D20 Lite Variant

[dindenver]

Hi!
  Gary, have you seen this?
http://members.shaw.ca/LeviK/Perfect20_2006.pdf
  It has some of the stuff you are talking about already, FYI...

  I think what Callan is talking about has merit. Specifically, we are in a grey area when this subject comes up, no? What I mean is, the Player is in charge of his character and what his char says and does. And the GM is in charge of everything else. BUT, this is an area where these to touch and co-mingle. In other words, why does the PC's wife want to leave him? It had to be because of something the PC did or didn't do, no? And what id the player is not interested in this subplot? Shouldn't they have some control over this? I am not sure how I would make rules for this type of interaction, but if you feel that is a story element you want in your game, then you should try to codify when it is kosher and when it is crossing a line, no?

  Also, have you looked into conflict resolution? Meaning that instead of rolling for a task (I pick the safe), you roll for the conflict behind the task (I want to steal the Counts secret documents). If you have and are not interested, that's fune, but if you haven't or don't know what it is, it might be worthy of discussion here...

  Finally, I think that social conflicts should have a rules system. I think that there is skills, "weapons" (of a sort) and defenses that enter into social conflict that could be modeled fairly easily with your existing rules. You say that once someone has made up there mind, there is no changing it, but there are tons of examples in real life where that is just not true. Going into an electronics shop to get a cheap TV and coming out with one that requires financing. Going into a car dealer to get the car you researched and found on-line and leaving with a "better" car. Deciding to leave a man because he treats your poorly, but staying because he apologized and promised never to do it again...
  Life is full of people finding our social and mental weaknesses and exploiting them for their own gain. This should be possible, even preferable in a proper fantasy setting... And if you don't think so go back and read some of the classics. There is a lot of people thinking and weaseling themselves out of trouble...

  Anyways, sorry about the long post, but I sure hope it helps! Good luck man!

[Ron Edwards]

Hi there,

I think that you might get real pleasure from checking out the 3rd edition of the game Talislanta (1992) that Jonathan Tweet designed. Because basically, that's the chassis upon which D&D 3.0 was built (by Tweet and Monte Cook), and what you're doing with this thread is sort of stripping that process back down to the chassis.

What I'm hoping for is that you'll see a game which, I think, was written very much from the same philosophy that you're presenting here, and which will be a source of great inspiration. Instead of using like/unlike D&D as the creative process, you can examine your options relative to how it was done in Talislanta.

Best, Ron

[Eldrad]

Ron is right about Taslantia. Really cool rules lite system. 

I started to do a simplified version of the D20 system mixed with the 1974 rules (the little 3 books plus Blackmoor, Greyhawk, Eldridch Magic, Chainmail) with a bit of my own stuff. I wanted all the good things taken out of each version of the rules yet still leaving it as simple as the 1974 version.

You have the six attributes and that's what you play with. The attribute rolls are used for Attacks, Saves, Skills depending on what your race and class is. No skill or feats only a story.

There are HP and AC.

You pick out 2 primary attributes that you get +1 every level. Two secondary that you get +1 every 2 levels. Two minors at +1 every 4 levels.

A few examples of the rules were Fighters get to use all weapons and armor and get a bonus critical hits (from x2 dam to x3 damage) every few levels. Barbarians get to cleave enemies equal to their level +1.

Monsters have AC, HP, and Movement with only a little bit of details such as description and damage done. Monsters get a default +1 every 2 levels to skill,combat, and saves unless otherwise noted.

I had got it started on a yahoo group called CFRPD20 but I started working out of town and it kinda died.

I am glad to see that there are others out there wanting to do this from the response.

There is Basicfantasy (Free) and Castles and Crusades out there if you have not looked at those yet.