Topic: Quest Based Card Game
Started by: Web_Weaver
Started on: 6/22/2007
Board: First Thoughts
On 6/22/2007 at 12:41pm, Web_Weaver wrote:
Quest Based Card Game
Whilst getting bored on a Coach journey and wishing I had a deck of cards I began to imagine a card game that engaged the players on more than a tactical level. I envisaged a trick based game that followed a classic stage by stage quest structure and could be narrated along the way.
I have some ideas for how the mechanics could work already but I want to express the idea on the conceptual level first and see if anyone else thinks this game has potential. I think I would like to play it, but I am a role-player, and my target audience is bored travellers who have exhausted their card game repertoire and want something that engages another part of their brain.
I see it as a game I could pitch to non-roleplayers, and as such it must be satisfying as a card game in its own right. Kind of a stealth RPG, aimed at non-roleplayers as a change of pace from those standard card games that we all love but soon tire of on a long journey.
Concept
A Card game for long journeys on public transport, which is also a game about journeys.
Look and feel
A trick based card game, containing a story telling element.
Design Aims
To create a game that can be played with only a standard set of playing cards, which lasts for 20-40 mins and can be played during a long train or bus journey. It should be playable by 2-5 players, must be teachable through simple description and demonstration, and should not require reference to a rule set once learnt.
Ideally it would take its place along side a long journey's other card games like Knock-out Whist or Pontoon, but would allow a story telling / roleplay element as a change of pace.
Who is it aimed at?
The target audience is primarily teenage inter-rail travellers or parents and children on long train journeys.
How does it play?
The intention is to make the game satisfying as a pure card game but at the same time encourage co-operative and competitive story-telling by making the process of playing clearly structured around story.
Each round in the game should be both a competitive tactical move and a framed scene with a clear competitive situation and a goal that can be obtained and used in the ongoing story.
The tactic for each round would be a simple choice of playing a card from ones hand akin to Plain-trick games but this should also serve as the fortune mechanic to inform the narration and decide who gains each goal.
The goal for each round should have a corresponding advantage represented in the card game, such as who goes first next round, or obtaining a useful card for helping in the remaining rounds.
(Two or more advantages could possibly be gained, each won by a different player.)
The goal each round should also serve to distribute scene framing rights and set clear narration order guidelines for the next round.
The Three Questions
1. What is your game about?
A competitive quest for an object or position which involves a classical journey with a stage to stage quest structure.
Like many journey stories this game is based on the journey itself, and the interactions contained are an important part of the game. However, the ultimate reward will go to the player who plays the best hand, so the game has a clear tactical winner.
2. What do the characters do?
Moving from situation to situation the characters compete at each stage in their journey to gain advantage in their quest. Each stage or scene contains a goal or object which will provide an advantage in the remaining scenes.
3. What do the players do?
The players simultaneously play the game at two levels which compliment each other.
On one level they play a satisfying card game with standard Playing Cards involving trump card game style round by round competition with satisfying tactics and an ultimate winner.
On another level the players are telling an emerging story about their characters journey which relates to and is informed by each tactical decision being played out in the card game.
Alternative three
(It may be a bit early to answer these, but here are my initial ideas.)
What is your game about?
As above
How is your game about that?
It is competitive on a tactical level, is structured as a journey with clear stages, it has an ultimate winner.
How does your game enforce/reinforce what it’s about?
By encouraging narration of each stage which is tied to, and informed by the tactical decisions. At each stage a player is both designated the winner and is rewarded with a tactical advantage in future rounds. An alternative tactic may be to concede victory in exchange for narration rights and trick calling, helping establish that there is merit in sharing out the spoils along the way, whilst not detracting from the tactical competition for the ultimate winner.
My questions to this forum
Is competitive play of this type capable of creating a satisfying “story-now” type game? My closest experience would be Once Upon a Time which has been mixed because the more competitive that game gets the less satisfactory I find the stories produced. I prefer to play Once Upon a Time with children and non-gamers for this reason, and this perhaps has informed my target audience choices.
Are their other comparable games out there already that might be useful, especially ones where the competitive element supports the story?
Is it too self defeating to try and create a game that ultimately can be passed on without a rule-book and no special equipment?
Do you think non-roleplayers would be interested in this game and conversely would a mixed group of gamers and casual players be able to play this kind of game together?
Is it just me that would seek to play a stealth RPG?
Is it even a good idea to try and disguise an RPG as a traditional card game?
On 6/22/2007 at 6:26pm, vertigo25 wrote:
Re: Quest Based Card Game
Web_Weaver wrote: Is competitive play of this type capable of creating a satisfying “story-now” type game? My closest experience would be Once Upon a Time which has been mixed because the more competitive that game gets the less satisfactory I find the stories produced. I prefer to play Once Upon a Time with children and non-gamers for this reason, and this perhaps has informed my target audience choices.
My direct answer to the question is, "yes." I think if handled well, it will definitely be capable of being a satisfying game. I think the fact that you, personally, are not very satisfied by a particular similar element in a similar game, is actually a good thing. It give you special insight in to how to make something for people who may not find the competitive part very fun.
Web_Weaver wrote: Is it too self defeating to try and create a game that ultimately can be passed on without a rule-book and no special equipment?
depends on what your ultimate goal is. If it's something you want to become a ubiquitous game like Hearts, Gin Rummy, Poker, etc., the the fact that it needs no special equipment is a bonus. If, on the other hand, it's something that you want to be able to have some kind of legal intellectually property rights control over, then you *have* to put some kind of special equipment in there, or trademark some names, or whatever. Rules, themselves, don't have the same protections that, say, a story or poem has (Ironically, stories created with your game would have more IP protection for the players than your game would for you). So, if you consider that shooting yourself in the foot, you'll need to come up with some kind of original designs or what have you.
One thing you might be able to do is turn that idea around: very nicely designed cards which could also be used as standard playing cards.
Web_Weaver wrote: Do you think non-roleplayers would be interested in this game and conversely would a mixed group of gamers and casual players be able to play this kind of game together?
Yes, and absolutely! It actually sounds like a good gateway dru... er... game.
Web_Weaver wrote: Is it just me that would seek to play a stealth RPG?
No. I know tons of people who hate talking about or playing RPGs in public. A friend once told me that one of his favorite aspects of the Buffy game was that you spoke in terms of seasons, scenes, and episodes. He felt that it freed him up to be able to talk about it in public. I also recently heard someone say that they loved the paperback format of games like Burning Wheel and Prime Time Adventures because they could read them in public.
Web_Weaver wrote: Is it even a good idea to try and disguise an RPG as a traditional card game?
I don't really get the impression that that's what you're doing, here. I think it's a synthesis of the two. And yeah... I think the game itself is a good idea.