The Dual-Core System and Purgatoris

[John Michael Crovis]

I've starting writing about my new project on the Raven Lake Games blog... The Dual-Core System, and Purgatoris - a setting to go along with that system. You can read about it HERE.

The Dual-Core System features two game mechanics which work together to give players more control and enrich the system with strategic game play.

Purgatoris is a Dark Fantasy setting that includes elements of Horror and Science Fiction, that takes place in a cavernous chamber, which encompasses an area the size of India.

Please take the time to comment and tell me what you think! Thank you.

[Thriff]

Hey John,

I really like the resolution mechanic you are using for your Dual-Core System. The chance of dice in conjunction with the strategy of choosing when to use cards (sometimes at the cost of replacing all of them!) would be really fun.

Purgatoris is a pleasant break from cliched tolkien-esque fantasy. I'd like to learn more about the world (political bodies, military might, cultural highlights, and racial biology) in your future installments.

The System is cool, but how does it mesh with character creation? You gave a preview of CC in the intro but it is difficult to provide feedback on the System without understanding how CC fits with resolution.

Looks like a great project!

T

[Mobius]

I think the idea behind the duel-core system is really interesting and I'd be very interesting in seeing more of the system and character creation.

[John Michael Crovis]

Hello Thriff, Hello Mobius. Thank you for the encouragement, guys. Sorry that it took so long to get back to you... life gets crazy, y'know?

In any case, I have another part of the system written - Attributes & Skills. I'm not promising innovation with this part... just old fashioned common sense. Let me know what you think, and if you have any suggestions or ideas I would be happy to hear them.

Thank you.

[Mobius]

The way you have set up attributes and skills seem to fit your stated goal of being simple and intuitive.

The skills seem fine but I'd like to know more about attribute generation and how they are used in the system.  Do they do anything besides modify skills?  How are attributes generated?  Can they be increased after character generation?

With only 4 attributes rated from 1-4 (in most cases) I could easily see characters ending up with very little difference in their attributes.

[John Michael Crovis]

Hello Mobius,

In terms of attribute generation, I intend it to be a simple point distribution among the four attributes with a 2.5 average. In case a random system is desired, I am also planning to create that... but it will be a system that forces the average to be 2.5. Besides skills, attributes will contribute to damage, health, special abilities... There will also be a "feat" system that will sometimes have an attribute as a prerequisite. I want the system to be simple... but not dull. Near death situations may incur attribute damage... a feat gain after a level in which they take attribute damage can be used to increase an attribute by one point. However, characters will never have an average score better than 2.5.

There are 40 different arrangements of attributes, if we only count those that are 1-4, a total of 10 points. This may not be as much variation as some systems, but attributes seldom do much for variety in the first place.The original D&D game is a prime example of this; plenty of variation in attribute scores, but if you are a fighting man, you are pretty much the same as every other fighting man regardless of your ability (attribute) scores.

BTW: I'm not feeling too well, so if my response doesn't make sense, let me know and I'll rewrite it when I feel better. :-)

[Mobius]

I agree that having a large number and/or range of attributes alone does not create character variety.  A static 10 points certainly has the potential to lead to different character types as long as all of the attributes are reasonably useful to most characters.

[Thriff]

ey JMC,

Your current system:

Strength: Prowess, Fortitude, Athletics
Agility: Finesse, Acrobatics, Evasion,
Wisdom: Diplomacy, Instinct, Perception
Intinct: Knowledge, Manipulation, Mechanics

Hopefully I'm not too invasive, but here is my suggestion::

Strength: Force (melee), Fortitude (physical resistance), Athletics (whole-body competency)
Agility: Dexterity (ranged, fine), Acrobatics (balance, stealth), Flexibility (evasion, body contortion)
Cognitive: Scholar (law/military/science,) Artist (Cultures, literature, history), Mechanic (tech specialist)
Instinct: Empathy (lie-detection, manipulation), Survival (urban or rural extremes), Awareness (gathering details from environment)

Reasoning...

