[GenCon 2004] Questions

[MPOSullivan]

heya everyone!

i'm planning on being at GC:Indy this year and would love to get involved with the ubertable that you guys have boiling up here.  I'm hoping to have a version of Criminal Element done in time for the con and would like to get into the table madness with that.  when will the paypal thing be available?  and will there be some kind of delegation of roles for the people involved?  how will the organization of who will be doing what be handled?

oh, and Ron, i have a couple of questions about the type of games that can brought to be sold at the Forge booth.  I guess i should PM you about it.

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

Let's have this thread be about any and all questions people have, especially newcomers, about the Forge booth at GenCon this year.

Fred (zathreyel) wrote,

when will the paypal thing be available? and will there be some kind of delegation of roles for the people involved? how will the organization of who will be doing what be handled?

I won't start accepting payments for the $100 and $200 people until April. Last year, we started in February and a whole ton of people signed in, paid, and then pulled out later and wanted their money back. Big fucking hassle for me. So not only am I starting later this year, but I'll also charge a serious fee (like, half-only money back or something) for people who do that.

Now, as for delegation of roles and so forth, the answer is a big ol' serious yes. We worked out a pretty good system for last year, and I'd like to refine it without making it some kind of rigid task/order/military thing. The best time to discuss and establish all this, because I definitely want to use the collective mind instead of my own, is right after people start to sign in so we know who's really going to be putting the ideas into action.

Best,
Ron

[MPOSullivan]

heya ron,

thanks for the quick reply on my questions.  i'm definetly looking forward to this since, not only am i hoping to be a game pimp at the Forge booth, but it'll also be my first Gencon.  Yay...

but Ron...

Fred (zathreyel) wrote,

my name is Michael!  ;-)

that's what i get for using a really obscure angel's name for my SN, eh?  and i'm not even christian!

[Keith Senkowski]

Hi

Being new to the role of exhibitor instead of rabid consumer, I was wondering, based upon past experience, how well have books sold in the past at the Forge booth.  The reason I ask is I want to have a rough idea on how many I should bring down.  10?  20?  2?

Thanks
Keith

[Ron Edwards]

Hi Keith,

There's no actual policy on how many, and I've been proven wrong on several occasions when people asked my advice.

Fellow publishers who've done this: what do you say? My past answer ("20") seems to have been a major under-estimate. 50? Or are there indicators one can use to help make a decision, in terms of pre-convention promotion or sales?

Best,
Ron

[Matt Snyder]

Keith,

When I unveiled Dust Devils at GenCon 2002 I sold out of about 40 copies, and we had to turn people away  (only a couple, thankfully) on Sunday. Last year, I wasn't at the con, but I still managed to sell around 15-20.

Other games have had more and less success in terms of numbers. My take is that if you don't mind hauling a box of books around, just bring more than you know you'll sell. The worst thing that you could do is run out of copies and turn people away empty-handed.

I'd recommend bringing 30-40 copies.

[coxcomb]

..hoping to be a game pimp at the Forge booth...

That has a certain ring to it. Perhaps special "game pimp" hats are in order. ;-)

Anyway, a related question. How much and what type of promotion have people done in prep for GenCon in the past? And did you find it effective?

It seems that on a previous year I was able to find info about advertising in the Con booklet, but I didn't see any on my quick visit to their Web site this year.

[Jake Norwood]

Price is an issue, too.  If your game is $10-ish, you will sell more.  If it breaches the $10-25 mark, you will sell less (but you'll make more per copy).

Jake

[Trevis Martin]

I have two questions and am unsure about which thread to post both in.  So I'll just put em together here.  The first is for being a volunteer at the forge booth.  I will not be selling a game, I just want to help.  Is the cost for that badge the same as a normal badge?  and I send that money to Ron?  Or can I buy a general attendee's badge and just help out anyway?

Secondly,  If the above is the case  I have a question on accomodations.  Looking at their website they seem to have a system of getting a hotel room through them when you have registered ( I understand that they reserve a block of rooms).  For those who went before, did you use said system or  just establish your accomodations directly with the hotels?

Myself, two freinds, and my wife are planning on going out there.  Only two of the four of us are wanting to go to the convention itself and only I (I'm pretty sure) want to hang out with the Forge people a bunch :).  So I was looking into getting rooms with the living room area thingie and I don't know if such things are available if we go through Gencon's hotel reservation system.

Thanks much.

Trevis

[Matt Gwinn]

Trevis,
You need to buy a badge through the Gencon site to reserve a room through their system.  There are a few options.

option 1: Have your wife buy her badge through the gencon site and reserve the room under her name.

option 2: Buy an  extra 1 day badge through the gencon site.  The number of days your badge is good for doesn't make any difference on how many days you can get a room.  Simply buying a badge gets you access to the system.

option 3:  Call the hotel directly and reserve a room as if you were not going to the con.  This might cost more and seriously limit your hotel choices.


