So we held another playtest session on Thursday. I had not had a chance to read through the revised document, and the revisions didn't update the sample characters we'd been using, so we decided to do a character creation session.

I'm hoping the others really jump in here with their comments, because I was just guiding them through the process rather than experiencing it first hand. But I have some comments nonetheless.

1. For a game that by default expects the GM to pre-generate characters for the players, character creation is very involved. It might be too much. If character creation is going to stay this way, I think you need a character creation worksheet that does a lot of the heavy lifting. Alexander had some ideas about that he might want to share, if you're interested.

Personally, I think you might be best off providing a number of templates or chassis that players/GMs can just grab, make a few personalizing touches (like traits) and go. The more extensive character creation stuff could be placed in an appendix or online. Alternatively, I imagine it would not be too difficult to create an application -- or even a PDF doc that allows players and GMs to generate characters with a few clicks. However, that would require Web access.

2. The half-steps are more confusing than they are helpful. There's got to be a way to generate the numbers you want while still utilizing integers.

3. You've got an artifact on page 34 in the Influence section. It still describes Influence as equal to Anthropoid Class or 1/2 of Self Awareness.

4. On page 37, you give the option of rolling randomly to select Role Packages, but there's no table on which to roll.

5. On page 40, what happens if Specialties for Core Programs overlap? We have a process for skill programs but not one for core programs. Also, I believe you have an artifact on that page, as it says that if you don't have a Specialty in a program, all tests against that program count as unspecialized and the robot will face 4 Difficulty when using it.

6. It's a little confusing that you've put the Influence stuff in the Anthropoid Class step (step two), but the Role Score and Self Awareness Score are saved until Step 7. Especially since Influence refers to the Self Awareness Score.

Finally, it  seems to me that Inhuman Features and Personality Traits are the big areas for actual decisions in this process, especially if you're using the random methods. I feel like those areas could benefit by being given a greater amount of focus in the process.

Thor's mysterious comments on the ultra-complex character generation are provoking my interest. Ralph, haste thee a copy of the playtest rules to my direction!

Well, its not "ultracomplex", but "ultra disorganized" would be true enough, largely as a result of having been revised so many times.

1) Any suggestions to make it more organized are welcome.  I can whip up an NPC in about 5 minutes and a full fledged character in about 10-15.  Redesigning the workflow so that everyone can do that would be a great thing.

I had envisioned some sort of computer aid like Tony's Click and Locks that would fill in all the blanks quickly and easily...but that's rather dependent on getting the rules finalized.

That said...I have given some consideration to simply presenting the Band of Four as the characters you will be playing, period, as opposed to just samples.

2) The half steps have grown on me.  It admittedly made me wince to write those rules.  I did it because it was the quickest way of getting to where I wanted without completely revamping the whole Role Table structure.  While such a revamp may proove necessary, I wanted to at least get something workable sooner rather than later.  That said, in restatting out the NPCs and sample PCs...they worked really slick.  Much more interesting than I expected.  I found myself wondering which of the half-steps would wind up being "considered worthy" by the designers of getting a full upgrade and which would get dropped in the end.

In a nut shell, the player makes 6 choices for his character:  3 Roles (like King's Guard, Officer, Rake) and 3 Design Parameters (Build, Apparent Age, and Background).  These 6 combine to provide 13 "half steps" for attribute upgrades.  The robot will ultimately wind up with a total of +6 (in whole numbers) of upgrades so there is a routine thats run to determine which steps round up and which round down. 

Its totally open for change, but I actually find it working out pretty well.

3) Thanks.  Artifacts are a serious pain.

4) I may eliminate the random rolls altogether.  I had a column on the role table for rolling up the Roles, but given the number of changes made to that table over time, that got eliminated and not replaced.

5) You just get all of the specialties that are listed.  That's the same for all Programs.  You're likely thinking of what happens when you get a duplicate Program from the Roles.

6) Good point.

My plan to have the latest version available to all interested parties this weekend was derailed by the 3 inches of standing water in my basement a week and a half ago.  But I'm hoping by this weekend it will be ready to throw open to a broader audience.

