[Fantasy Non-Heartbreaker] First Playtest

[marknau]

I conducted a one-hour playtest of my WIP, the result of which follows. What I'd like is to get some attention focused on the core mechanic: Successes, Dings, Complications, and Events. I've got some specific questions at the end.

System synopsis:
Players all collaboratively make characters, connect them in some way, and construct enough of the Setting to provide a skeleton for play. I play GM, and have sole authority for scene framing, and default authority over plot and narration (not character actions, however), as well as over the development of content (which always happens in-play.) Players are free to narrate their own actions, and the core mechanic hands authority over to them whenever they are willing to "Roll For It."

Mechanic synopsis:
Rolls will generate some number of Successes (0-2), and some number of Dings (negative consequences). Player rolls a number of ten-sided dice (typically 5-8), then decides how many Successes he wants to extract from the roll. Starting from the lowest die and working up, 0-2 dice are set aside, one for each Success. Then, the value of the lowest remaining die is the number of Dings (negative consequences) that result.

Successes allow the player to specify facts about the game content and/or present situation, and also progress the party toward completion of this Chapter (session) ala InSpectre's Franchise Dice. For a one-hour session, I have established a target of 15 total Successes until the Chapter is completed.

Other features of the system necessitate treating the whole party as unit with respect to Successes. They earn progress through the campaign by collectively accumulating Successes Chapter by Chapter. This allows the group control over the pacing and length of the whole campaign.

In the interests of time, I had constructed some character sheets and a barebones setting based on some email conversations among the players. In the actual event, this would take up about an hour of the first session as we collaborate.

Characters:
Corwin is a Grey-Mouser in training. He's back home visiting Mom and Sis in the market town he grew up in. Mom doesn't know the source of the money he brings home from the city. Finn is a friend of the family, and runs the local inn.

Van is a merchant's traveling agent who is actually a spy for a neighboring country. The country he is spying on has just had a young prince ascend, with a Regent taking power in a potentially questionable manner. Van has been given a minor assignment: meet with Finn. The local Baron is new, and it all seems fishy.

Linus is a flashy anime sort of wizard. Quick and decent with a sword. He's in the area to search local ruins for artifacts. I didn't tease any relationships out of the player, but figured it wouldn't be a problem for a simple playtest.


Scene 1: You all meet in a tavern...

After consulting with the players a bit, I put Van inside the inn, waiting for a good time to talk with Finn. Linus is arriving into town, Corwin is visiting some people outside, nearby. Four horsemen dressed in the local Baron's livery ride up to the inn and go inside. The men stride up to Finn, unroll a Writ and inform him he will be taken to the Baron's residence to face charges of Witchcraft and Treason.

I assign this Event the maximum strength I am allowed to: 3 (equal to # of players). This means the situation will linger until the players have scored 3 Successes toward resolving it in some way, or they decide to concede the Event to me to narrate however I wish. Corwin runs inside, demanding to know what the men mean by all this, trying to drag off a respected citizen. He rolls 1,2,4,4,6,7,9. He sets the 1 aside to get a single Success, and then takes 2 Dings (equal to the lowest remaining die.)  I write "Corwin has defied the Baron" on an index card, and put 2 markers on it. This is a Complication of strength 2, and represents some trouble that will visit itself on the party some time in the future, possibly later this Chapter, possibly further down the road. For his Success, Corwin's player says that the townsfolk in the inn are crowding around to demand answers. He can't clear the Baron's men out yet, because the Event is strength 3 and they have only scored one Success against it so far.

Van takes this opportunity to rabble-rouse among the denizens of the inn. Roll is 0,2,5,5,7,8,9. He takes one Success and two dings. I make a Complication card "suspicious stranger causing trouble" and put 2 markers on it. Player says that the crowd backs the Baron's increasingly worried men outside into the street, where a larger crowd is attracted.

No-one else has a fresh idea immediately at hand, so I narrate some bluster and Linus's arrival onto the scene. Then, Corwin's 15-year-old sister appears on the roof of the inn, crossbow cocked, loaded, and aimed at one of the Baron's men. "Let him go," she shrieks. I pause. Check to see if anyone wants to roll. Not yet.

Chaos ensues, and she fires the crossbow at one of the Baron's men, hitting him in the shoulder. "Wait!" says Linus's character. Linus has a soft spot for women, children, and innocents. He uses his magic to make the bolt miss. It's not his specialty, but he does get an extra die for drawing on his "protect the innocent" motivation. Roll is 013677. He takes one Success and one Ding. I ask the players what might be appropriate for the Ding. Corwin's player volunteers that he saw Linus do something out of the corner of his eye, and thinks maybe this stranger is somehow involved with the Baron's men. Linus agrees, and I make a Complication "Corwin confused about Linus's role" with one marker.

