kathanaksaya (a story-based rpg)

[Tony Irwin]

Your EOP reads great. I wouldn’t be afraid to extend it, to closely detail character creation right through all the scenes in a typical session. It seems like you have a very particular style of play in mind and its important that the players understand how this game is built to work.

Concerning the GMs role, Universalis addresses all of your concerns about Gmless play. You sound like you’ve tried play like this before but confusion resulted – the Universalis system deals with sharing out GM powers, as does my game Theme-Chaser (although not so wonderfully as Universalis! Geez what a poor plug that was). My opinion is stick to your guns and keep the GM,  it seems like character-creation is all about building a very personal vision, that might jar with the negotiation and compromise needed for GMless play. A GM can be there to provide the reasons for why all these unique, individual characters come together, without the players having to compromise their uniqueness.

I loved the way one player was able to introduce elements of pop-culture into the game. You might want  to make it explicit (I’m sure you already have but I’ve just missed it) that players can build whatever races, regions they need in order to create a character background. Otherwise you’ll get the “But there are no Elves in my world” GMs preventing players from making the characters they really want.

In the EOP of play I was especially interested to see how the conflict and the back-and-forth bidding lasted for the whole scene. In fact you could say that the scene was about Ziggy’s faith in his dream. Troll-Babe is really great for the way that it actually gives rules for making scenes. The GM announces when a scene starts and ends, so you don’t get any of that stupid stuff that drives me so crazy…

Us: Ok we’ll get in the car and drive down-town to the Jar-Jar club to buy some weapons. Does anything happen on the way?

GM: Traffic is pretty busy so its slow going.

Us: Ok we’ll turn on the radio for the news while we wait. Anything on?

GM: Usual celebrity gossip. Oh there’s been a car crash on the Eastern express.

Us: I’ll download the report onto my palm-top.

GM: Its just a car crash. Drunk driver.

Us: Anyone we recognise?

GM: Uhhh, nope.

See its stupid, I want a scene at the Jar-Jar club, the GM wants a scene in the Jar-Jar club, but because neither of us just says “Let’s just skip to the Jar-Jar club” we waste time pissing about not really sure what’s meant to be happening or what anyone else wants to do.

The trick is simply for the GM to say “Ok this scene is over. For the next scene let’s do you guys at the Jar-Jar club”. Or a player can chime in and say “My character has the disadvantage, nagging girl-friend, can we do another scene about that first? It was really funny last time.”

That kind of clarity about what is a scene and how they work might be really useful for a game like yours. For example if I was playing Ziggy I would be wanting scenes that challenge my faith in my own individuality and would need gaps in play where I could ask the GM for stuff like that. Also you might consider that each scene should be focusing on only one conflict. In your EOP of play its much more satisfying I’m sure you’ll agree to end the scene with the characters having renewed faith in themselves instead of it dragging on with “Ok, what do we see now” or “We’ll find a place to camp down for the night, who’s taking first watch?”. You can still have more scenes in the Marsh of Despair (for example they might get attacked by a swamp monster in the next scene), but the point is that every scene is about something and the players and gm all know what that scene is about. If I was to role-play your EOP with some old friends of mine we would have spend hours tramping about the Marsh of Despair with the bored players waiting for the GM to do something and the bored GM waiting for the players to do something. That’s just the way those guys played, they wanted great stories but didn’t know how to achieve it with traditional RPG systems. Clarifying how scenes work might be one way of doing that.

Anyway it all looks great Green, glad to hear you're getting the chance to play test it.

Tony
--------------------------------
Edited to include Trollbabe link 17 Jan 03

[Green]

Your EOP reads great. I wouldn't be afraid to extend it, to closely detail character creation right through all the scenes in a typical session

If you see how much time I put into Ziggy alone by creating Bowies Wonderworld and detailing Ziggy's background, I think you would be afraid, very afraid.  But, I did add a paragraph to the document about that just to make it clear.  I can PM you Ziggy 1847's information if you want.

