As I finally begin to write the text of my sci-fi game of youthful rebellion, <a href="http://indie-insurgent.livejournal.com/1768.html">Misspent Youth, I am coming up against a concern I would imagine a number of people have already dealt with. To whit: there are many little snippets of song lyrics or quotes from books or speeches which would be ideal to evoke the feeling I'm going for and focus the reader's attention on a specific point I'd like to make.

Is anyone aware of what the law is regarding quoting small pieces of text when it comes to publishing? Is it like academia, where as long as you're using a small amount and you properly attribute it, you're cool?

Ron used a boatload of quotes from books in his Sorcerer text and supplements.  He'd probably have some idea.

I don't have an answer, and usual caveats apply regarding asking legal advice on the Internet (i.e., don't), but the big publishers tend to secure permission. I've seen lots of "written permission granted" statements on the inside covers of Stephen King books, for example. Get a publishing lawyer's advice if no one has a ready, authoritative (read: trained) response.

Hi there,

We've generated a ton of links in previous discussions about this. I'll look them up and maybe someone who's more savvy to it will do the same.

The following is not legal advice but it does illustrate my actions as a publisher when following legal advice.

1. I identified short quotes of text material with full attribution, such as I use throughout my Sorcerer books, as within the "fair use" concept, which does not require permission. I put a little paragraph in the indicia page too that explicitly states the article of copyright law I'm relying on, and which also says "I'm not claiming or challenging copyright over those quotes," or something like that. This doesn't mean someone can't sue me (hell, anyone can sue me, or you, or that fencepost over there, for anything!). 

2. I did not use song and poem lyrics because apparently "fair use" does not apply in their case.

I would prefer people not post with lots of opinions and claims about how copyrights, IP, fair use, and all that sort of thing work, or fail to work, as the case may be. Other publishers are free to describe what they did, as with my answer above. Otherwise, we should confine ourselves to finding and posting useful links to real-world, real-legal sites.

Best, Ron

Thanks, Ron. What you gave me is exactly what I was hoping to find: personal experiences and what people have done.

This isn't legal advice, but merely what I did as a publisher:

The original story I quoted from in the final version of Hero's Banner was clearly public domain, but because I was actually quoting from a translation, copyright protection applied to the translation.  Like Ron, I included a disclaimer in the front of the book and gave full credit to the author.  As I only quoted a handful of lines from a rather lengthy work, I'm confident the fair use laws protect me. 

On the other hand, I was originally going to quote a bunch of song lyrics.  Long story short, I chickened out.  It's not that fair use doesn't apply to song lyrics or poetry, it's just that you have to be more careful when quoting them because even a single line can make up a substantial percentage of the whole.  But that's not even the real reason that I decided not to quote the lyrics.  As we all know, the music industry is very litigious, and I just didn't want the headache of even a frivolous lawsuit.

Of course the surest way to cover your ass is to get written permission from the copyright holder for any work you plan to quote.  I did look into getting permission to quote some song lyrics, but the big record labels charge truly ridiculous rates for even a single line.

A related and upbeat story - I found some wonderful images for The Roach that had been published in 1921, but for various reasons were still within copyright.  I liked them so much I tracked down the rights holder, expained what I was doing, and he was like "sure, go ahead."

I was scared to approach the guy, but after he learned of the scope of the project, he was very agreeable (I sent him a copy of the game as thanks).  So if you do want to use something that's outside fair use protection or still within copyright, it can't hurt to just ask.  You might get laughed at or ignored, but you might not. 

One of the problems I'd have with going to a copyright owner for music is a lot of them are big corporations.

Hm, I guess I'll be full of Ani DiFranco lyrics? Assuming I can even get it to her.

Given that you are making a sci fi game (presumably at least a little ways into the future), why don't you invent your own lyrics, from songs written by fictional characters (from your setting's canon, if any)? There's a grand tradition of doing so in RPGs, from D&D to WoD.

Aside from that, could you not find poetry or fiction that's public domain that suits (H.G. Well and Orwell spring to mind)? As with PD artwork, there's no one to ask for permission. Heck, there might even be some public domain songs you could mine (i.e. from ragtime or traditional songs).

Finally, is there not a large enough music scene in NJ for you to, perhaps, track down local bands' lyrics and permissions? While it might cost a fortune to get permission to use a single line from a Chemical Brothers song, I bet there's local bands who'd let you use any number of lyrics for attribution and a link to their web site in credits. (Hmmm... Product tie-in idea: a CD compilation of local bands' song that evoke the game mood, included with the book.)

Hope this helps;
David

Yeah I actually do know at least one local band and that one could be entree into others. Good idea. As for inventing new lyrics, the game doesn't really have a setting but that doesn't mean I couldn't do it from sample settings.

Still, I reeeeeeeeally wish I could use this for a game about youthful rebellion and commodifcation:

'N' every gimmick hungry yob digging gold from rock 'n' roll
Grabs the mike to tell us he'll die before he's sold
But i believe in this-and it's been tested by research
That he who fucks nuns will later join the church

Robert wrote:
Still, I reeeeeeeeally wish I could use this for a game about youthful rebellion and commodifcation