The Forge Archives

So, I've been mulling over in my mind the next campaign I'm gonna run, and I've finally settled on running The Madness Dossier out of the back of GURPS Horror. For those who don't know, MD is a campaign blurb written by Ken Hite. PCs are members of Operation Sandman, embedded espionage agents who are fighting the good fight against the Anunnakku, a set of Sumerian demons. The backstory is that the Annunakku memetically programmed humanity as slaves, but around 550 AD, a "reality quake" occurred, fracturing into Reality A (our reality, with the twist that everything before 550 AD never occurred) and Reality B (the reality where the Anunnakku reign supreme upon humanity). The Annunakku attempt to subvert Reality A by sending in "irruptors," using special memetic symbols to control and walk unseen among us. Its a war to maintain reality integrity of Reality A.

Kind of standard "horror RPG" stuff, but this written line, "heroes must betray their own morality and become corrupt to defeat amoral slavers from another reality," made me think this was a good candidate for a Sorceror game. It's also a good candidate for something else I've wanted to do since the intifada started in Israel -- a "current events" campaign that revolves around this idea of "third world chaos" as seen in Israel, Iraq, Afghanistan, and places like Sierra Leone and Liberia. PCs, as members of Operation Sandman, are intelligence agents near Jerusalem, moving the scope later out to Iraq and maybe Africa. I'm looking for an intense game that highlights "humanity's inhumanity to humanity," with the grotesque monsters showing only on occasion for dramatic effect.

So, as per all Sorceror games, I'm at "what is Humanity?" and "what are Demons?" Since this is a blurb, I can easily change details of the setting to mesh well with Sorceror. Humanity is one of two things: either a measure of a character's morality -- the kind of slow degradation that undercover agents undergo ~ "be careful when fighting monsters you don't become a monster yourself"; or the integrity of Reality A, once a PCs Humanity goes to 0 the Annunakku gain a major victory in banishing Reality A forever.

As for demons, well, as written, the campaign doesn't support it well. Annunakku are demons (more like proto-gods) but not demons that administer power. They're villans. Hite envisions PCs power consisting of Sandman's "black tech," which doesn't translate well to demons I'd think. He also threw out psionic abilities imparted by Annunakku memetic programming. This would increase likelihood of Annunakku mind control, and and increased likelihood of destroying Reality A. Likewise, Annunakku powers could come from another set of Sumerian demons, which Sandman taps into, with the same reality disintegration results. Humanity would work well as a 'reality mechanic' for the last two ideas, but then I wonder if my "careful hunting monsters lest a monster you become" might get sidelined.

Thoughts? Thanks.

Steve Dustin

Hi Steve,

This line,

Quote"heroes must betray their own morality and become corrupt to defeat amoral slavers from another reality," made me think this was a good candidate for a Sorceror game.

... strikes me as a little one-way-ticket for Sorcerer. I guess I see the game supporting morality-betrayal as a viable option for defeating the bad guys, but not as the sole and solitary way.

Is it at all clear what Ken means by "corruption" in this text? I couldn't pick it up from your summary.

Best,
Ron

For Sorcerer, it needs only a slight change, IMO:

Quoteheroes are tempted to betray their own morality and become corrupt to aid in defeating amoral slavers from another reality

I like the second group of demons idea. Their main goal? Usurp the current demons. So the humans that use them are playing a little balancing game trying to play both sides off against each other. What happens when the Sorcerer's own moralities get entagles, tho?

Mike

Quote from: Ron EdwardsHi Steve,

This line,

Quote"heroes must betray their own morality and become corrupt to defeat amoral slavers from another reality," made me think this was a good candidate for a Sorceror game.

... strikes me as a little one-way-ticket for Sorcerer. I guess I see the game supporting morality-betrayal as a viable option for defeating the bad guys, but not as the sole and solitary way.

Is it at all clear what Ken means by "corruption" in this text? I couldn't pick it up from your summary.

Best,
Ron

From my read on Hite's text, "corruption" is moral corruption. The PCs use "mind control, along with the other less than savory aspects of espionage work," to defeat the Annunakku, who are also using the same methods. You know, "careful fighting monsters that you don't become a monster yourself."

What exactly do you mean by "one-way ticket?" Are you saying this is a good fit for Sorcerer, or a little simplistic?

Steve Dustin

Quote from: Mike HolmesFor Sorcerer, it needs only a slight change, IMO:

Quoteheroes are tempted to betray their own morality and become corrupt to aid in defeating amoral slavers from another reality

I like the second group of demons idea. Their main goal? Usurp the current demons. So the humans that use them are playing a little balancing game trying to play both sides off against each other. What happens when the Sorcerer's own moralities get entagles, tho?

Mike

That makes it a lot different. I'm just rolling it around in my head at the moment, not sure where I would take this. This makes the whole thing a little more overt? I was seeing more a conspiratorial game with current events as window-dressing. Where would I take this idea?