It seems like character-creation is all about building a very personal vision, that might jar with the negotiation and compromise needed for GMless play. A GM can be there to provide the reasons for why all these unique, individual characters come together, without the players having to compromise their uniqueness.

Exactly.  And you put it more succintly than I did too.

You might want to make it explicit (I'm sure you already have but I've just missed it) that players can build whatever races, regions they need in order to create a character background. Otherwise you'll get the "But there are no Elves in my world" GMs preventing players from making the characters they really want.

I believe I did state this somewhere, but not so bluntly as this.  Otherwise I don't think Dobie would have been a possible selection for a sample character.  I added more to be sure:

"Developing a character to play in Kathanaksaya can be complicated because there are no rules saying what type of character you can and cannot play.  Kathanaksaya encourages players to create whatever races, cultures, and regions they need to create their characters because it adds verisimilitude to the world and involves the players in the story and its events.  You can play aliens, fantasy species, normal people, floating green mist, or anything your fertile mind can imagine.  The point here is to exercise your imagination and create something you would be interested in exploring and developing."

That kind of clarity about what is a scene and how they work might be really useful for a game like yours. For example if I was playing Ziggy I would be wanting scenes that challenge my faith in my own individuality and would need gaps in play where I could ask the GM for stuff like that. Also you might consider that each scene should be focusing on only one conflict.

Below is what I added to the section detailing "The Role of Players and Narrators":

"While playing Kathanaksaya, Narrators should try, as much as possible, to keep the players interested in what is going on.  Try to maintain a pace that focuses on characters and their goals, motivations, flaws, and weaknesses.  A good idea is to have a goal in mind for each scene that you develop involving the PCs.  What are you trying to do with this scene?  How can you relate this to a character's goals, motivations, background, vulnerabilities, or assets?  How can you make this more fun?  Do not be afraid to take tips from the players.  Remember, Narrators are not the Almighty in Kathanaksaya, so it is perfectly alright to show some humanity and admit you do not know everything.  They should let you know what keeps them interested.  Prepare as much as you feel necessary to do this.  Although scripting can lead to frustration, it is a good idea to have some sliver of a notion of certain scenes and events that would elicit profound responses from the players and their characters.  The themes and conflicts developed from the preliminary conversations about the game can help a great deal in crafting plot elements that involve the players and their characters more deeply in the story."

[Shreyas Sampat]

You clearly have some strong narrative goals here, as your quote from "The Role of Players and Narrators" shows.  What I wonder (this has been wondered at me too) is how you're going to support those concerns.

What I mean by this is that not everyone has unlimited expertise.  You can tell Narrators to keep the players interested, but not all of them will know how.  I'm tempted to suspect that those who do know how won't have to be told.  So, I think Kathanaksaya, strong as it is already, would benefit a lot from a section on various techniques and processes that make Narration work.

I notice also that a strong part of the Narrator's role, from your EoP, is to analyze and anticipate the players' interests.  This is really interesting, from my point of view, and I'd really like to see this elaborated upon.  I think you could get a lot out of informing the players (all of them) that they can talk about what they want to happen in the game, and have the Narrator arrange the scene to bring that about.  Rather than restricting the explicit player-Narrator communication to pre-play, why not have it going on all the time?  It seems as if the pre-game communication is stronger because the players aren't tied to characters yet, but once play begins, you imply that players and Narrators shouldn't explicitly discuss their interests, except through the game medium.  To me, this is a recipe for unsatisfying gaming.

On that note, I think that if your Narrators play as you direct them to, with expertise. their scripting, rooted as it is in what the players care about, shouldn't lead to frustration.

[Green]

What I mean by this is that not everyone has unlimited expertise. You can tell Narrators to keep the players interested, but not all of them will know how. I'm tempted to suspect that those who do know how won't have to be told. So, I think Kathanaksaya, strong as it is already, would benefit a lot from a section on various techniques and processes that make Narration work.

