Okay, following the tradition that seems to be popular of starting a new thread for a new topic (even if it's only slightly off-topic) I'm asking this in a new thread. If I'm wrong to do so, I'm sure someone will tell me...

So here's the deal. I looked all over, and got the definitions of premise, so I won't be off-base here.. I'm trying to come up with a premise for Mage Blade. It seems to me, (though it's not stated in any of the definitions) that Premise needs to be fairly short and to the point. That's where I have problems.

"Mage Blade is a game where nearly everyone is a mage of some sort."

While this is the idea that the game was built upon, it's not much of a premise. It does very little to interest anyone, unless they somehow have always wanted to play in a game where nearly everyone is a mage of some sort. It also fails to sufficiently define what the game is about. I suppose it works as a Proto-Premise...

I am considering that the game is primarily simulationist (exploration of what it would be to be a mage, or to be a certain type of mage, or to be a member of such a magically rich setting, or to live within the given Society) so the Premise should define what is to be explored by the characters.

However, there are also the broader connotations of premise to fulfill, as well. "What interests me about this game?" and "What interests us about this game to the extent that we wish to play it together?" and even just a definition of what the characters will be doing in the game.

I can explain all of these things, but not in a neat summation. That is what I would like to address mostly in this thread, is a way to neatly sum up the disparate answers and questions to create a workable Premise for Mage Blade.

What's the background setting? Sci-fi? Fantasy? Modern day?

Perhaps this will help: Why do you WANT to play a mage?

Here's some possibilities that spring to mind for me:

I want to fire giant Dragonball Z type spells.
I want to do freaky supernatural things.
I don't want to rely on tools to make my way through life.

Here's some premises you might get from the above:

When is it ok to use gross destructive/world altering power?
How much power are you willing to use to get what you want?(same as Sorcerer: How far are you willing to go?)
What would you do if you had freaky supernatural powers?
What kind of society would exist if everyone had supernatural powers?
What would you do if you were self sufficient?
How would you remain "human" if you were self sufficient?
How would power change you?
What is the value of being dependant(on others, on tools, etc)?
Would you let someone use you for your powers? If so, why?

First examine why you'd want to play a mage, there lies the idea of your premise.

Chris

Lance,

Chris provides some really compelling Premises, mostly of the narrativist sort (i.e., he poses them as a sort of question or statement with moral, emotional weight). But Premise doesn't have to be complicated. If you're going the simulationist route, as you claim to be, then "What's it like to be a Mage?" works just fine - that's the classic simulationist Premise.

How much time have you spent with Ars Magica? That's the granddaddy of all simulationist wizardly games, and you'd do well to check it out, if only to see how you can do it better and/or so you know what you want to avoid.

- Scott

Hi there,

First of all, Chris, that was beautiful ...

Second, I think that Simulationist Premises start as very basic "what's it like to ..." statements or questions, but like any other applied premise, they need focus when we move to actual design and actual play.

Therefore, I think that even for a hard-core Sim game, it helps a great deal to say, "Why be a mage? What's so interesting about it?" It also makes sense that the usual way to answer this question is to start talking about setting, especially setting back-story, and system, especially elements of magic resolution.

However, answering in that way tends to veer off from its purpose (focusing why one would want to play a mage in Mage Blade, or in the Mage Blade way) and get wrapped up in side debates or enthusiasms about the setting or system. I suggest that a lot of care is necessary exactly at this stage.

So I ask: in Mage Blade, what is interesting, compelling, or attractive about playing a mage at all? What does the magic look like? If a mage strides into a royal court, unannounced, what do people do? Why? What kind of problem could only be faced by a mage?

I hope people understand that these questions and others like them are the crux of Simulationist Premise. They do not directly pose moral questions to the real-people participants or carry any other metagame content. They are focused versions of the most basic Simulationist Premise-question, which is "What's it like to be a mage?"

Best,
Ron

Ron Edwards wrote: Hi there,

So I ask: in Mage Blade, what is interesting, compelling, or attractive about playing a mage at all? What does the magic look like? If a mage strides into a royal court, unannounced, what do people do? Why? What kind of problem could only be faced by a mage?
Ron

So basically I'm gathering that the premise should, at it's core, ask the question "What's it like to be a mage?" and challenge the players to answer it, or at the very least, seek the answer to the question for themselves.

I can deal with this.

Proto-Premise: Magic is pervasive, but trained magi are not quite so common.

Premise: You play one of many variants of magi within a magic-rich fantasy setting.

Gamist Premise: By gaining proficiency in magic and other skills, you become more diversely powerful.

Narrativist Premise: How does the mage coexist with others? Does their skill liberate them from social restrictions, or does it imply a responsibility to society? Where is the line between man (elf, orc, dwarf, whatever) and magic?

Simulationist Premise: What is it like to be a mage? How does magic work at the core of things? What are the limits, if any?How far can the synergy between non-magical skills and magic be pushed?

These are some 9 am, haven't been to bed yet ideas, so forgive me if I get it wrong. I'm trying as much to figure out phrasing as to figure out exactly what the premise would be.

Hey Lance,

Sleep-deprived state or not, you are hitting on all cylinders as far as I or anyone (I think) could be concerned. Dead-on.

I look forward to your presentation of Mage Blade's premise, pending sleep and further decisions.

Best,
Ron

For some good examples of setting exploration, take a look at Abberant, Godlike, and Shadowrun, all of which really show different views of societies under the shadow of those with and those without power :)

Chris