themes of pristine serenity and pure animalism. Those would make pretty sweet Will descriptors.

A sinister in-bred nature cult populating the deepest of the forest led by a scruffy, soft-spoken charistmatic wild man with signs carved into his face. Kind of a Manson family in the trees.

[Judd]

Duh, its Charnel Gods.

Sorry, dumb question.

[Old_Scratch]

Aye, Old Scratch, what are the one-sheet details?

Humanity?

Well, yet it is Charnel Gods, but I think that Humanity can vary a little from setting to setting, and in this case, I want the humanity to have a sort of civilization vs nature feel to it. In this sense, the Charnel God weapons are the "Black Monolith" pushing humanity towards the inevitable.

What are demons and what are sorcerers?

Obviously weapon bearers, but how are they perceived? They are the leaders of the mountain clans who rule from their benighted clan lodges where their weapons whisper to them in the dead of night of future glories and reminding them of ancient injuries. They are the wandering prophets uniting the impoverished mountain clans that cling to their rudimentary cave shelters, or the mad magi who maniacally lead their servants in the production of iron weapons deep in their temple-forges. The Sorcerers are those Forest outcasts who penetrate deep into the forests, urged on by poisoned trees to gather up a harvest of bloodied steel.

I'm curious, what is the conflict in this game?

The flavor of the conflict in the one I've described has a civilization vs nature feel, but I don't want it that simple. I want Nature itself to be in conflict: a Giant Bear poisoned by the Fell Weapon lodged in its side that drives the Bear to slake its unholy thirst for flesh and blood, a tree that has roots that feast off the flesh of long-dead gods, of Nature driven to fury against outsiders that threaten it and taint it. I want a very complicated image.

This is just one take. I hope more people can weigh in with different perspectives of ideas. I posted the original prompt not as a means of "showing" off a particular idea, but of sparking a lot of possibilities of a world in which humanity appeared late and nature ruled over the lands.

The idea could have easily gone to a sort of Mayan or Aztec route with no or few domesticated animals, a byzantine calendar that predicts the end of the world, and distorted beliefs of human sacrifice that will allow the sun to rise and keep the night at bay - the very mythology of the Charnel Gods world but warped. Everything is great until a Fell Weapon is unearthed and the gods of the forest: the alligator god and the jaguar god and the coatl god, lead the other city states against the city state armed with Fell Weapons. The very jungle itself swallows alive city states and its occupants, leaving ghostly ruins behind.

Or a world where Nature is distorted by the belief that the world itself may end and that nature is not idyllic, but a cruel mother with an appetite for eating her young. Nature itself ruthlessly hunts down humans, and the only way for humans to survive is to seek out Fell Weapons to save their own wandering nomadic people from the very land that seeks to devour them, and thus nature's hatred of humans and its own fear of destruction drive the end that much closer.

I guess, I'm looking for a lot of variations or deviations of the original concept: What if nature fought back against its own demise?

[Old_Scratch]

A sinister in-bred nature cult populating the deepest of the forest led by a scruffy, soft-spoken charistmatic wild man with signs carved into his face. Kind of a Manson family in the trees.

Don't stop now! I'm still listening intently... Keep going...

[sirogit]

Did you want me to expand a bit on the nature-cult-thing? I could do so later if you want. Here's some other ideas:

Among both tribal and civilized folk, the elders warn of the wanderers of the woods. Their presence is known by the an often-played flute melody which echos off of beaten paths from a traceless direction. Their presence is also noted by any spell of good or bad luck that occurs to the people.

These wanderers have an amazing variety of roles in local stories, from bandits, to lost children, to rapists, to romantic lost spirits, to deranged lycanthropes, to any and all combinations of the above.

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There's a whole lot of awesome things you could do with corpses of past epochs... ingrained into the roots of the trees so that they make twisted wooden forms hardly recognizable as their past selves, both human and monstrous. A Fell Wwapon held by its former bearer(Better if its an old PC) in a battle pose. His wood-coated body's shape the most preserved of all the other corpses. A halo of spiraling tendrils surrounding him, the oak grown between his mouth obscuring what must have been his last wail, now silent.