Corwin appeals to the townspeople to drive the bastards out of town, and Van's player chooses to use a check-off ability on his sheet to assist the effort. Roll has two 0s, so they take one Success and no Dings. This is the third Success against the Event, so he gets to resolve it. The Baron's men beat a retreat out of town as children throw rocks at their backs.


Scene 2: A bit later, inside the inn

Finn, the momentary local hero, lets the ale flow. Corwin's Sis comes rushing in, gives Finn a big hug. Corwin begins to lecture her about the crossbow incident. Does he want to roll? Nope. "But, I LOVE him." They bicker a little bit, she throwing his history back in his face at every turn. She leaves. Linus's player says he wants to get a magical "read" on the scene around Finn. 2 Successes, 2 Dings. He says Finn is a Doppelganger, and his aura is strong, as if he's recently feasted. I have the Doppelganger stare right into Linus's eyes as he reads him, and make a Complication "Doppelganger hates Linus" with 2 markers. Van talks to Doppelganger Finn, but doesn't get the spy contact counterphrase back. His mission looks like a scrub, and he's unsure what to do. Meanwhile, Corwin loses himself in a mug of ale.


Scene 3: Dusk, a couple of hours later

Linus heads out towards the ruins to do some advance scouting. On the way, he sees two men scuffling on the ground. I offer him the chance to roll. Declined. He casts a magical light over the men to see what is going on. The man on top turns and looks at the wizard, his lower jaw fresh with blood. The man on bottom is badly hurt, and seems identical to his attacker. I declare the Event to be of strength 2.

Linus rolls to blast the new Doppelganger out of existence. 2 Successes, no Dings. Kerblam, problem solved. Then he magically heals the worst of the victim's wounds (1 Success, no Dings). The man is unconscious, but stable. Linus drags him back to town, bringing him to the church. The old crone inside takes one look at the two of them and starts to shuffle-run away. Linus convinces her he has noble intent, so she agrees to take the victim in. 1 Success, 1 Ding. "This is magical healing," says the crone. "You're not registered, are you?" And I make a Complication "Linus is an unregistered Wizard" with 1 marker.


Scene 4: Outside the inn

Drunken Corwin staggers home, Van tailing him discreetly. Corwin sees Linus leave the church. I point to the Complication "Corwin confused about Linus's role," and suggest that this might be a good time to resolve this. They agree. It is a one-strength Event, so it takes one Success to clear.

Corwin confronts Linus, with drunken accusations of being a spy for the Baron. Linus's player says he tries to reason with Corwin, rolling 14669. He takes 0 Success in order to limit the backlash to 1 Ding. Corwin takes a swing at the mage, hitting him for a point of damage. Linus uses a check-off ability on his sheet to avoid it with a lightning-quick dodge.

Van uses his superior abilities to read people and situations to straighten everything out. 023557899. He takes one Success and 2 Dings. I add the two Dings to "Linus is an unregistered Wizard" as Van lets that fact slip as one of his keen observations on the situation.


Scene 5: Immediately thereafter

A large party on horseback is approaching. The band of three run into the shadows of a nearby alley to see who approaches. It is more of the Baron's men, more than a dozen this time. About half form up outside the inn as a picket as the others storm inside in search of Finn. I pause and look around. No-one wants to bite yet. Sis starts screaming from inside the inn.

Corwin tries to rush through the picket, as Linus follows. Corwin's roll is aided by Linus's illusion magic check-off box, and he gets one Success and no Dings. We're at 12 total Successes for the Chapter now, and 15 is the target. I'm holding 3 in reserve for the finale, so this is time for it.

As they get inside, they hear Sis's screams from upstairs, and the leader of the men is coming down. "He's not here. Search the town."

Linus, in his Baron's-soldier illusion disguise, heads upstairs as Corwin gets hassled a bit by the men downstairs. Linus finds Sis in a near panic in the upstairs bedroom. Which is when she attacks him with her claws and sharp fangs.

This is a 3 strength Event, I declare. And, I'm adding the 2 markers from "Doppelganger hates Linus," for this is the same one as was posing as Finn before. 5 Successes they need. I declare the combat situation a Crisis, which means everyone gets to roll at the same time, and they must immediately collectively allot 5 Successes and then deal with the Dings.

