[Coat of Arms] first draft

[MikeSands]

In terms of dealing with the dice mechanics you had in mind not matching what you want to happen...

I think that a lot of people design this backwards - picking a nifty system and then tinkering until it fits what they want. You should sit down and think about:

1. How often should rolls succeed and fail?
2. What other mechanical aspects of the game can contribute (and how much do they affect the chances of success/failure)?

This should give you something useful to work from.

The other thing to be careful about with nifty systems is that a lot of them are complex, so working out the actual probabilities can be difficult. There's a lot to be said for a really boring, but completely clear die mechanic.

[pasoliati]

Remember, whiff factor only comes into play when failures deprotagonize the characters. As long as failures are as interesting as successes, which is often the case in Conflict Resolution, there's no whiff.

True, but these are knights.  I like to think that they succeed.  But I guess they succeed at every conflict that doesn't go to the dice.

The other thing to be careful about with nifty systems is that a lot of them are complex, so working out the actual probabilities can be difficult. There's a lot to be said for a really boring, but completely clear die mechanic.

I'm a roleplayer, I substituted randomness for complexity in my model. :)

But you are right, there are a lot of choices that a player can make to increase or decrease their odds.  The simulation that I run right now has just one dice pool, and the players will have at least three traits and three tenets (god I need a better name) and they can combine two pools so 9 possible dice pools that can be rolled.  Also, the player did better in my simulations when I made the CR (conflict rating or challenge rating) a random number between 1 and 5.

But the dice mechanic isn't the best part of the game, the players and what the players do are.  Last night I had two ideas.  I fleshed out the concept of player generated quests a bit more (not that it could be fleshed out any less) and I added an new idea called "motif".

A quest can be generated by either players or a gm.  If generated by players, they have to spend legend points on it (the more legend points, the more challenging and the more rewarding).  A quest should have the following pieces: name, goal, motif, challenge 1, challenge 2, twist, final challenge, and trophy and title.  When it first starts, a quest should only have a name and a goal, and maybe a motif.  The first two challenges should not be pre-determined and are more like a check list, as the players face a suitable challenges that have to do with the quest, you should just note which conflicts were retroactively planned to be there.  And it is also a warning that you should throw in a twist and the final challenge soon.  The trophy and the title are the rewards of the quest.  The trophy is something physical that the character walks away with (be it the horn of the dragon or just a nasty scar from the princess's backstabbing) and the title should be something like "the dragonslayer" or something meaningful from the quest that people will know the knight by now.  (OK title was just thought up as I was typing this and needs a lot more work)

Motif is a way for the players and the GM to introduce and reinforce color (and maybe themes) into the shared imagined space.  Like quests, a motif costs one legend point for a player to introduce.  They then take a piece of paper or an index card and write the name of the motif on top of it (like "blue" or "rebirth" or "dragons" or "high king").  Then, in the course of play every time that a motif is referred to by symbol (like if a motif was "dragon" maybe noticing clouds is like seeing dragons flying) and the GM agrees, the player writes the symbol under the motif and initials the back.  If the symbol is already listed, the player circles it instead.  If the symbol is circled, it is crossed off. If the symbol is crossed off, they can't use it (symbols can only be used three times).  A player can't reference the same motif twice until everyone around the table has.  Once everyone around the table has referenced the motif (their initials are all on the back), they all get a legend point (or two or three, I'm still working it out) and the initials are crossed off and they can start all over again.  Also, if a legend uses one or more motifs, it will be worth two legend points.

So now outside of their characters, a player can add legends, motif, and quests to the world.

[Josh Roby]

True, but these are knights.  I like to think that they succeed.  But I guess they succeed at every conflict that doesn't go to the dice.

Not to be pedantic, but have you read Morte d'Arthur, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, or the Song of Roland recently?

[pasoliati]

There is a legend whispered about the death of that first knight who was Baptized in the Well.  It is whispered becasue many knights take offence at it.  With his great power, the first knight had done many deeds, but still he was restless.  He had given up the sword and taken up the bottle.  One night a man found him drunk and naked, crying in a Church of the Drowned God.  The knight slurred, but every word that he said burned into the memory of his listener.  He said "After I died in the Well, I was taken to the City of Gold found beneath the waves where the Drowned God takes the souls of the weary and gives them rest.  The City was beautiful, mere words cannot describe its glory.  I walked up to the Gates of the City, but they wouldn't open for me.  I saw the people inside, my friends, my family, and even my lord just murdered.  But for all of my yelling, they would not hear me or come to help me.  After I gave up, I found a man next to me.  For all the glory of the City, He was even more glorious and I knew at once that I was in the presence of the Drowned God Himself."

Then knight cried again and his listener tried to console him to no avail.  After awhile the knight found the strength to talk again.  "He smiled at me, a sad sort of smile and in that smile I heard words, not in my ears but in my soul, He said to me 'You have taken your own life and cannot enter into the City.  But in My mercy, I give you one more chance.  I will return you to a foreign country, a foreign time.  You will be alone.  But the glory of the City has filled you, you will from hence forth have the strength of ten men.  Use that strength for good all you days and I will allow you into the City when next you return.  Use that strength for evil, and I shall cast thee out.'  All this he said to me in a smile.  I begged him to let me stay there outside of the Gates so that I could see the City forever, but he would not respond.  I then begged him to let me forget the City and the pain, but he would not.  But he did say that if any followed me, he would be merciful and take from them the memory of their failed lives and the memories of the City."

At that, according to the legends, the first knight did throw himself back into the Well, never to be heard from again.  The legend is whispered, because may knights take offence at its telling.  But that is the legend of the first knight, from the beginning to the end back to the beginning again.