True, but the theories are so different and diverse even regarding that element that such a thing would be difficult to incorporate.  People have different styles of doing the same thing, and as much as I would like to include as many of those styles as I can, if I only use my own experience, I feel I may be shortchanging the audience.

[Green]

After reading over Kathanaksaya again, I began to wonder exactly how important the text about humans and the fading are.  Although it is incredibly interesting, I fear that they may not have any bearing on actual play, and therefore should be eliminated.  What do you think?  Should they be kept?  What do you see happening with the things I wrote for these ideas.  To prevent alot of scrolling up and down, I'll post a revised form of what I had before.

Humans
Humans are responsible for Kathanaksaya's continued existence. After all, Kathanaksaya is a world composed of their dreams, their hopes, their fears. Human stories alter, create, or destroy Kathanaksaya as easily as a child with a lump of clay. Paradoxically, humans are the banes and saviors of Kathanaksaya. When they tap into their gift for making stories, Kathanaksaya blossoms. When they forget this gift or deny its power, the Kathanaksaya wastes away. Just as their ignorance of the power of stories destroys Kathanaksaya, so to does a human revive it by creating more stories.

There have been no indisputable cases of humans physically venturing to Kathanaksaya. It seems there is a border preventing the denizens of one world from crossing over into the other. Perhaps this is a good thing. The devastation that a human being's power fantasy could wield in our world is unimaginable. Likewise, a human being who finds herself in Kathanaksaya could wreak havoc on an epic scale.

Fading
Fading is a process, sometimes slow, sometimes fast, that devours creatures and lands of Kathanaksaya. It can strike at any place and at any time, but it usually attacks those things that have been largely ignored and forgotten.  It is sometimes acts simultaneously upon several creatures and places. Nothing is invulnerable to it. Even the greatest stories ever told have succumbed to Fading. Entire regions in Kathanaksaya have disappeared into nothingness.  Most in Kathanaksaya have no personal experience with Fading, but those who know if it fear it like no other force they can imagine.

Fading begins subtly.  It shows itself most drastically in sentient creatures. Initially, the creature forgets details about its past, beginning with things it would rather not remember.  Then it loses memories they are indifferent to, such as trivial facts and other things which have little to no bearing on how they live.  It realizes something is wrong when it forgets important details such as its home, what happened to it fifteen minutes ago, and even its name.

Physically, the creature declines as well.  Some lose parts of their bodies, which disappear as though they had never been there.  Others become more and more transparent, resembling an apparition when Fading approaches its advanced stages.  Neither pain nor pleasure nor any other type of feeling accompanies Fading.  In fact, Fading could be said to be a physical and psychological numbness that overtakes the creature.  At the final stage of Fading, the creature vanishes.  Soon afterwards, the possessions of the missing character vanish as though they had never been there. Finally, the other characters lose all memory that the Faded one had even existed.

What happens to Kathanaksayan after the Fading consumes them is unknown. Most fear that it is oblivion, but others posit that it is merely a transition into another state of being. Some believe the process is natural and inevitable. Some Kathanaksayans, rather than try to figure out what lies beyond the Fading, attempt to understand what it really is and how it works. Is it active or passive? A dangerous combination of both? A few insane (or very wise) creatures think that the Fading is what happens when the one who made them forgets about them, when someone considers them so unimportant that they are not worth considering.

[Shreyas Sampat]

Kathanaksaya, so far as I've seen, doesn't have mechanics for the Fading; it'll never see play if I don't miss my guess (the same way Mage: the Ascension has no rule for madness, so you never see characters going Marauder).  But the Fading is really interesting.  I'd like to see it, personally.  So 'm going to throw you an idea, but first...

If you're going to leave in the Fading text, then it stands to reason that the Humans text stay there as well; it's kind of funny that the game is explicitly about beings being imagined by other (presumably fictional) beings.

