Each year, I think, "I should run some indie games at GenCon. Someone will show up." Each year, I end up with a few people who already like indie games in a hotel room.

This year, we could really get the word out about some great indie games by actually signing up to run normal ticketed GenCon events. If you look at http://www.wizards.com/gencon/2002/main.asp?x=2002/event_submission_instructions,3, you'll see the guidelines for running/submitting an event, and you can submit an event online.

For an event to show up in the pre-gen book, you have to submit it by March 1. For the on-site book, you have to submit by June 1. That pre-registration book is important - most people sign up for games early on.

Other points of interest:

- You run 16 hours of anything, and your badge fee's refunded. Save some money and run some games.

- You can also submit an event that is a seminar instead of a game. Imagine Ron running a "How to Publish Your Indie Game, and How I Did It" seminar. Imagine Jared running "Building an Audience through Web Memes" seminar. Imagine a group of us running a "Designing New Games - Why, How, and What For" seminar.

Discuss what games or seminars you might run here. With this, and a booth this year, we could have a huge impact.

Oh man, I need to find a way to get to GenCon. I think a game-design panel, or running a bunch of indie games is too cool. Clinton, should we go dutch on costs?

If anyone's willing to run a Harlekin-Maus game, please let me know!

I'm completely uncomfortable around large groups EXCEPT when I go into "crazy mad ninja" mode, in which case I turn rabid with manic glee and enthusiasm.

Which is worse, I don't know.

That said, I'd like to do some kind of indie game design seminar if some others will join in. One thing I was pondering would be a "workshop" style seminar where we yap for awhile and then break into groups to work with people, camp counselor style.

I think this could be cool as I'm more keen on getting in the trenches and talking game design in more intimate settings and less on just standing at a podium and flapping about shit while the audience catches up on sleep.

Of course, such a format has its problems. But it would be useful (I think) to shred some of those "Me, Game Designer!" "You, Gamer!" barriers that are so prevalent in the hobby (ahem, paging Lt. Col. Zocchi and his $50,000 game company).

But yes, I want to get out there and contribute more than just dumb ideas on HTML pages.

Oh, and I guess I could run InSpectres or something. That's a fun game to GM.

Hell, if I go, and you think I'd be worthy, I'll do some game design talking. And the workshop bit would be pretty cool. It would have to be structured, though, so we don't have a bunch of quarreling groups.

Ummm...I have a terrible speaking voice, but I could stand there and look ominous. Anything for you guys...

- Scott

Hey,

Count me in too... I'm currently working on a plan to get to GenCon, but the way it looks I won't be preregistering. I guess I could run something...... I don't know what. Heck, even if I sound like a blithering idiot, I'll talk about game design... at least the stuff I know about.

Tim
AKA Galfraxas

Before everyone gets overboard and says, "I'll help," let me restate what I said above.

No one is asking you to help with a seminar. In my experience, 90% of offers to "well, kinda jump in after things are set up" are empty. What I was stating above is that there's a chance right now for individual people to do something at GenCon that not only might bring more attention to indie games, but more importantly - might open someone's eyes and help them out.

As for me - I'm signing up to run two games of Donjon Krawl and am thinking about doing a seminar on "Establishing Web Presence."

I intend to run at least 2 sessions of Kayfabe, more if the game is actually ready for sale by CON. Does anyone know if you have to be preregistered to submit a game?

As far as seminars go, I don't really have as much to say as some of you, but I'd be willing to help fill out the crowd and be a plant for Q&A sessions.

On another note, my company has recently started in the screen printing business so I think I can get T-shirts pretty cheep. My department creates the screens so I should be able to get them with any artwork including the new Forge artwork that Matt created.

I don't know what my company plans to charge for shirts, but I will be able to buy everything at 30% off or more. I'm not making any promises, but I shoudl be able to work something out if Ron wants to sell Forge and Sorcerer T-Shirts.

If nothing else I intend to make a couple "Kayfabe", "Wyrd" and "The World the Flesh and The Devil" T-shirts. I'd like to make some Forge T-shirts for me and my travel mates, but I don't want to step on anyone's toes or violate any copywrite stuff.

,Matt

Damn, I'd love to run some games at GenCon -- most particularly of "Orcs" -- but I never know if I'll have enough to go until late in the year (sometimes not even then), which is a little late to get included in the registration booklet.

I'd like to run Sorcerer, too, probably both "vanilla" flavor and hardcore "S&S", maybe "EG." Well, here's to me trying to make it again this year!

And I'd absolutely love to print out some copies of "EG" and sell 'em from the booth ("Orcs," too, if I get it finished in time). Unfortunately, I have the feeling that it is a situation of using my money for GenCon or using my money for print runs.

Hey,

I'm not sure I understand this bit on the policy for GenCon:

Demo Events and Event Space

Demo events run to promote a game system should be free events and can only be conducted at the company's booth in the Exhibit Hall. Event space is strictly for ticketed events. Sales are not permitted outside the Exhibit Hall. Product sales or running demo events outside of the Exhibit Hall may result in the forfeiture of company priority points, company removal from the convention, and the inability to participate in future Wizards of the Coast conventions.

Good call on that, Gordon. Here's how I see it:

- You can't sell anything outside the exhibit hall. I can't run a normal game with the intent to get people to buy Donjon.

- You can't run a demo game outside the exhibit hall. I can't run a normal game in order to teach people Donjon.