A torso of a woman from another epoch, covered in vines which still slowly feed from her decomposing frame, her bust barely a clump with the remnants of arms attached, but her face preserving clearly an expression of pure agony. A shaman took her body and relocated it to his hut, and begs for the revelation of the ancients every day, but she constantly denies him.

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A mythic land that lies above the clouds, made of a humongous nest of giant bramble. There sit monks contemplating the nature of the apocalypse, and hatch half-hearted plans to preserve the relics, art and beauty that they hold with them tightly, saddened at the thought of their future.

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I'd really like to see some Descriptors and Pasts. Here's some of my own:

Stamina:
Animalistic: Your mind and body is constantly unfurling into action. You're inspired by some combination of insanity, adrenaline and zest for life.

Youthfull Exuberence: The natural bounce and electricity in your step has not yet faded away. Can be applicable to many ages.

Iron Soldier: You benefit from weapons of Iron and sophisticated warrior training.

Will:

Serenity: You have a powerfull sense of calmness and ease around you. You can say quite abit with very little.

Bold: Afraid of neither what lies beyond what you call home or to make your mind known.

Mature: The forests engender a certain subtle, often jaded kind of wisdom when one has progressed mentally above one's surroundings. Can be applicable to many ages.

Pasts:

Miner
Politician
Wanderer
Monk of the Bramble

[Danny_K]

This setting is reminding me a lot of Mirkwood in LotR, where, IIRC, the number one rule is "don't screw with the trees".  

The archetypal Fell Weapon is the ax, of course, and all the creatures of the forest recognize and hate the man who bears one.  The Fell Ax represents the purest negation of the forest, and the mere threat of its use drives the spirits of the forest mad with fear and anger.  They warp themselves in terrible ways to strike back at the Sorcerers.

If you're going with this idea, then the most interesting flashpoint of conflicts are those villages and dwellings at the edge of the forest, or even a bit inside... those groups of nomadic or sessile people who live in some sort of balance with the forest.  That balance will tip one way or the other as the Sorcerers and the champions of the Forest come forth: some Villages will thrive, undergoing a population explosion as they bring more land under cultivation, and others may become ghost towns, nearly depopulated except for a few wretched survivors.

[hix]

So are there 2 types of Fell Weapons in this setting - and therefore 2 different types of Apocalypse?

The Fell Weapons of Nature envy and hate the humans and their cities. They long for the ancient trees to swarm over the towers and temples, crack them into ruins and leave the land in the silence of the wilderness, uninterrupted by the babble of civilised tongues.

The Fell Weapons of Civilisation (Axes, fer instance) demand progress. They want a sterile land devoid of green ... and eventually incapable of supporting life.

[Danny_K]

Having two types of Fell Weapons seems inelegant to me; if it were my call, I'd probably make up some sort of "Fell Beast" using the beastmaster rules someone posted on this forum a while back, and have huge hoary legendary beasts from the deep o' the wood as the other flavor of Demon.  For added fun, make them Immanents that can only be Pacted with.

[hix]

I know what you mean about inelegant. Originally I thought this setting was all about nature ripping things apart - then I saw the opportunity for a mirror.

Anyway, I'm off to look for these beastmaster rules. And "Immanents" and "Pacting", ... that's & Sword, right?

[Old_Scratch]

I know what you mean about inelegant. Originally I thought this setting was all about nature ripping things apart - then I saw the opportunity for a mirror.

Anyway, I'm off to look for these beastmaster rules. And "Immanents" and "Pacting", ... that's & Sword, right?

Immanents and Pacting are in & Sword. The Beastmaster thread is here:

http://www.indie-rpgs.com/viewtopic.php?t=5940

And in Charnel Gods the only real source for Sorcery are the Fell Weapons, so there are basically only the Fell Weapons available as Demons, but the Fell Beasts, using them similar to Demons that are Immanents and can only be Pacted with is the original concept I had as well.