[Afraid / Hounds] Newcomer

[devonapple]

I'm working on a Call of Cthulhu adventure using the DitV system, and have run across both "Afraid" and "Hounds on the Moor" on these discussion boards.  I observed the corruption track to be very similar in both writeups, but only managed to stumble upon "Afraid" after several hours formatting/word-processing the "Hounds" rules for easier reference.

Is it accurate to say that "Afraid" is the direct heir of "Hounds on the Moor"?

[lumpley]

Here's the birth of Afraid: Delta Green in the Vineyard. Rustin posted about Hounds on the Moor a year later.

-Vincent

[lumpley]

Oh and I should warn you. There's only one person I know who can make Afraid fun, and I don't know how he does it. If I were you, I'd regard the Afraid rules with skepticism - unless you're that guy, it's probably not a playable game. (It's John Stavropolous.)

-Vincent

[devonapple]

If I were you, I'd regard the Afraid rules with skepticism - unless you're that guy, it's probably not a playable game.

Thank you for the suggestion.  I am currently trying to "find myself" again, as a GM, and am looking to try a narrative game system, such as DitV or Theatrix.  I have, of course, the standard "Call of Cthulhu" rules as well as the d20 "Call of Cthulhu" rules, and belong toa LARP troupe with a fairly stripped-down set of rules, but am wanting to experiment with game systems with narrative as the primary focus.  I will be sure to treat the untested "Afraid" rules with your pro viso, and ensure the players know it is experimental should I run an adventure for them using that ruleset. 

For a wayward GM eager to try something CoC-related using a narrative ruleset, would you recommend I make "Hounds" work, give "Afraid" a try, or find another system?

[devonapple]

Here's the birth of Afraid: Delta Green in the Vineyard. Rustin posted about Hounds on the Moor a year later.

Cool -- I've been looking into those rules as well, trying to kludge together a coherent whole to use.

[devonapple]

I observed the corruption track to be very similar in both writeups

Actually, chalk this up to working on both rulesets at the same time -- the corruption track was clearly from the "Delta Green" thread.  My apologies.

[Nathaniel]

Oh and I should warn you. There's only one person I know who can make Afraid fun, and I don't know how he does it. If I were you, I'd regard the Afraid rules with skepticism - unless you're that guy, it's probably not a playable game. (It's John Stavropolous.)

Any thoughts as to why that is?

My thinking is that in DitV, despite the fact that there is a clear goal or obvious "bad guy" (the influence of the demonic in the progress from pride to murder), those involved never cease to be humans.  When it all gets unraveled and it is time for the Dogs to pass judgement, it's still real people they are passing judgement on.

With the Monster, this is less the case.  Somewhere along the way, the Monster stopped being a human.  It's not really about the same powerful themes that get explored in DitV.  Maybe it can be or should be, but the fighting of the Monster is quite different than shining light on the sins of the Town.  Slaves, acolytes and the Monster itself are not simply weak beings to succumb to their own desires (the human condition), but active servants of something unnatural.  Maybe the distinction is just too clear in most games and that removes some of the poignancy of the exploration of certain themes that are quite powerful in DitV.

Thoughts?

[lumpley]

That's not what I'd've said, no. My reason for creating the game in the first place is that Dogs' rules' ability to handle genuine villains isn't being fully utilized by Dogs' play.

I think I need to figure out a new way for the monster to get, have, keep and roll dice. The problem's a mechanical one, not a thematic one. I'm pretty sure.

-Vincent

[Rustin]

Devon,
The closest thing I've done to play testing was Here.

I gathered those ideas on Hounds when I was very new to Indie games. I remember looking at the town creation rules and thinking of how to make a mystery out of it, but I must have read and subconsciously picked up on Vincent's Delta green notes.  Here I was thinking I had independently reached a similar method as Vincent in Afraid. A Leibniz to his Newton if you will... oh well.

I have another ideas with radically different mechanics from Dogs, which I never got completed enough to present to anyone in a serious way.  But if you're interested, let me know.

[devonapple]

The closest thing I've done to play testing was Here.

Thank you for the link, which then led me to opsneakie's playtest, upon which I was tempted to comment, but... old thread.

A question: The player that rolled a 5... were you using the DitV mechanics for character creation, or just the Monster creation mechanics (leaving the character mechanics in CoC or another system)?  I still have to actually play/run a DitV game, but I was sure stats were a dice pool, not a static rolled number.

From my reading of these threads, I am sure a GM would need to be clear with the players (if using the "Afraid" mechanic) that while combat is a facet of the gameplay, the object of the game is not to find the optimal mechanism for killing the monster in a standup fight, but to weaken it using research and indirect attacks before a final confrontation.

[Rustin]

Devon,
I was using Call of Cthulhu 5th ed. rules. (I know, not an ideal situation, but what can you do when players don't like trying new things).
I only used the monster creation rules from Afraid, with a bit of hounds-cthulhuesque flavor mixed in.

If you haven't read this one yet: Play test of Afraid

[devonapple]

If you haven't read this one yet: Play test of Afraid

Thanks for that link - a very encouraging playtest report.  I feel that I logically and rhetorically get the narrative story-focused concept of setting players up in their initial States, but in-play experimentation would be required to really prove or exercise that understanding.  At this point I've done a lot of reading, and not a lot of playing.