1.) Renaming some Strength and Agility Skills

For the most part Str and Agl are simple and intuitive. Slight renaming to emphasize the skill's usage.

Prowess to Force. The "showy" uses of prowess seem unnecessary, thus making Force better representative of the skill.
Finesse to Dexterity. The classic usage of the term, personal preferance.
Evasion to Flexibility. By the definition given flexibility better encompasses the Attr's purpose.

2.) Fortitude vs. Instinct issue

I trust players will know when to use Fortitude vs. Instinct, but I see a potential problem when considering situations of extreme fatigue/disease in the wilderness (which often tends be be a very fatiguing and disease-ridden environment). Which Attr would assume priority? It's minor, but clarifying the distinction would be beneficial.

3.) Wis and Int issue

Wis and Int do not seem simple and intuitive. They are both cognitive in foundation and thus share a murky border. Utilizing both as 2 distinct Attr also (implicitly) excludes the significance of social interactions.

Remove Wis and Int and replace both with Cognitive and Instinct.

Cognitive is mind/wisdom/intelligence. It considers a character's ability to reason/memorize/organize data.

Scholar: Formal institutionalized training such as Law/Medicine/Chemistry/Military/Engineering*/Physics. *Engineering concerns itself with manufacture design--not the technique of operating hand-held or power-tools.
Artist: knowledge of customs, cultures, histories, traditions, literature and visual/auditory arts.
Mechanic: Tool operation and hand-construction.

Instinct is a character's inter-personal skills and self-preservation drives.

Empathy: Manipulation, intimidation, trust-building, and lie-detection. Replaces your previous Diplomacy.
Survival: Urban or rural extreme situations. Must be life-threatening situations. This Skill resolves the previous Fortitude/Instinct issue.
Awareness: ability to decipher details from an environment. I chose awareness over perception because awareness strikes me as more basic, more instinctual.

Hope this helps,

T

[John Michael Crovis]

Hey  Thriff!

While I appreciate your suggestions, I've thought it over and I really prefer my terminology and skill break-down. In the end, I know it really comes down to preference - I'm not saying that your approach is wrong, just not my cup o' coffee.

Let me explain my perspective; I don't see how Cognitive and Instinct as attribute scores are simpler than Intelligence and Wisdom... The terminology of "Intelligence" and "Wisdom" was used in the very first RPG, and has been used in hundreds of RPGs since, making them well known concepts, while your the term "Cognative" is more abstract (and its an adjective rather than a noun). I find the term "Force" a bit clumsy, and the term "Dexterity" is more often used as a name for attributes than for skills. Flexibility would be a good name for a skill, but it really doesn't get main focus of what I wanted Evasion to be - evading & dodging.

Regarding the Fortitude vs. Instinct issue, I think it's pretty clear that one is a mental skill while the other is a physical skill; Instinct would be useful in knowing which mushrooms are poisonous, while Fortitude would be useful in surviving the onset of that poison should you be wrong. The renaming of the Wisdom and Intelligence based skills are well done and would work... I do, however, prefer that my social skills be split into two and use both mental attributes . I might change instinct to survival -  I'm still not sure - but I otherwise really prefer how I labeled the skills.

Having said all that, your suggestions have really challenged me to think of *why* I made the choices I have made, forcing me to firm up my design philosophy for this game. It has also reminded me that most of these choices really come down to personal taste. I sometimes lull myself into thinking that I know what most people like in a gaming system, but in reality I'm just a victim of confirmation-bias fooling myself - I'm fooling myself...

Come to think of it, I think I will exchange Survival for Instinct.

[Thriff]

Hey JMC,

Absolutely no prob, glad to know that my interpretation aided you (at least tangentially).

T

[Bossy]

Hi.

I find the Dual-Core mechanics to be very cool though I'm concerned by the game balance. I feel that, since both high and low cards can be beneficial, then playing a card is always a boon. I have no problem with that, but it implicitely requires a certain level of opposition to the PCs. How do you think it goes? Have you played it already?