Amazon Ninja Space-Pirate Catgirls: Reward mechanic

[Fade Manley]

Further, this is such a specific idea that you really need to avoid including rules for things that you don't need to. That is, just as mechanics about the things you want to see will promote that sort of thing occuring in-game, having rules for the unimportant things will detract. This is basically a broader statement of the example that Ralph gave. If you don't want people to be calculating about combat, then don't put rules in that require that sort of behavior. The same goes for anything. If you don't care to see players spending time thinking about which raygun to purchase, then don't make any differences between them. Have effectiveness in that area be determined by character effectiveness alone (I'm thinking a Reflexes stat or somthing catlike).

See the game InSpectres for how to focus play in such a tight manner (or My Life with Master, better yet).

Mike

I am trying to keep the game fairly simple and focused. At the moment, unless I decide to include a sort of 'special powers set' for characters' main descriptor, everything you need to know about a character boils down to 16 skills and your hit point total. I think I'll likely add Notoriety to that...

I'm not quite sure what to do with Loot, though; at the moment, better ships/weapons have no actual effect in the game, so far as mechanics go, so there's no particular mechanics-supported reason to buy them, unless they're weapons/ships/stuff that let you do things you otherwise couldn't do at all. (Sensors on the new ship so that you can track down other ships from far away, built in grappling hook on your new katana, etc.) I'm hesitant to start giving stats to weapons and ships, because that does detract from the 'whack them with whatever you're best at' feel that I prefer when it comes to combat.

At this point, perhaps I'd be best instructed by throwing what mechanics and setting I have at some players, with a quick description of what style I'm trying for, then seeing if the system sufficiently encourages/allows/represents the sort of feel I'm aiming for. And if not, then I can start adding in, say, the ability to buy re-rolls with Loot, or something along those lines.

(If it would be helpful to the discussion for me to put up all the rules for the game on a website for easy access, I can do that; it just hasn't seemed necessary so far.)

[Mike Holmes]

Well, we're starting to get into other territory than your original post asked for. If you want to look at other topics, I think that posting your rules, and starting a new thread might be a good idea. OTOH, you might want to wait for the playtest and see how it goes and raise some new issues then. Whatever works for you.

Mike

[Fade Manley]

Well, we're starting to get into other territory than your original post asked for. If you want to look at other topics, I think that posting your rules, and starting a new thread might be a good idea. OTOH, you might want to wait for the playtest and see how it goes and raise some new issues then. Whatever works for you.

Mike

Good idea. I didn't mean to wander this far off topic, but people had such good suggestions... I'll work out the new mechanic, run through an alpha playtest, do necessary rewrites to the rules, and then post again at that time.

[iago]

I think I'll likely add Notoriety to that...

Yay!

I'm not quite sure what to do with Loot, though; at the moment, better ships/weapons have no actual effect in the game, so far as mechanics go, so there's no particular mechanics-supported reason to buy them, unless they're weapons/ships/stuff that let you do things you otherwise couldn't do at all. (Sensors on the new ship so that you can track down other ships from far away, built in grappling hook on your new katana, etc.) I'm hesitant to start giving stats to weapons and ships, because that does detract from the 'whack them with whatever you're best at' feel that I prefer when it comes to combat.

Well, think about it this way.  If folks have a lower collective Loot, then their circumstances, quality of equipment, and quality of their ship is less under their control.  The more Loot they have, the more they can take control of those things.

Thus, folks with low Loot scores might have guns that misfire, ships with hyperdrives that konk out at the worst moments, and get hounded by "creditors" (loan sharks etc) due to their debts.

What I'd suggest is that Loot sit on some sort of sliding scale which, when negative, means the GM defines up to N facts (where N derived from the negative Loot) about the "circumstances" of the character(s).  ("Oh, Loot -3? Okay -- you've got Marco the Shark hot on your tail for gambling debts, you don't have enough money to keep your guns charged up all the time, and your starship The Bright Lady is a little dim these days and needs constant repairs.")

Once Loot goes positive, the players start getting some control, and can establish some facts about their circumstances that derive from that. ("Loot +2! Okay, so The Bright Lady is the fastest ship in this sector, and we lucked out and snagged ourselves a suit of military assault armor on a salvage run.")

Loot may be a collective trait held by a party rather than individual characters, like the whole idea of the franchise in Inspectres I think (I haven't gotten the chance to buy that one yet), but your call there.  (Notariety might work as a "party trait" as well, though I do see a lot of value in the PCs getting their own pecking order determined by it, so maybe not.)

I also like the idea that Loot might be something that folks can "wager" on a "scheme".  The GM should determine the risk level of the "scheme", which will in turn determine how much of a payout there will be if the scheme is successful (if it's not, that Loot is lost, and the GM chooses which established facts go away).  If the crew is at zero or negative Loot already, they can always go into debt (accumulating more GM-determined facts) in order to wager stuff in the first place -- in which case, if they fail, the amount borrowed is subtracted *again*, and if they succeed, the amount they borrowed is first subtracted from the winnings...

Just a few thoughts there. :)

(If it would be helpful to the discussion for me to put up all the rules for the game on a website for easy access, I can do that; it just hasn't seemed necessary so far.)

Please do.

