HELP! First, Pulling a punch. Second an index to this forum.

[Vanguard]

Because I agree that it takes more skill to pull a blow effectively than it takes to strike a wound, I devised the following house rule.

Players get to spend a number of CP prior to the pulled attack. They may then substract that number from the eventual wound caused, if any. Spending 5 CP is thus sufficient to reduce any potential wound.

That is assuming you do not allow for overkill (spending excess dmg unto other locations) or that you will forgo it for a duel.


Take care

[Jake Norwood]

Jake, could you please expound upon your favorite?...the terrain method? Maybe with an off the cuff example? Who's DTN, attacker or defender? Terrain based on actual terrain conditions? What number of dice would be rolled (sorry if that's an obvious value based on move statistic or something that is clearly listed in the terrain maneuver section of the book...I've only read it a couple of times so far and not all of it has stuck yet, so I'm not recalling the mechanic).

Thanks again to all!

Well, I *should* be working or sleeping, but what the hell...

I'm assuming you're familiar with how Terrain rules work. If not, go and read it.  It's a short section, and it's probably the most genius part of the system that I didn't realize was that sharp when I came up with it. Ha.

Jake wants to hit Brian with a fine longsword (ATN 5, DTN 6). Brian has a pretzel (ATN 3, DTN 8). Jake has a CP of, say, 25.  Brian has a CP of 15, because he spends a lot of time with pretzels (I'm making this up as I go here...).

The thing is that Jake realized that Brian (a) only has a pretzel, and where's the honor in that? and (b) Brian hasn't finished his part of TFOB yet, so Jake decides to pull the blow using Terrain rules.

Jake puts 10 dice into the attack (he doesn't want to miss), and then tells the GM that he wants to pull it so that it does a maximum of, say, a lvl 1 wound. He assigns 5 dice to the terrain roll.  The TN is 6, his DTN, because DTNs are really a measurement of how well a weapon reacts to changes in direction, etc.

The rule isn't fully formulated, but is sure sounds pretty good with as much sleep as I'm getting!

Jake

[Valamir]

I like it.  It adhers to the #1 rule for GMing TROS.

When in doubt...use a Terrain Roll.

[Dan Sellars]

Hello,

Sorry this may already have been mentioned (I've not had chance to read all this thread yet ;-)

Wrt pulling punches I asked this a while a go and it was suggested that it could be treated liek a maneouver where you pay 1 or two dice from the CP to discount damage (punch pulled, use flat of blade etc.) But still roll for Knock down and (maybe) shock thus allowing an effect from the blow.  

For example a strick to your opponents weapon arm with the flat of your blade would cost the activation cost if it hit your opponent would have to roll knock down to see if the weapon was dropped, and maybe a shock modifier to your opponents combat pool fro next go (but your opponent still gets to keep is arm ;-) ) maybe a level 4/5 wound should still break the arm?

Hope this is food for thought,
Dan.

[Jake Norwood]

That's a good point, Dan.  It's also worth mentioning that Maneuver activation costs are really just Terrain rolls automatically calculated so that you don't have to roll one more thing in combat.

Jake

[Valamir]

THAT is a pretty powerful revelation.  Hadn't made the connection, but it follows logically.

Taken a step further, it represents ability gained through drill, practice, and repetition of good form with a knowledgable instructor, such that the move becomes so second nature the Terrain Roll is automatically successfull.

Now extrapolating from this, one can see a whole range of "cool stuff to do with my sword" that could be tried, but, because its not part of standard formal trainging, the player must rely on a Terrain Roll to do it, rather than just pay a set activation cost.

One could even see this as allowing swordsmen to make a standard maneuver that they don't have a high enough proficiency for by using a Terrain Roll to see if they can pull it off because they aren't good enough yet to just pay the CP cost and be done with it.

[kenjib]

And it follows, then, from there, that if I work hard enough at the new "cool stuff to do with my sword" using a terrain roll, it would eventually become a fixed cost (using some as of yet unrevealed formula) and I would have invented a new maneuver which I could then train others to use...

[Lance D. Allen]

It's also worth mentioning that Maneuver activation costs are really just Terrain rolls automatically calculated so that you don't have to roll one more thing in combat.

Um, Jake?

Why've you never mentioned this itty-bitty little fact before now?

::smiles pleasantly... far too pleasantly::

[Jake Norwood]

What? You guys want to understand everything...?

Jake

[Lance D. Allen]

What? You guys want to understand everything...?

Well, yes.. but failing that, I figure it'd be nice to understand at least the things I've an interest in.. I don't think I ever even wondered what the activation costs were for.. I just figured that they were because the maneuver was a bit more difficult than maneuvers without them.

It also begs the question: What advantages, if any, would there be in rolling the dice instead of just spending them? Is there any advantage to rolling more? Less?

[Jake Norwood]

Man, making me share all my secrets...

It also begs the question: What advantages, if any, would there be in rolling the dice instead of just spending them? Is there any advantage to rolling more? Less?

Advantages to rolling: You get to choose how many dice, allowing you to gamble with fewer dice, keeping more for the attack or defense. There's no advantage to rolling more that I could think of, since success is really a binary issue here.

Disadvantages to rolling: it takes up time, and introduces the possibility of failure at an inoportune moment. Also, what happens when you fail?

Jake

[Valamir]

Also, what happens when you fail?

Good question.  What does happen when you fail.

When you're trying to pull off the super killer dopplehauffenschwartzenkopfleborschenkluggle move you just learned from the latest translated manual in a bout with John, and you screw it up...how quickly does he kill you?

[Jake Norwood]

Against John? I die right then and there. Against other folks...50-50.

I'd say that you'd lose all the dice you put into that attack and lose initative, but you could still defend yourself if the other guy choses to attack...maybe...

Jake

[Lance D. Allen]

So as an alternate rule, I could choose to roll 1 die for Counter, rather than spending 2, but risk a failure, in which case I assume that the counter does not happen alongside the parry.

Hm. Interesting. I can't see many people choosing the slightly lessened cost over the sure thing, but it's interesting to know that it could be an option.

[Valamir]

I wouldn't expect it to get chosen.  As a system it would representing the inexperienced swordsman attempting a maneuver that he hadn't drilled sufficiently enough to internalize (fixed cp cost).  So an experienced swordsman electing to use it would really be trying a desperation move.  I could see it being tried in that context.  When you don't have enough dice to parry AND counter so you try to squeak out an extra die by making the roll...kind of flailing desperately.  I would imagine that a master observing would be able to identify the exact moment his form went to hell.