Linus blasts the beast: 0014688
Corwin uses his natural stealth as well as sword and ambush check-offs from his sheet to roll 9 dice: 011225689
Van shoots arrows through the window: 15778

They decide that Linus will allot 2 Successes and take 1 Ding, Corwin 4 Successes (In a Crisis, a player may allot more than 2 Successes at a time) with 2 Dings, and Van 0 Successes with 1 Ding. As it is a combat situation, I give them all damage for their Dings.
They took 6 Successes instead of the 5 they needed so that they could specify an extra fact in the Epilogue: Sis is still alive. They find her folded up inside the trunk at the foot of the bed.

End of session.


Questions:
It seems like I may have overloaded Successes quite a lot mechanically. They are both the way that the party makes progress, and the only way the players can grab authority from me. Can that be made to work, or am I headed for irreconcilable trouble?

Rolling For It is risky, since it can spawn Dings. Is that an unreasonable barrier to seeking progress and increased authority? As a player, would you view that mechanic as being discouraging to your participation?

Theoretically, a party could be very active in Rolling For It, even to take control over trivial matters. If you were to be the GM for this system, would you want a formal mechanism for reining that in, or would you just handle it by fiat?

There are instances where I would be hard pressed to come up with a Complication that is logically related to the situation that spawned the Dings. Would it seem OK to you as a player if the GM were free to allot Dings into Complications without regard to logical connectedness? What if the GM could take some Dings as generic Complication points to be used as he saw fit to add to the strength of Events down the road?

One of my current design goal is to allow N-G hybrid play. Does that seem feasible? What changes would you like to see to accomodate that? Or am I just dreaming?

And lastly, please feel free to comment on the general feel the system gives you, particularly if you see any troublesome gaps or potential for mechanical breakdown in certain circumstance.

[timfire]

Hi,

This interests me, as the ding thing is simliar to what I've been trying to achieve in one of my designs. A couple questions:

What's a complication, and how does it come into play? You ask about it, but don't explain it.

Also, it seems that dings can spiral out of control, as it *seems* that a player will always roll more dings than he does success. Has this happened in your playtests?

As far as your questions go, you could allow players to declare their own dings (as in, generally declare the spin off complication/conflict). That would take some burden off you and give them more narration-input.

For me, the dings are a real draw. I love the idea of conflicts spinning off from one another. I don't see them as a penalty, I see them as a plus. But that's me.

I also don't see an issue with letting a player roll as much as they want. Since they're guarrenteed dings, there's a price to pay for rolling. If they're willing to pay that price, why should you care? Also, since rolling guarentees dings and thus future conflicts related to it, rolling itself is a flag---rolling is basically the player saying, "this thing interests me and I want to see more of it". It's a subtle but powerful way to give players power.

There's no such thing as a N-G hybrid. They never work. You either have a strategic Nar game or a tactical game with alot of thematic symbolism. But don't worry about that. Make the game you want and let the game be what it is. Your excitement about the game will be what makes it good.

[Adam Dray]

I think from the examples, it really works well. I love it. Love love love it.

I think the successes work fine. I like that you have an escape valve (take 0 successes to avoid the ding) but I'm not fond of where you put it. I'd have allowed the player to forfeit the entire conflict to avoid the ding. That is, they drop out and whatever happens to them, happens.

The Rolling For It rule seems to totally cool. It's essentially "say yes or roll the dice," but it's aimed at the players. The GM carries narrational authority until interrupted by a player wanting to roll dice. A fascinating twist on the Dogs in the Vineyard play procedure. I think it works. It does seem to yank plot authority and situational authority into one big pile and give it to the GM, though. Do players have any control of where the story goes without grabbing narrational authority by rolling for it and hoping to influence the follow-up conflicts that the GM makes up?

Can you give me an example of a situation you can't think of a Ding for?  You might just allow the player or GM to roll the Dings into extra dice for other side in the next conflict.

What specifically do you mean by Nar-Gam play? Do you mean one player having two agendas during play? I'm pretty sure the Big Model doesn't do that, since creative agenda manifests over a full reward cycle. If you mean multiple players having different agendas during play, I'm not sure how you'd keep them from strangling each other at the table, or just completely talking past each other, at best. Personally, I think you're dreaming.

But, man, keep dreaming about this game system, cuz it's fantastic! It really seems to capture the essence of follow-up conflicts and drive plot from one thing to the next.

[marknau]

Tim,
First off: Thanks for reading my playtest!

