Those imaginary "other kinds" of RPGers

[Cranewings]

I think it is important for everyone playing a game to be clear on the definitions of roll playing games vs. story telling games or at the very least, have some idea that there are different ways to play, but we will all be playing by this one certain one.

A story teller player that is willing to dick his own character out of the fun of playing him that way can strait up ruin a game by taking a scene that should have been won and over and turning it into a circus. Players that are trying to, "win the game," are a major problem when the DM is trying to rail road them along a certain story. All the rail roading tricks (limited character knowledge, one advantageous, obvious path, the threat of powerful NPCs, DMPCs), won't make a player that is trying to win happy with the game.

A lot of conflict just comes from people not being clear and honest about what they expect. I recently had a come to Jesus meeting with a couple of my gamers where I told them if they made and rped characters that couldn't approach a fire fight and the legal ramification's correctly, their characters would simply die and they would be fucked into making new ones.

[Noclue]

...and 50 more points if you took 50 additional disadvantages. 

Y'know that part of Champions used to make all sorts of sense to me back in the day, but now it makes basically zero sense. Why should I need points for taking cool disadvantages? The implication is that the disads without the points would detract from your fun and you have to be bribed into taking them, but their actually where the fun is hiding.

[chance.thirteen]

It makes sense, at least for some of the Disadvantages. Champions point build system tended to be looked as a means to achieve victory in in game conflicts. You paid point for capacity. There are certain thigns that can't emulated by taking a low rating in something, such as taking damage from something that doesn't hurt others, or multiplying others effects on you (not the same as halving your defense against their abilities).

All the interesting complications didn't make sense, though there was an effort to have known limits or requirements on a PCs behavior to get tossed a bone. It's all nice when the hearo stop to keep an innocent from getting hurt, but between the competitive nature of "tradfitional play" in Champions and the direction of comics in the late 80s and the 90s, you couldn't just say it was expected, it needed to be balanced in somehow.

I personally favor the idea that any complication you take only matters when it comes up, and so it's an exchange of defining your character and the things you want to see for some small reward.

[AzaLiN]

I've blown up, entrapped, and gotten my characters gutted over and over. Its a lot of fun. My roommate hardly has a character who can function usefully in combat, let alone survive without help, and ALWAYS gets everybody into trouble/killed.

It seems normal to us. I'll never forget you, Toshi...

Mind you, other players can't seem to understand it; it works best with a group of like-minded people.