[Fade Manley]

(If it would be helpful to the discussion for me to put up all the rules for the game on a website for easy access, I can do that; it just hasn't seemed necessary so far.)

Please do.

I'll do that, then, in hopes that it'll help with how to implement the Notoriety and Loot mechanics. I definitely will include Notoriety, as an individual mechanic: Loot, which will apply to the entire party, is something I still need to work out. I do, however, quite like the idea of both individual PC awards and party awards; it's both motivation for the characters to work together, motivation for individual players to do wilder things with their own characters, and a good way to inspire some handy IC bickering about whether or not to risk going after the next crazy scheme.

The current rules can be found at http://greykit.tripod.com/amazon.html; I apologize for the ads and pop-ups, but it's the only webspace I have at the moment.

[iago]

I like the skill grouping divisions, and the mechanics are pretty lightweight with an intriguing criticals method, but I think the system really needs more stuff that's specifically tailored to the narrowly defined theme (well, if not theme, then... amazon ninja catgirl pirateness) of the game.  I think adding in the notoriety and loot elements will help, and may be enough, but I'm not sure if that's all there needs to be there to get the flavor right.

[Fade Manley]

I like the skill grouping divisions, and the mechanics are pretty lightweight with an intriguing criticals method, but I think the system really needs more stuff that's specifically tailored to the narrowly defined theme (well, if not theme, then... amazon ninja catgirl pirateness) of the game.  I think adding in the notoriety and loot elements will help, and may be enough, but I'm not sure if that's all there needs to be there to get the flavor right.

I'm not sure either: this is the first game I've really tried to write, so as much as I have in theory, I'm sure I'm missing things. I am hoping they'll start turning up when I hit playtest, though.

The Noteriety and Loot mechanics are supposed to be the most blatant enforcements of theme (so far as one can call it 'theme' in this case); notoriety for individual PC actions that follow the theme, loot as motivation for the group as a whole to do appropriately amazon-ninja-space-pirate-catgirl-like things.

If those aren't enough...mm. I'm not quite sure what to add. Setting description, sample adventures, GM and player suggestions and the like... Those things should help, but if I really need more in the  mechanics to keep the system working for the game I want, this is probably the time I should be adding them in. Do you have any ideas as to what feels like it's 'missing' in this case? It's the reward mechanic that I really felt a need for, and thus this thread: if there's some other type of mechanic that I'm overlooking that would help me with theme, I'd be grateful for any suggestions in that direction.

[iago]

If those aren't enough...mm. I'm not quite sure what to add. Setting description, sample adventures, GM and player suggestions and the like... Those things should help, but if I really need more in the  mechanics to keep the system working for the game I want, this is probably the time I should be adding them in. Do you have any ideas as to what feels like it's 'missing' in this case? It's the reward mechanic that I really felt a need for, and thus this thread: if there's some other type of mechanic that I'm overlooking that would help me with theme, I'd be grateful for any suggestions in that direction.

That I'm not entirely sure of.  The whole Notoriety and Loot thing seems pretty specific to the 'Space Pirate' bit, and that's just a fourth of each character, supposedly.  Either figuring out how to expand the scope of those so that it incorporates the other three things, or putting in similar mechanics for each of the three, might be the way to go.  Let's leave Loot out for now as it may be a group thing.  What if each of the four categories had its own kind of notoriety (or if you had a notoriety stat, but allocated your points in it to each of the four categories or the gm did the allocations or whatever), so it comes out as 'notoriety as a space pirate', 'as a catgirl', 'as a ninja', 'as an amazon'.  This could then be used to guide NPC reactions, pecking orders when a particular category is relevant (space pirate notoriety translates to rank on the ship, but ninja notoriety might translate to rank in the underworld, etc).  I'm just shooting the breeze here, though.  The real answer is to sit down and think about your goals as far as how the flavor/theme should express itself, and then create mechanics which help incent the players to behave in accordance with that.

[Fade Manley]

That I'm not entirely sure of.  The whole Notoriety and Loot thing seems pretty specific to the 'Space Pirate' bit, and that's just a fourth of each character, supposedly.

...you know, that's an excellent point, and I really have been focusing mostly on the 'space pirate' aspect with the assumption that the other three descriptors would modify that, rather than seeing them each as a solid fourth of potential game play. Probably the result of too many pirate movies, of late.

I'm going to have to go take a look at the game and see if I want to just go ahead and right out make that the focus, or allow for each quarter to be the focus instead, and then see how I'm going to support either of those in mechanics. I'll bring back some revised mechanics when I've worked that out.

(And I begin to see why it's useful to not post here until I have something specific to talk about; I'm getting much more use out of asking after a reward mechanic than if I'd simply asked what people thought of the rules and concept as they currently stood.)

[iago]

I'm going to have to go take a look at the game and see if I want to just go ahead and right out make that the focus, or allow for each quarter to be the focus instead, and then see how I'm going to support either of those in mechanics. I'll bring back some revised mechanics when I've worked that out.

I think it's a pretty compelling focus, but if it does become the focus, I start to wonder at it being one of the skill groups -- mainly because, if Being a Pirate were the focus of the game, I'd expect most people to choose the pirate skill group as their primary thing.  So if it does become the focus, you may want to think about taking 'Space Pirate' out of its apparently "equal" peer relationship with the other three aspects of characters...