If you want a room with a livingroom area, the Comfort Inn has 5 person suites for $149 a night which is a damn fine deal for a room with 2 beds, a couch, table and kitchenette. - That's what my Fiance got.


hope that helps

,Matt Gwinn

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

Trevis, you wrote,

The first is for being a volunteer at the forge booth. I will not be selling a game, I just want to help. Is the cost for that badge the same as a normal badge? and I send that money to Ron? Or can I buy a general attendee's badge and just help out anyway?

The cost for the exhibitor badge is supposed to be the same as a typical four-day guest badge. Sometimes it's a little different only because that information isn't always available, or they change it later, or something.

However, if you buy a general attendee badge from GenCon instead of a Forge exhibitor booth badge from us (me, Jake, Ralph, Luke), you can't be staff at the booth. Your participation there is welcome, but you can't work the register, be scheduled to run demos, come to the meetings about what we're doing (which are usually during the no-guests times in the hall), and so on.

So yes, you can help out, but no, you can't be included in a whole bunch of helping-out activities. In many ways, the financial commitment to the booth itself is an anchor which permits a lot of the booth activities to function, and people who don't buy in at that level are, basically, just friendly GenCon guests. They're welcome but not staff and only allowed to help in small ways.

All that said, if that's what you'd prefer to do, that is OK.

Secondly, If the above is the case I have a question on accomodations. Looking at their website they seem to have a system of getting a hotel room through them when you have registered ( I understand that they reserve a block of rooms). For those who went before, did you use said system or just establish your accomodations directly with the hotels?

One of the better things about Indianapolis over Milwaukee is that getting decent hotel space at a reasonable price is no longer a life-or-death issue. With any luck it'll be no particular difference whether people do or do not register with GenCon.

Best,
Ron

[daMoose_Neo]

This might not help yourself, but there is a Super 8 (I think thats it) not like 10 minutes from the Convention!
Went last year, spent like $47 for a 1 night stay, 2 person. Rooms are a touch small, but it is RIGHT around the corner from the convention (back lot leads to the exit to the place, which is right off another exit). Not too shabby.
Plus, I was able to get the room like the night before the convention (it was kinda up in the air as to whether or not we were going, so lodging got last minute treatment).

[Lxndr]

Is that a ten minute WALK?  Or are you assuming some sort of vehicular use?

[Tav_Behemoth]

I too am hoping to have my fabulous debut as a game designer, Masters and Minions, ready in time for GenCon. Joining y'all at an uber-table sounds much better for my purposes than a booth of my own, and the extra stuff at the $200 level definitely sounds worth it to me.

Before I sign on, though, allow me to ask about some potential complications:

1) I already bought a badge for myself, in order to submit an event (a three-round D&D tournament using material from Masters and Minions. All Forgers are encouraged to play: hopefully it'll be fun in its own right and not solely an excuse to give away copies of our book & related merchandise!). However, one or two of my co-authors are also planning to attend but haven't registered yet. Would it be possible for one of us to buy a badge from you, but for all of us to serve as volunteer game-pimps? (None of us are babes, alas.)

2) As the above implies, my company is a fledgling independent publisher of RPGs, but our initial offering is a d20 book rather than a true indie RPG. I certainly feel we have more in common with "you" than with "them"—we intend to release original game-systems in the future as well as licensed products, and the principles on which our company is founded are deliberately opposed to the mainstream "industry standard". But, having endured the shame of being devoted to D&D throughout the worst years of T$R, I'll understand completely if our indie cred is declined this year; we'll try again!

I look forward to meeting y'all at the table one way or another, and hats off to Ron for creating this fantastic opportunity.

[Ron Edwards]

Hi there,

Good news for you on both counts.

1) I already bought a badge for myself, in order to submit an event (a three-round D&D tournament using material from Masters and Minions. All Forgers are encouraged to play: hopefully it'll be fun in its own right and not solely an excuse to give away copies of our book & related merchandise!). However, one or two of my co-authors are also planning to attend but haven't registered yet. Would it be possible for one of us to buy a badge from you, but for all of us to serve as volunteer game-pimps? (None of us are babes, alas.)

As long as one of you does buy a badge through the Forge booth, then you are all good! So you get the benefit of (a) GenCon registrant and thus get event-access, and (b) Forge booth membership too.

I confess I hadn't thought of that tactic before. It's perfectly legit.

2) As the above implies, my company is a fledgling independent publisher of RPGs, but our initial offering is a d20 book rather than a true indie RPG. I certainly feel we have more in common with "you" than with "them"—we intend to release original game-systems in the future as well as licensed products, and the principles on which our company is founded are deliberately opposed to the mainstream "industry standard". But, having endured the shame of being devoted to D&D throughout the worst years of T$R, I'll understand completely if our indie cred is declined this year; we'll try again!

There is nothing incompatible between independence in Forge terms and publishing a d20 game. There really isn't. We don't havec a "true indie" definition that excludes utilizing the d20 system or the OGL. Independent, here, only means creater ownership and control, i.e., self-publishing. So you're all good there too.

Best,
Ron