Hi there,

A couple of unpleasant anecdotes have surfaced in this thread in the Sorcerer forum. I am seeing a very marked dichotomy across stores in terms of Sorcerer, one of which is tremendously positive and another, sadly, is not.

I have a lot of comments about this, as I barely touched on in the thread, and I'd like to open the topic up as a general publishing issue. What practices at stores may be improved, such that small-press games' success with players is recognized and reinforced at the game store, as a continuing source of sales?

People with retail experience are especially welcome to explain what they think about it.

One thing I'd like to avoid, though, is excuse-making on all sides. Given that "everyone benefits" (theoretically) when a customer buys a product, no real excuse for impeding the process can exist. Let's recognize the problem as a real problem and talk about means of addressing it.

Best,
Ron

As a customer with some business experience as well, I'd say the #1 failure I see in retail gaming stores is the use of sales as the only metric of interest. There are lots of other tools, commonly used by the bigger companies, but that are nonetheless accessible even to the puniest FLGS.

Even a very friendly interchange at an FLGS about an indie game can result in no real gain for anyone. If customers are mentioning games they want, and it doesn't get back to the person who actually does the ordering, these are likely to be lost sales. A local FLGS that I don't buy games at repeatedly made it my job to communicate with their "gaming guy". I'm not a big fan of the notion that you kiss customer ass in every way possible, as I was trained at Borders, but scribbling a note and returning a call is pretty standard business practice. If customer-to-store communication is OK but employee-to-employee communication isn't facilitated, you lose again, in a lot of ways.

Stores of any kind are wise to give their customers an easy way to leave feedback, yet I rarely see small retailers of any kind with the humble Suggestion Box. My favorite FLGS (which carries all the Sorcerer stuff and has a rack that might as well be labelled "Indie Games") produces a newsletter, but doesn't put surveys in it.

I'm early-morning pre-coffee rambling a bit here. The point is, communication. Just acting interested, as a business, wins customer loyalty.

Point #2: keeping the right customers by empowering employees. This feeds into the whole question of what is customer service. Just having the maximum number of customers isn't necessarily the best thing to do, even if you only look at it from the most narrowly-defined business priorities. A gaming store would like to have well-behaved customers who spend money and get their friends spending money. But one obnoxious customer who eats up employee time, annoys other customers, and yet spends money, is not a customer you actually want. (Well, if that really is your main priority, maybe it is worth it--but set up private appointments for this joker, if you must deal with him or her.) Time and again, as an employee and as a customer, I've seen retail businesses put up with really extraordinarily idiotic customer behavior in the name of retaining that sourpuss. You can turn around a mean, ungrateful person--I've done it several times working at an ISP--but there should be someone in the store who is explicitly allowed to make the judgment call about whether that is possible, and allowed to act on the judgment by ejecting someone or just inviting them (politely, alwasy politely) not to return.

This problem is in no way unique to game retailers, though I do hear some of the more horrifying stories about it from folks who work in that business. Condensed point #2: figure out what kind of customer you want, and focus on them. You cannot make everyone happy. Trying to do that wastes time and money.

I hope this is useful; my intention is to offer it very much in the spirit of wanting to improve things and not just "spouting off".

J B Bell

Ever notice that grocery stores always put the milk in the back? They do this because they know people will buy it no matter where it is in the store. By placing it in the back customers have to walk past everything else and are more likely to pick something up on the way to the milk and on the way back to the register.

Why don't gaming stores do this? D&D and White wolf will sell - there's no question about it. So, why is it that every gaming store puts the D&D and White wolf stuff in the front of the store and basicly hide everything else? If a game rots on the shelf for months at a time it is in the store owner's best interest to get people interested in that game. Put it up front, make it look important, encourage your employees to learn about it and push it. Better yet, find someone to playtest it in your store.

After I got out of college I started plans to open my own store. Although I never managed to get the cash together for it I did come up with a lot of ideas. One idea was to pick one game every week and run a demo of it. If you played in the demo you got a discount on the game. NOw seeing that I never had the chance to impliment the idea who knows if it would have worked, but I think it had potential.

,Matt

Ron Edwards wrote: I have a lot of comments about this, as I barely touched on in the thread, and I'd like to open the topic up as a general publishing issue. What practices at stores may be improved, such that small-press games' success with players is recognized and reinforced at the game store, as a continuing source of sales?