Hmm. Maybe Annunakku are more like the typical Sorceror demon, and the second set (I'll call them the Dero for now, for lack of a better name) are also typical Sorceror demon. The PCs can bind both types? But both want to control humanity and destroy Reality A? Maybe the Deros work for Operation Sandman? Maybe both demons' needs are for bigger reality distortions? I don't know ... I have to chew on it for a while. It's not coming together for me at the moment.

One idea I did have, after my first post was that the PCs demons would be "mental glyphs" that need to be "awakened." These glyphs are the memetic symbols implanted by the Annunakku. The glyphs' "needs" would be satisfied to keep their glyphs "awakened." What those needs are I have no idea.

Operation Sandman would be a shadowy organization that recruited the PCs by "awakening" their ka glyphs. The ka glyphs would give the PCs some "second sight" abilities and able to tap their other glyphs imbedded within them. They would be set up in "sleeper" cells unable to see the organizational shape of Sandman, only their go-between, but Sandman would keep control of their ka glyph. Maybe the demons' need are actually Sandman's needs. Hmm. Have to think about that for a minute.

Thanks for the feedback,

Steve Dustin

First of all, this is a swell idea! Project Sandman and Sorcerer, yet another one of those great "why didn't I think of that" combos.

QuoteFrom my read on Hite's text, "corruption" is moral corruption. The PCs use "mind control, along with the other less than savory aspects of espionage work," to defeat the Annunakku, who are also using the same methods. You know, "careful fighting monsters that you don't become a monster yourself."

What exactly do you mean by "one-way ticket?" Are you saying this is a good fit for Sorcerer, or a little simplistic?

I think what Ron is saying is that, if you start out with that moral already determined, then yes, it is a little simplistic - a Sorcerer game shouldn't start out with the path so clearly marked. Betraying human morality to fight the Annunaku should be a possible choice available to the players, but not the only necessary option available.

That said, I don't think this "one-way ticket" would have to be the defining element of a Project Sandman/Sorcerer game, for 2 reasons:

1. Who says the PCs have to fight the Annunaku at all? Ken's campaign frame is, for all its head-trippy grooviness, a fairly straightforward espionage set-up game that tells you right off the bat who the bad guys and the good (or at least, not quite so bad) guys are. But Sorcerer games don't work like that, I think. I wouldn't tell the PCs "In this game you fight the Annunaku" - I would tell them "the tools of the Annunaku grant great power, but also risk terrible evil". And then ask each PC what they want to do about it all. Fight the Annunaku? Great! Join them? Why not! Follow the PC's own twisted agenda? Better still! The nice thing about this open setup is that I really don't feel you need a second group of "demons." Kind of muddies the waters I think.

2. I think if you focus on the "moral corruption of espionage" angle, you miss some of the more cosmic horror elements of the Project Sandman setting. The key to the Madness Dossier is that human history is a lie - not in the conspiracy sense, but literally: none of it ever happened. And so Project Sandman fights to preserve a mass chrono-reality hallucination. They can employ memetic/psionic powers that are holdovers from the real history of Annunaku domination, but each time they do they risk weakening the slender threads of History A.

So I would have the Annunaku be both the PC's demons and the enemy, if the players chose to fight them. And I would have Humanity somehow represent, at least in part, "the integrity of the lie that is History A". Have you read the "Charnel Gods" supplement? You could actually integrate that approach to the cosmology, and the very cool endgame mechanics there (when a sorcerer hits Humanity 0, the whole world is doomed), into the modern world in a really neat way.

Damn, now I want to play this!

Rob

Oh, I just reread your posts more closely and realize that you basically already suggested what I just said:

QuoteHumanity is one of two things: either a measure of a character's morality ... or the integrity of Reality A, once a PCs Humanity goes to 0 the Annunakku gain a major victory in banishing Reality A forever.
...
Humanity would work well as a 'reality mechanic' for the last two ideas, but then I wonder if my "careful hunting monsters lest a monster you become" might get sidelined.

I say definitely go with Humanity as "integrity of reality," a la a modern-day Charnel Gods. Questions of personal morality and "lest a monster you become" will still come into the game, I have no doubt, but they may actually be more interesting if you don't rig the moral lesson ahead of time.

Quote from: Rob MacDougallFirst of all, this is a swell idea! Project Sandman and Sorcerer, yet another one of those great "why didn't I think of that" combos.
[snip]

Damn, now I want to play this!

Rob

Do you live in Portland, Oregon? If so, you can.

Annunakku as the actual sorcerers' demons. Thanks for pointing that out for me, Rob. I'm having my own "duh" moment here.

The problem I'm having is same problem I'm having with Mike's set-up: the Annunakku as both demon and villan. It seems bizarre to me at first that the villan of the campaign is something the PCs can bind and control. How would I handle that? Let me see (thinking out loud here), so your sorcerer binds an Annunakku. The whole time he's with you he's saying stuff like, "We're going to devour your reality. You humans are doomed." You satisfy its need so it doesn't return to erase your "reality-ness," or cause a minor reality quake. Makes the whole thing really dangerous. Ok. the whole things making more sense.