From these two, I can't see why I can't just run Donjon. If someone needs help with the rules, my job as the GM is to help them. I can't jump and down and tell people, "If you liked that, buy it," but I can give away a copy as a prize at the end of the game.

I've run official company demo packs before at GenCon as a normal event for the company (and got paid for it) - the rules are odd in that respect. I think running an indie game and teaching people how to play at the same time should be fine.

(And Donjon Krawl, the online playtest version, is free. Donjon, the official new game from me, will be sold at GenCon - probably for $15 a pop.)

Hey Clinton,

Does how (or whether) you schedule your events impact on this? Are you unconcerned because you plan to schedule your events and have them appear in the pre-reg book?

Paul

Paul,

I'm not exactly certain what you mean. What I mean by "normal game" above is one scheduled through Wizards and appearing in the pre-registration booklet. Regarding that, yes, I plan to actually schedule a game of Donjon Krawl or two and have them appear in the book.

I had to think long and hard about that, actually - people pay to play the games they register for. In the end, I decided to, as people that might not normally be exposed to an indie game will be through the game (and I will direct them to the Adept Press / Key20 / Forge booth.)

Hey Clinton,

The way I was reading the passage Gordon pasted was that game events in the pre-reg book lure gamers to the convention. Game events not in the pre-reg book for otherwise unknown systems, like Kayfabe, work to attract gamers already at the convention to a specific system, and thus are "demo events run to promote a system" that presumably can not be conducted external to the exhibit hall, but only "at the company's booth..."

You wouldn't be worried, because your Donjon events in the pre-reg book weren't demos by that understanding. But will the rest of us, who may or may not decide to run The World, the Flesh, and the Devil, for instance, be restricted to the booth?

Paul

Paul,

That's a really good point, and can be extended to "players may not even sign up for a game they don't know about." They'd probably be more likely to play a demo if you told them about it first.

By that reasoning, any games of Donjon would be demos. (And to be honest, they are. The point of me getting them in the pre-reg book is so a gamer in Wichita scratches his head and goes, "Donjon? Whazzat?")

I can assure you, though, that Ron is planning to make the booth a very demo-friendly place. I do think the way Origins is set up works even better - they have an open-gaming area so you can direct people from your booth to the area where there is more room.

Clinton

Sounds like the blurb in the program book should include a reference to the game. E.g., "Players should be familiar with the Donjon Krawl rules available at http://www.acid-reflex.com/rpg/donjon/". And if they aren't - who really pays attention to the requirements in those blubs? - Clinton can just explain it to 'em. Not a demo.

Paul could do the same with The World and get in the program book - or just do the demo-in-Ron's-booth thing.

You know, I really AM going to go to GenCon this year, and the thought fills me with an awkward glee . . .

Gordon

Finally, something I can comment on.

Here's a synopsis of how this sort of thing actually played out at GenCon 2001, with the release of FVLMINIATA. I pre-registered to run 8 "normal" events. WotC scheduled them and gave them table space just like any other independent GM running any other RPG. Whether or not I gave out prizes was up to us (we did). I collected event tickets from the players at these games (and turned them in and got my badge price returned [I was not registered as an exhibitor, that was my partner]). At each game, I quite openly announced that FVLMINATA was available for sale at the Wizard's Attic booth in the exhibit hall and gave the booth number. An off-duty room marshall (or whatever the semi-official guys who tell you what game is at what table are called) even played in one of the games and didn't bat an eye when I mentioned this fact. From WotC's perspective, it's really no different from an non-game-designer GM saying "Company X has a cool new splatbook at their booth!"

My understanding of WotC policy is this: the only place money is allowed to change hands is in the exhibit hall, between exhibitors who have paid their exhibit fees. If you want to run an event that is advertised in the Pre-Reg book (even though the Pre-Reg book is only online this year, I highly recommend it) for which WotC provides "official" play space, then they get the players' event fees. I believe that what they mean by the word "demo" is an event that does not have an event fee attached to it--with the exception of "open gaming," which I'll get to in a minute. A demo costs WotC nothing (you have to handle advertising) and the only money they get is from someone probably renting larger booth-space.

As far as running open games, I have a feeling that this is what Clinton's "games in the hotel room" were, as the "official" open gaming space has been shrinking and getting harder and harder to find each year. I have seen companies run their demos in the open gaming area, while selling product in the exhibit hall.

I hope this has cleared some things up. (I also hoped I posted the darn thing correctly).

Mike (oh no, not another one), is right.

The only way that you'd get jacked for playing a "demo" of your game would be if you were to hawk it right out there in the game room. I've played in jillions of events where people have mentioned that they are selling the game up in booth #whatever when it was done. All WotC wants to prevent is a company from using gaming tables as cheap floating booths to actually advertise and sell product from. The only occasion where I could see it possibly being a problem is if you were to be obnoxious about mentioning the game or something, in which case a player might complain or something. Still, never seen it happen, even in some rather blatant examples.

Instead of labeling it a demo, just use the tried and true, "beginners welcome" or "rules will be taught". In fact this used to be part of how entries in the programmes were listed, and is expected by the staff. Beware what you ask for, however. This is an invitation for kids to show up (although there are less kids every year).

Mike

Well, as a quick aside, I should think that Donjon Krawl is an ideal game for children to excercise their imagination, with a little GM guidance and help. In fact, I'd love to see someone try to do a "Pokemon Trainer" class in Donjon Krawl alongside a normal set of dungeoneering PCs. They could try and capture and train the monsters. ;-)