People with retail experience are especially welcome to explain what they think about it.

One thing I'd like to avoid, though, is excuse-making on all sides. Given that "everyone benefits" (theoretically) when a customer buys a product, no real excuse for impeding the process can exist. Let's recognize the problem as a real problem and talk about means of addressing it.

Fang,

That's all good, except that it doesn't address my topic at all. I'm quite happy with my promotion and with my interactions with retailers, although I think my tactics regarding "store events" are probably a little different from the traditional demo thing (which frankly doesn't accomplish much).

My topic was not "what can a manufacturer do," but rather, "what can stores do better," especially in terms of not carrying out grossly negative actions such as the counter-guy who mocks customers' purchases.

I cite a similar experience of mine lately; I bought close to $90 worth of material at a certain store, and the chubby guy who was hanging out near the counter informed me, nasally, that my purchase "sucked," with the counter-fellow's approval.

And then, the following question goes back to the manufacturer, but in a different context. How can a manufacturer promote better practices in stores - is this even possible? And if it isn't, the next question becomes, how can a manufacturer reward the fraction of stores that already have better practices? My personal plan is to write off the "negative" stores entirely; it seems to me that no effort on my part will improve Sorcerer's potential to be sold there over the long term. However, that brings the real question of rewarding and interacting with the "good" stores into sharp focus.

Best,
Ron

As far as the stores that just don't get basic customer interaction, such as Ron just described, there isn't a darned thing you can do, and you're wasting you time trying. Fortunately, the market itself will probably take care of these guys--treating a customer that way isn't a good plan for repeat business.

A major problem that at least one local store faces is reorders. The games manager is very good about getting new things in and trying them out. What he isn't good at is tracking what he's sold and reordering. So what he does is take a look at his consistent sellers and order enough to restock his shelves, then looks for obvious holes in the rest of the shelf space. A smaller market game like Sorcerer or Call of Cthulhu doesn't make a big hole when it's gone, so he reorders.

The system I proposed for him, and which I'll eventually help him hammer out, is a way of tracking what's been ordered, taking an inventory just before re-order day, and then ordering the difference between the two. Catching this information is important, because he knows he's losing sales when a product sells out and he doesn't re-order.

I suspect that a lot of store owners and managers are in the same boat. What's needed is 1) education on the basic fact that this reorder problem does cost them sales, and 2) help for the retailer in implementing a system for reordering that's more sophisticated than a quick glance through the shelves.

Ron,

I'm kinda confused what you're saying. I was trying to give both my experiences as 'an insider' in a bad store and to suggest how one could possibly turn that around, but only from a single-manufacturer point of view. (I'm pretty positive that you can't change the operation of a store from 'the outside.')

First you say, "My topic was not 'what can a manufacturer do,' but rather, 'what can stores do better.'" But then you say, "How can a manufacturer promote better practices in stores - is this even possible?" Isn't to "promote better practices in stores," "what can a manufacturer do?"

My commentary illustrated a single case in my personal experience and then built on it to a general suggestion of action. I spoke pro-actively ('get out there and support them'), not reactively ('write them off'), so I don't see how I didn't address your question.

I talked about the barriers that 'make things go wrong' ("is this even possible?"), suggesting they seem insurmountable from the 'distant manufacturer' prespective. I think the implication was clear that only direct contact had any chance. And that was my "rewarding and interacting" advice.

I chose not to 'make excuses,' because I don't think that apathy is an excuse (but actually a symptom of 'overstimulation'). Just talking about what is 'wrong with stores' (implied by "what can stores do better") without some sketch of action is probably as worthwhile as whining.

So I'm left wondering, if that didn't respond to your question, what is your question?

Fang Langford

Before I forget, when I say 'events' I mean a lot more than just the archtypical 'demo game.' (Those are an anathema to most stores because it always starts with, "We'd like to run an event for your store, here's what we need from you....")

An 'event' as I have called them, is anything that 1) makes the store's staff's jobs easier, 2) doesn't ask anything from them, and (most importantly) 3) does them some good. Too many times have I seen well-meaning people approach the store I worked at looking for space, support, clean-up, and prizes. (All of those things cost money; what store would give you, free, the expensive retail space they have, time away from their employees regular duties, and product!)