I've got Charnel Gods, and yes, when I mentioned "Humanity as Reality Disintegration" that's what I meant. I think I'm gonna lean more this direction. Mapping "Humanity as Moral Compass" leaves me with the question "How do the demons factor into that?" while "Humanity as Reality Disintegration" fits and nice and snug with the demon idea.

The only thing is that I've had this "current events ~ third world chaos" idea forever it seems like, and to play that properly, I'd think "Moral compass" would be a huge factor in it. To me, its the thought of the roleplaying possibilities in the kind of political chaos and disintegration going on in these poor nations.

Hmm. Thinking out loud again. Political disintegration ~ reality disintegration? Maybe there's still a way to pull this together.

Steve Dustin

You guys have nailed it.

The Big Lie is the big thematic key, and that should also be reflected in little lies. Hence you have one-on-one personal behavior for non-sorcerous Humanity checks and gains (whether you lie, regardless of "for their own good") and the larger-scale issue of supporting or defying the Big Lie for the sorcerous rituals.

The dual-Humanity material in Sex & Sorcery might prove useful as well, if necessary.

Best,
Ron

Great, I just picked up Sex and Sorcery.

I'm definitely going with Rob's suggestion. It's the simplest, easiest and cleanest to do this. While Mike's idea was good, it wasn't the game I wanted to play. So thanks for the help.

I wouldn't mind examining demons as the villans of a piece, but really don't have a question formulated in my mind to start a new thread. Anyway, I've got some research to do, and my copy of "Gods, Demons and Symbols of Ancient Mesopotamia" is on hold at Powell's for me.

Thanks!

Steve Dustin

This is a nifty setting.  Here's what I'm envisioning:

The timeline is going along fine with these two races on Earth: Anunnakku and Humans.  There are also supernatural demons which only a very few members of either race can access.  At some point, along about the time of the rise of Sumer, a cabal of Anunnakku use their demons to start doinking with humans.  Humans don't clue in quickly enough (or aren't organized enough) to fight them off and the Anunnakku do their little deep programming thing -- enslaving the entire human race.

Life for the Anunnakku is good, but it's been a long time and the newest generations have forgotten the ancient pacts with the demons.  The virgin sacrifices have stopped and the demons are getting the shaft...and they have much longer memories than the mortals.  They remember clearly how much better things were when there were two rival groups of people to manipulate.  So along about 550 AD a bunch of demons turn on their "masters" attempting to undo a bunch of the damage to humans, by replacing their memetic snares with false historical memories.  But the demons were playing with big juju, even for them, and screwed it up, creating a schism in reality.  D'oh!  I hate it when that happens.

An alternate timeline (only one?) is spawned at this point and everyone alive is somehow simultaneously living in both while strongly associated with only one of the existing timelines.  Most all of the Anunnakku are in one and most of the Humans are in the other.  Most.  The game takes place with a frame of reference on the new timeline where everyone (almost) believes deep in their bones the long history that was created at the birth of their new reality.  The Anunnakku know that it is possible to shift from one reality to the other, but it's pretty uncommon.  Humanity represents the strength of that tie between the person and their side of reality.  That includes the sense of morality that the demons painted on us when the reality rift happened.  When humanity drops to zero, that person slips into the older reality and is lost to the resistance.  The Anunnakku are doing everything they can to make that happen as much as possible.

As society decays in general, murder, war, terrorism, famine, etc., the Anunnakku gain slaves back on their side of the reality wall.  As sorcerers slide down the Humanity loss track, they fall across too.  Anunnakku are projecting force across the reality divide and are pulling strings covertly in as much of our world as possible to create misery and inhumanity.  They are having the most success in the former third world.  Terrorism, halted peace processes, the AIDS pandemic, abortion clinic bombings, you name it...it's all leading toward lost Humanity.  Follow the money.

The Anunnakku aren't really demons.  That's just part of how the real demons reprogrammed us during the botch.  What's funny is that the real demons probably aren't as bad as the Anunnakku.  Evil is that which leads to humanity loss.  Morality doesn't matter except in as much as it's needed to prevent the global loss of Humanity.  Humanity's survival is what matters and the Anunnakku, but not the demons oppose that.

While the Anunnakku have pretty straightforward motives, the demons have a panoply of different and even conflicting motives.  They want what they want as individuals, but they also don't want the Anunnakku to win.  But they enjoy and benefit from the descent of man.  So not only will the players have hard decisions about when it's worth binding a demon, but the demons will have hard decisions about when it's worth helping players and how.  And to complicate things further, the Anunnakku who are a part of our reality may not be aligned with their brethren back home -- what does Humanity mean to them?

Chris

Wow! That's great.

I don't have much to add to that, just wanted to offer my approval.

Oh, and welcome to the Forge!

Rob