Valamir wrote:
That said...I have given some consideration to simply presenting the Band of Four as the characters you will be playing, period, as opposed to just samples.

I think that the standard characters should be presented as the default, yes. Include the chargen as an appendix, for intrepid GMs who want to try something different.

Mike

Hey Ralph,

I found the chargen a drag, and found myself thinking "I want to do this with a click of a button and get my random bot, then I can choose some inhuman features (fun!) and get going." I liked the random rolling aspect, but fiddling with half-steps and so on... ugh that was some ugly stuff.

However, I think there's an opportunity to have a really fucking cool character creation worksheet in the form of a circuit board that you fill in as you go with your random choices, where logic gates and stuff combine to give you the values. Seriously, it could be super-super cool... but a tricky design challenge, of course. But so neat! I drew my character's positronic brain and look! It's cool! I have a Durability of 7: I'm so metal! This occurred to me with the whole half-step algorithm hoo-ha, which appeared overly intricate. Drawing is easy, though.

So I rolled randomly wherever I could, and picked some roles (fairly arbitrarily) based on wanting to end up a King's Guard, and ended up with a lot of overlapping skills. I felt cheated, because I ended up with a lot fewer specialties than everyone else, and there's no mechanical benefit to having, say, Horsemanship (Riding) in two role packages, other than the measly +1 (or +2?). In effect, I lost about 10-12 points of skill across the board and 3-4 specialties, which SUCKED. Because I'm a closet munchkin with a lollipop up my ass.

It is possible that I'm overstating the case. Too much coffee.

Also, do the upgrades your refer to in character creation count against the upgrade maximum for the anthropoid class? i.e. is it possible to sufficiently hack your base AC5 robot in chargen so much that you end up with slots for a nose and an AC of 4?

Traits are - unsurprisingly - tricky to come up with. I think you could require the GM to write everyone's role trait, and have a big list of suggestions.

That's it for now - in haste, and highly caffeinated,
Alexander

Iskander wrote:
Hey Ralph,
I found the chargen a drag, and found myself thinking "I want to do this with a click of a button and get my random bot, then I can choose some inhuman features (fun!) and get going." I liked the random rolling aspect, but fiddling with half-steps and so on... ugh that was some ugly stuff.

However, I think there's an opportunity to have a really fucking cool character creation worksheet in the form of a circuit board that you fill in as you go with your random choices, where logic gates and stuff combine to give you the values. Seriously, it could be super-super cool... but a tricky design challenge, of course. But so neat! I drew my character's positronic brain and look! It's cool! I have a Durability of 7: I'm so metal! This occurred to me with the whole half-step algorithm hoo-ha, which appeared overly intricate. Drawing is easy, though.

So I rolled randomly wherever I could, and picked some roles (fairly arbitrarily) based on wanting to end up a King's Guard, and ended up with a lot of overlapping skills. I felt cheated, because I ended up with a lot fewer specialties than everyone else, and there's no mechanical benefit to having, say, Horsemanship (Riding) in two role packages, other than the measly +1 (or +2?). In effect, I lost about 10-12 points of skill across the board and 3-4 specialties, which SUCKED. Because I'm a closet munchkin with a lollipop up my ass.

It is possible that I'm overstating the case. Too much coffee.

Also, do the upgrades your refer to in character creation count against the upgrade maximum for the anthropoid class? i.e. is it possible to sufficiently hack your base AC5 robot in chargen so much that you end up with slots for a nose and an AC of 4?

Traits are - unsurprisingly - tricky to come up with. I think you could require the GM to write everyone's role trait, and have a big list of suggestions.

Hey Ralph- a lot of my questions were addressed by Alexander.

We split it up and Dro and Alexander did random rolls while John and I picked from the list. Drozdal ended up with an AC2 robot while mine was AC5, and it seems like in terms of influence = ability to act, I might have a huge advantage over him if and when we get into conflict. We'll have to see it in play of course.

Hopefully we'll get a couple of sessions in next week and the week after before we see you at Forgecon.

peace

mmt

Mtiru wrote:
it seems like in terms of influence = ability to act, I might have a huge advantage over him if and when we get into conflict. We'll have to see it in play of course.