What's a complication, and how does it come into play? You ask about it, but don't explain it.

Rolling For It produces some number of Successes and some number of Dings. Dings translate into either Complications or Damage. All the times where I was putting tokens on the index cards, that was translating Dings into Complications. We had very few instances of Dings into Damage.

Also, it seems that dings can spiral out of control, as it *seems* that a player will always roll more dings than he does success. Has this happened in your playtests?

Yes, sort of. Mathematically, I know that Successes and Dings will tend to be about equal when the player rolls 8 dice. Starting characters will typically roll less than that, so Dings>Successes. However, some number of those Dings will become Damage, and I plan on allowing some amount of Damage to heal between missions. Also, in the "first Act" portion of the campaign, I want the party to be accumulating Complications faster than they resolve them. I'm thinking that the players will improve, so that they typically roll more dice. That will help them "mop up" many of the lesser Complications during the "second Act."

As far as your questions go, you could allow players to declare their own dings (as in, generally declare the spin off complication/conflict). That would take some burden off you and give them more narration-input.

For me, the dings are a real draw. I love the idea of conflicts spinning off from one another. I don't see them as a penalty, I see them as a plus. But that's me.

I also don't see an issue with letting a player roll as much as they want. Since they're guarrenteed dings, there's a price to pay for rolling. If they're willing to pay that price, why should you care? Also, since rolling guarentees dings and thus future conflicts related to it, rolling itself is a flag---rolling is basically the player saying, "this thing interests me and I want to see more of it". It's a subtle but powerful way to give players power.

I like what you said all in here, and I think it's subtly shifted my thinking toward clarity. Thanks for your perspective!

There's no such thing as a N-G hybrid. They never work. You either have a strategic Nar game or a tactical game with alot of thematic symbolism. But don't worry about that. Make the game you want and let the game be what it is. Your excitement about the game will be what makes it good.

One of the initial "sparks" for the project was to try to "beat the system," but I think I've gotten all the juice out of that and am just going to do what you say: run forward with what gets me excited and see where it leads.

[marknau]

Adam,

Thanks for the reply!

I think the successes work fine. I like that you have an escape valve (take 0 successes to avoid the ding) but I'm not fond of where you put it. I'd have allowed the player to forfeit the entire conflict to avoid the ding. That is, they drop out and whatever happens to them, happens.

I'm not understanding what you are suggesting here. Are you suggesting a mechanism for a pre-emptive forfeit?

(Rolling For It) ...does seem to yank plot authority and situational authority into one big pile and give it to the GM, though. Do players have any control of where the story goes without grabbing narrational authority by rolling for it and hoping to influence the follow-up conflicts that the GM makes up?

Rolling For It really is the player's primary lever. They have some additional power in the start of a session, where the group decides what kind of mission they want. I'm also going to focus on Tim's suggestion of enhancing the players' ability to determine what Complications arise from Dings. If the players have a lot of say in what Complications get fed, then they have a greater voice in the overall shape of the story.

But, man, keep dreaming about this game system, cuz it's fantastic! It really seems to capture the essence of follow-up conflicts and drive plot from one thing to the next.

I appreciate the encouragement!

[Adam Dray]

Pre-emptive forfeit, indeed. Yes. Think about Dogs in the Vineyard. We're shooting at each other. I Raise 8+9 and you look at your dice and have 6 4 4 3 1 1. You'll need 6+4+4+3 to See the 17 I pushed forward and you'll take 4d10 freaking dice of Fallout. My Raise was narrated as, "I fire my giant shotgun at you. I also catch little five year-old Sally with the shot, probably killing her." You'd really rather not take that Fallout and you really don't want to let Sally get hit so you Give. You just pre-empted my Raise. You suffer none of the consequences of it. You lose the entire Conflict, however.

[Steven Stewart]

This sounds a lot like a game I have as a WIP that I am currently playtesting and revising. I would be interested in getting more information when it is available. Not cause I want to rip ideas (but I do that to ;) but because I believe in the don't do it if something does it better, so I would be interested in seeing what it does in total, cause if it fits what I need, I would just play it and stop with my own game.  Do you have any plans for taking it to the next level such as creating a playtest document for distrubution to groups or publishing?

Cheers,

[marknau]

Steven,

I need to do some fiddling with the long-term mathematics of the game, then do more me-driven playtesting. My next step would be to generate a playtest-ready document to distribute to external playtest groups. When I'm at that stage, I will surely solicit for help on the "Connections" forum.