Ideas! Ideas!

[Ian O'Rourke]

I've been throwing around 2 ideas for Sorcerer...

The first is based around a Twin Peaks/Over the Edge style idea - I want to explore horror/surreal stories within a fixed locale: an island or a small town. In either case the principles of Sorcerer would be somehow linked to the town - may be this is the only place the Sorcerers can use their powers, or may be this is the only place they can summon new 'demons' (and no doubt they'd be harder to control away from the locale). The idea would be to tell stories based on the conspiracies and surreal/horror events in the town, with the overriding mystery being may be what the 'demons' are and what the source of the Sorcerers power is. The base idea of this came from a rough (very rough) idea for an Unknown Armies campaign (but this is not overly compatible with small locale games) so Sorcerer seems better. What is Sorcerer? Good question. I was thinking it could be linked to some being that lives in/around/below the town - something like the creature from the Stephen King book I.T. or the otherworldly things in Twin Peaks. It's not something you can put a finger on, but it is sort of malicious (in that it perverts the town), but also some others can control it to summon their hearts desires? As for humanity? This could be a typical definition of corruption of the soul.

The second idea is not as geographically focused, but the basic principal behind the idea is that some sort of disease - or possibly a strain of a certain disease - facilitates Sorcery. I'm still at the very early concept stages of this one, so these are sort of 'stream of consciousness' ideas. I want to use some conspiracy theory style stuff (think the X-Files) with the Sorcerers being a part of that conspiracy. As things knocked around in my head I was thinking of having the main enemy be a sentient disease of some sort, and obviously those infected are all part of an operating conspiracy trying to achieve some sort of objective (though I'm not sure what). The Sorcerer's would be sufferers from a new strain of the disease, enabling them to channel sort of power source (may be linked to the sentience of the disease to provide the 'demonic' element of fighting for control). I'm not sure I want a 'loose your soul' style mechanic in the second example, that humanity could be linked to the disease? The more the power is used the lower the score and the closer the Sorcerer becomes to being a 'mindless' drone of the diseases sentience? Trying to ensure it does not come across as 'diseased' supers. This use of humanity would provide a level of emotion in the game, as the sentient virus is going to want to investigate/secure these Sorcerers, they are going to want to remain independent, but the most powerful tool in their arsenal can result in them becoming one with the virus.

I may also need to read up on genetics, as I want the virus to be hard to detect, and also big enough to form a conspiratorial body but not too easy to spread (and of course Sorcerers need to be even rarer).

Any thoughts or ideas?

[Ron Edwards]

Ian,

I like both the ideas and don't think either one needs a lot more work before moving to the players.

1) The town idea is near and dear to my heart, as should be clear from Chapter 7 in the book. I think it practically requires relationship-map based planning.

2) The disease idea is also good, and I agree that Humanity would definitely concern the issue of who's in control, the host or the disease (whose goal is to continue transmitting). I suggest - and this may seem odd - that you treat the demons in question as Possessors, not Parasites as one might think. The rules in Soul offer a lot of guidelines for making Possessors more interesting.

Best,
Ron

[Uncle Dark]

Riffing off what Ron just said, you might consider the parasite-possesser-passer progression, as the host loses humanity and the disease gains control.

Lon

[Ian O'Rourke]

On 2001-08-29 12:26, Uncle Dark wrote:
Riffing off what Ron just said, you might consider the parasite-possesser-passer progression, as the host loses humanity and the disease gains control.

You lost me on that one? Could you explain it a bit more?

[Ron Edwards]

Ian,

Lon's talking about some material in The Sorcerer's Soul, in which the Types presented in the main rules are treated more fluidly. I offer several ways for demons to change Type, usually in response to Humanity changes in a host.

Thus a Possessor might, over time, turn itself into a Passer by completely taking over the host body for good, after the host's Humanity goes to 0.

(If you're wondering how a Possessed host could lose Humanity, since Humanity loss strictly results from conscious actions, well, that's in "Soul" too.)

Best,
Ron

[Ron Edwards]

Ian,

Oh yeah. You know about how many micro-parasites (bacteria, viruses) affect host behavior, right? In that they change the host's behavior such that the chance to transmit the parasite is increased?

If not, check out some behavioral ecology. Great stuff.

Best,
Ron

[Uncle Dark]

What Ron said.

I was thinking this:

Parasite: the disease is there, but semi-dormant.  When the player loses his/her first Humanity point to actions involving the parasite, it starts "talking" to him/her, suggesting that if s/he simply surrender control temporarily, then  more power can be applied to the problem.  Once this choice is made, the parasite upgrades to possesser.

Possesser: the disease begins struggling to take over, subtly at first, but more directly as the host loses Humanity.  Once Humanity hits 0, the host is dead(?) and the diseas takes full control of the body, making it a Passer.

This is all from a concept I'd come up with based on Croenenberg films and John Carpenter's remake of The Thing.  What if the demons were fragments of the alien from The Thing?  What if they were trying to take over the world?

Lon

[Ron Edwards]

Lon (and Ian),

My take is that the Possessor stage confers most control over the host's body to the demon, with the host only able to resist occasionally. Of course, for the demon to become a Passer, the host's Humanity must hit 0; for that to happen, the host needs to have some voluntary actions; for that to happen, the Possessor has to "share the reins" every so often.

It's at this stage, of course, that the sorcerer is tremendously powerful and feels like he "has a great friend." The demon can even kick in abilities that it can use (rather than confer), thus revealing "new powers." Cool, eh?

Check out the discussions of Parasites and Possessors in the Archive section of the Sorcerer website for some ideas ... a lot of this found its way into Soul, too.

Best,
Ron

[Ian O'Rourke]

Very interesting- I just need to figure out how the whole 'author stance' on the summoning/containing stuff applies?

[Ian O'Rourke]

Very interesting- I just need to figure out how the whole 'author stance' on the summoning/containing stuff applies?

[Mike Holmes]

On 2001-08-30 11:02, Ron Edwards wrote:
Lon (and Ian),

My take is that the Possessor stage confers most control over the host's body to the demon, with the host only able to resist occasionally. Of course, for the demon to become a Passer, the host's Humanity must hit 0; for that to happen, the host needs to have some voluntary actions; for that to happen, the Possessor has to "share the reins" every so often.

It's at this stage, of course, that the sorcerer is tremendously powerful and feels like he "has a great friend." The demon can even kick in abilities that it can use (rather than confer), thus revealing "new powers." Cool, eh?

An interesting take on this would be to take on a more existential approach with the players. Is that the demon who made me do that, or did I decide to do it? Slowly the Demon and the character's personalities merge. Where does one stop and the other begin? Players would get bonuses on their rolls to resist humanity loss by explaining how they "know" that it wasn't they that did that horrible thing; it was the demon. But was it? Perhaps they are succumbing to the lure of power that the demon provides. Certainly the character's been behaving more like the demon lately, even when it's certain he's in control. Maybe it was the character who killed that uppity gas station attendant who made him feel like a nobody. Stuff like this only makes the demon's hold more tight, the melding more perfect.

Lots of room for psychodrama here.

Mike Holmes