Topic: Desire, Action, Effect
Started by: Levi Kornelsen
Started on: 7/31/2005
Board: RPG Theory
On 7/31/2005 at 7:32am, Levi Kornelsen wrote:
Desire, Action, Effect
Okay, simple challenge. Pick something you did to change your game, and write it up something like this:
1. The change I wanted in my game was: Name something that you wanted to change about your game, that you made an actual attempt at. You wanted more time spent planning the fights, more immersion, less immersion, more tactics in combat, less jokes at the table. Whatever.
2. What I did was this: Name something you did to actually effect change. Give as many details as are necessary, but try to keep away from both extreme rambling and too-little-content for someone else to try it. If you borrowed a method from a specific game, say where it's from, and give a usable description of the method or mechanic you borrowed, or a link to a good description.
3. It had these results: Tell us what the effects were. Did you get what you wanted? Did it have other effects as well? What did the players think?
On 7/31/2005 at 12:20pm, ephemere wrote:
Re: Desire, Action, Effect
I'm not completely certain what you're hoping to get out of this thread, but I think I have a recent example.
The game I'm currently designing is heavily dependent on a pre-written, episodic storyline. Not to say that the Player Characters' actions are predetermined -- their actions breathe life into the setting -- but the overall story is laid out to assist the 'Authoritarian GM' that Eero mentions over here: www.indie-rpgs.com/forum/index.php?topic=16146.0. (I sometimes wonder if this makes me a struggling novelist that needs to get over the whole roleplaying thing.)
The system revolves around a simple stone-draw mechanic: the GM and the players each have a bag filled with a variety of colored stones. For trait and skill tests, the acting player and the GM each draw a stone from their respective bags, and the value of the GM's stone is subtracted from the player's, creating a modifier to the PC's attribute. You can think of the GM's bag as the negative bag, and the players' bag as the positive bag -- but this is reversed, of course, when the GM must perform a test for an NPC.
Sorry to ramble. . . thought I should (not-so-) briefly introduce the system before presenting my dilemma.
1. The change I wanted
There were two elements I found missing in the system:
1. Any semblance of a reward system, for any player activity at all. Specifically, I wanted to reward (a) instances of play that forwarded the plot in a dramatic way (especially ones that I, as the GM [Storyteller?] hadn't previously envisioned), and (b) inspired character portrayal, or roleplaying.
2. Something that somehow distinguished the core mechanic from dice. In the words of Doug Ruff. . .
Doug wrote:
[. . .] non-dice randomisers are great, especially when they don't behave like dice.
2. What I did:
Doug and Eero were both extremely helpful in helping me formulate this. In the end, it was pretty simple: let the players add stones to their bag (thereby improving the PC's overall chances), the colors (values) of the stones based on the significance of the player's action (+1, +2, or +3). For example, a player comes up with a plan of action that leads the party to a location and a series of events that I (the GM) had never considered. Although this forces me to improvise extensively in reaction to their plot developments, the resulting play is both challenging, rewarding, and helps to tie up a few loose ends that were otherwise left. . . well, loose. For an instance such as this, I would award the player a +2 stone.
I also decided to balance this by allowing the GM to add stones to his bag, creating constantly-shifting probability on both sides. The stones the GM adds are based on decisions the players made during character creation -- basically, if they took really high trait levels, they have to pay for them later on when the GM decides to drop a stone in his bag. There's a system for this, but I won't go into it -- it's basically a mechanized version of Amber's 'Bad Stuff', for those of you that are familiar.
3. The results:
I have not as yet had a chance to playtest this. My current (summer) group is winding down in preparation for everybody returning to school, so I might not get a chance to until I form a new one.
In summation, allowing the players to adjust the probability of the game is a great way to reward whatever behavior the GM wishes, along the lines of whatever Creative Agenda he is trying to encourage.
Forge Reference Links:
Topic 16146
On 8/1/2005 at 9:04pm, Adam Dray wrote:
RE: Re: Desire, Action, Effect
Is this a survey? What do you mean by "your game?" Do you mean a game I designed, a game I'm running, a game I'm playing in? What do you want to get out of this thread?
On 8/2/2005 at 1:22am, Nathan P. wrote:
RE: Re: Desire, Action, Effect
I think this thread could be great as some examples of theory applied (!) to actual gaming, if Levi is talking about actual play. Of course, then it should probably be in the AP forum. I'll wait until clarification before contributing...
On 8/2/2005 at 9:58pm, Levi Kornelsen wrote:
RE: Re: Desire, Action, Effect
Nathan wrote:
I think this thread could be great as some examples of theory applied (!) to actual gaming, if Levi is talking about actual play. Of course, then it should probably be in the AP forum. I'll wait until clarification before contributing...
Yes, applied to actual play. If that should go in actual play forum, then great... But, isn't part of the testing and development of any theory - of whatever kind - seeing how it is applied in use? Some people learn more from the examples in, say, a game book, than from the expository text. Some learn more in playing games than in reading them.
Observation leads to Theory - Theory leads to Tool-making (and I'm starting to find quite a few of those tools around, now) - Tool-making leads to Implementation - Implementaion can be observed. This, to me, is kind of the cyclical process that refines theories of this kind, whether the big picture ones or the "how to deal with incompatability X in play".
I'd rather ask for examples of, well, everything here, and get them from those interested in giving them, than post up a "Can you give me an example?" in every thread where I think it might help me.