Topic: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
Started by: Frank Tarcikowski
Started on: 5/11/2007
Board: Playtesting
On 5/11/2007 at 10:39am, Frank Tarcikowski wrote:
[BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
Hi there!
When I first posted about BARBAREN! on the Forge, more than two years ago, Ron Edwards suggested the following:
I suggest that there be some mechanism for True Love (not by that name of course).
In other words, most of the women are exotic or earthy fuck-bunnies (did I say that? better edit it out), but every so often one comes along who just is The Woman for this hero.
Now, she's still sexually accessible. The Woman is all woman, know what I mean? But he isn't going to throw her away. He'll stick by her, and choose her over gold, and even kill his chieftain for her, if she wants. And hell, even if she's a vile sorceress, he'll grit his teeth and remain her loyal slayer-dude.
Now I'm getting all excited and only have one hand available for typing. (did I say that? better edit it out) So I'll sign off, but remember: mechanics for The Woman. Big time.
And I thought: Yes. That is totally something that belongs into the game. I’ve tried some approaches at how to enforce it mechanically, but was dissatisfied with the results and eventually turned to other matters. Then, just today, as I am writing a Con scenario for the game, it strikes me. And it’s easy!
So, in BARBAREN!, wooing for a woman is practically an extended conflict, with single steps being advances and rebukes. The main resource for the conflict is the man’s Attractive score and the woman’s Reluctant score (I’ll need better English words for these). You have a second resource, your Horny points, which can be used to boost a single advance, thereby being turned into XP. These Horny points are gained by fighting and other adventurous stuff.
Fighting works by exactly the same principle, only that the resources are called differently. The equivalent of Horny points are Aggro points, which are gained by laying women. Normally, you get Aggro points only the first time you lay a given woman, because the result of winning the wooing contest is that you have conquered her and she is now yours and will do anything you please.
Then there are Tricks. These are little throw-away feats that you can buy and burn like a D&D spell. For wooing, these used to include things like “snappish remark” or something for the women.
Now check out these new vile wooing Tricks for women:
* Demand: The woman uses her rebuke to demand something of the man. If her rebuke succeeds, he cannot continue wooing until he has done her bidding, or at least tried hard.
* Turn the tables: At any time in wooing, the woman can choose to turn the tables. She is now willing to give herself to him, the only question is who’ll come out on top. If he continues, and loses the contest, he’ll not own her, she’ll own him. In order to have sex with her, he has to do what she asks of him first. On the other hand, any sex with her will gain him Aggro points.
The system was built to handle The Woman all along. Big time!
Frank
Forge Reference Links:
Topic 14449
On 5/12/2007 at 2:50am, Ron Edwards wrote:
Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
(smiles) I know. I've been looking forward to this. No, I'm not being obnoxiously retroactive, either.
One thing that I'm not sure about, though - do you really want the Woman to be so ... well, annoying? I mean, we're talking about true love, not just a manipulative bimbo, right? I sorta thought along the lines that finding the Woman would be very, very hard, but worth the effort.
On the other hand, it's true that many a barbarian (or rather, mythological or legendary) hero has struggled and striven, found his True Love, and then after a little while of bliss, well, everything goes very badly after that.
So what do you think? You have more intuitive feel for the rules, obviously, so I trust your judgment.
Is there some way to work with that, the Woman as Desirable Disaster?
(Jesus. I think I just discovered a great new band name.)
Best, Ron
On 5/12/2007 at 9:08pm, Meguey wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
(This is the first Barbaren thread that's made me want to play. I'll keep watching.)
On 5/12/2007 at 11:19pm, Frank Tarcikowski wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
Hi Ron,
I see the above rules cover a variety of stuff happening both in and out of the SIS. A GM could use it to just spice up wooing a little, or as a chance to make those women who deserve to be called a Goddess at all accessible to any but the most adept player characters. It's important to note that the rule does not force the player to anything, rather giving him the option to walk away at any time.
As for the "true love" thing, I see that coming together when the player makes up his mind to become the loyal slayer-dude of this woman, and then chooses to let her turn the tables. Heck, it could be a rules option: If you win the wooing, you can either choose to have her be yours and do as you please (standard), or you can choose to have her turn the tables. That's to your benefit as well, as you can gain more Aggro points by having sex with her. Hey, I like that! I already know the chapter where I'll put it: Advanced Wooing. Thanks Ron, once again!
How well or badly things turn out in the end, well, I'm looking forward to discovering that myself, each time. I have a scenario, Desert Rose, built to put this very mechanic to the test. I'll use it on GroFaFo Rally in July at the latest, and post about it here.
Frank
On 5/13/2007 at 11:26am, Eero Tuovinen wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
So, in Barbaren! the Woman is something that controls and enslaves the barbarian protagonist? Weird.
On 5/13/2007 at 11:44am, Frank Tarcikowski wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
That's only realistic, Eero.
On 5/23/2007 at 1:14pm, Emily Care wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
Ha! More like the barbarian has to deal with her on her terms.
On the other hand, it's true that many a barbarian (or rather, mythological or legendary) hero has struggled and striven, found his True Love, and then after a little while of bliss, well, everything goes very badly after that.
So yes. The "he has to do what she wants first" is such the perfect set up for complications and disaster. "I just need the fruit from yonder witch's garden..." Or alternatively, suddenly the barbarian has this huge, woman-shaped vulnerability. Oh, yeah.
This looks great, Frank. A great development for the game. Looking forward to hearing about your playtests.
best,
Emily
On 5/23/2007 at 11:29pm, Noclue wrote:
RE: Re: [BARBAREN!] Finally, The Woman
So he goes off and pillages with all the aggro points. What does he do with all the Horny points he racks up?