If you absolutely have to run an 'demo game,' for gosh sakes try to be extremely cognizant of what your asking of the store. Most 'bad' stores aren't gonna want to 'give' you anything, and they might be the more important ones to 'win over.' Find your own space, supply your own materials and furnishings, have non-playing coordinators on hand to handle the details, be extra careful what you leave behind, and certainly supply your own prizes. Personally, I can't think of any reason a 'bad' store would even permit you to do something in conjunction with them unless it was for PR exposure (and that's a minefield of it's own; it's their rep on the line after all).

Think small. If you want premium sales space, make up a display (a small one at first). Offer to install it and be sure to check on it frequently, the last thing a store wants is a white elephant display that takes up space and looks like its falling apart. Heck, most stores will let you put a 'shelf card' on a display and might be impressed if you help them keep their displays straight regularly. The important thing is to impress them with your diligence. (Make them think, 'hey, that guy from so and so is really busting his gut to make us money on his product.' They'll be more likely to remember you around ordering time.)

I mean agents who regularly come up and say 'have you got so and so in stock' whether or not its on the shelf, works (I suppose), but if you really want them to remember you, run a demo game just for the staff! (Make sure you blow their doors off when you do it. And don't be afraid to make it a regular event.) The more they want to know about your stuff, the better (especially if you can answer that need).

There are lots of ways I haven't even thought of or could be listed here. They are revolve around building awareness not only for your game with the staff but of the store with your potential audience. I hope these examples help 'shake loose' the thinking about what relationship you can have with your local gaming store. (One caveat; I don't really have much idea what you would do with a wider distribution area, I'm mostly into, what is it? guerilla marketing?)

Fang Langford

Business standpoint:
What we can do is to first be sure of who we forming a relationship with in the store. Joe-Blow behind the counter is Joe-Blow. He works for $7.00 and hour and can't make decisions about inventory. He likely also has written his own game "like D&D only better" and will talk to you nicely or not depending on how *his* day is going. So write him off now. He's worthless as a business relationship.

(As JB Bell suggests) Find out who the store owner(s) are. If it's a chain store, look up the buyer online. Pitch to them, not to the employees.

And for the love of all that's holy DO NOT pitch to customers and players in the store!

In the Store
Run your demos by getting a few regulars together and then set aside a table and play. DO NOT go into a long dissertation about your game with the manager or Joe-Blow. Just ask for a table, or give a name and ask for one (or write the game's name down on the calender, or whatever) and then get together and play it. (As Fang suggests) DO NOT make a big production out of it. Just be nice. Be polite. Do not disturb the other players and customers. DO NOT sell your game in their store. That's rude and amateurish. Less is more, keep your mouth shut. Be an example of what's great about in-store gaming. When your group is finished, police your area of soda cans and candy wrappers, and push the chairs in. Less work for store personnel will be remembered.

Now, if the manager or Joe-Blow nose around and actually (and this would be incredibly mindless) act as though they're not sure "it's allowed" or that you "can't play that here" or whatever, take the ENTIRE GROUP AND LEAVE. Politely, nicely. But leave. Because only a sincerely stupid ass would throw potential customers out of their very niche market retail store. Don't attempt to educate an ass. It's a waste of good gaming time. The players don't care about your bottom line either, they just want to have fun gaming. So don't F up two things over one dumbass.

Summary
I almost believe that retail stores are 99% redundant. Who isn't online? Who has never bought anything online? Remember, we are talking about more than just acceptance into retail stores (and not 'games are fun' or 'why gaming in stores is fun'), -it's the bottom line at issue here.

You want to move product. Period.

Establishing inroads to retail is about orders, not people playing your game. As Ron has pointed out, 'a sale is a sale is a sale' (Publisher-to distro-to store) is a false litany. It is not transparent, one sale does not guarantee the other(s). But it is a belief that persists among those in (any) business. So people 'liking your game' is almost incidental.

To be frank, I'd treat retail as the bonus avenue (but on YOUR terms) and pursue online market and other forms of direct sales as the primary means (not the other way around). The publishing market has evolved, so make your distribution and sales keep pace.

If I have wandered too far off topic, I apologize.

Jeff