Suppose you were to bring Humans and the Fading into play:

Humans are simply characters with no manifestation in the game world, outside of their ability to participate in SP bidding in accord with their Specialties.  They are quite literally fighting to tell their version of the story.  I wouldn't suggest having more then one person play a Human in a game of Kathanaksaya; it's a very weird kind of position.  Maybe instead of a Narrator, there's a Human "telling" a particular story of Kathanaksaya, participating in the unfolding of events in the Narrator capacity rather than as a character does.

The Fading is something that happens to Kathanaksayans as their traits shift in prominence; as people forget some qualities and remember the others...
Mechanically, at the start of the gane none of a character's Specialties have Remembrance.  When you use a Specialty, it gets Remembrance; Remembrance is either on or off.  At the end of a story, each character's lowest Specialty without Remembrance Fades by a point.  If all their Specialties have Remembrance, no Fading occurs.

[Green]

it's kind of funny that the game is explicitly about beings being imagined by other (presumably fictional) beings.

Actually, the game is explicitly about beings imagined by other (very real) beings.  So, humans are not roles the players play.  It's just a statement of fact.

However, I like your ideas about Remembrance.  It would seem that you reward characters who can apply their Specialties to more situations, favoring a few powerful Specialties over many less potent ones.  This may not be a problem, actually, as it may mean that later the character's story becomes an archetype, which may lead to some sort of immortality for the character.

[Green]

I've added this to the EoP which details the process of playing Kathanaksaya.  Hopefully, this would help establish a habit of players asking what they would like from the Narrator.

Step Six: Recap and Requests

After the session dealing with the Marsh of Despair, the three players discuss what they liked, didn't like, and anything they would like to see more of.  This has two major purposes.  The first is to keep all the players happy by letting them voice their desires and concerns before these issues derail the story.  If Sue likes describing settings in a way that evokes an introspective, almost religious mood, communicating this to John and Cappy can cut down on frustration because they won't be as likely to do slapstick humor.  The second is to give the Narrator an idea of how to prepare and what to prepare for.  If John and Cappy want light-hearted fun, it makes no sense for Sue to plan the next session around escaping from the Land of Night.

The players from the above example briefly talk about what worked and what didn't work for the session, and all three agree that they had a great time.  Sue was highly entertained by the dramatic dialogue of the characters.  She enjoyed watching Dobie and Ziggy interact with each other.  Cappy and John liked this too.  Cappy adds that he liked how he felt free to have his character act naturally, without feeling pressured by the Narrator to play accordig to someone else's ideas of how his character should be portrayed.  He thoroughly enjoyed dealing with Ziggy's crisis of faith.  John is not sure why, but he had fun.  He liked being useful.  

After such an intense session, Sue, Cappy, and John all agree that they need a break.  While they don't want people slipping on banana peels, all of them want relief from the tension that permeated the chapter dealing with the Marsh of Despair.  Sue reassures them that Paradise will not be anywhere nearly as stressful.  Cappy asks whether or not there will be time to face Major Tom and kick his butt after the Paradise chapter is done.  Cappy also says that Ziggy wants show Dobie his home.  John wants Dobie to interact with Sarah and to save some innocents.  If that means kicking Major Tom butt, he is OK with it.  Sue, inspired by the relief of tension, takes these ideas and comes up with something she is sure the other players will enjoy.

[Green]

I like shreyas' idea about Remembrance, so I have decided to incorporate it into the game.  The text goes shortly after the part about Specialties, an it is this:

When your character uses a Specialty in a bid, that Specialty gains Remembrance.  Remembrance does not work like Specialties because instead of having a variable range, it is either there or not.  When you have your character use a Specialty in a bid, simply mark that Specialty in a way that sets it apart from those which haven't been used, such as an "R" by the Specialty you have used.  At the end of a story, the Specialty with the lowest rating that has no Remembrance will fade away.  The only way to regain the faded Specialty is through living through and inspiring more stories along the lines of the Specialty that had disappeared.  The fading of Specialties does not affect your character's Story Point total at all.  However, it does make it harder to bid in your character's favor.[/list:u]

The only thing I see as a problem is what happens when no bidding occurs.  Anyone with ideas on how to solve this?