So I'm finally holding a copy of the Solar System in my hand, and I just registered to give some general praise about it. Very fine work, sir!

My group has been experimenting with variants of Tsoy since last autumn and we're getting more and more fond of the engine all the time. The way you have written the new version of the rules is entirely in my taste, and i find the tips and general advice on how to play the game extremely useful.

So, kudos many times over.

However, I have a question/request/desperate plea for you as well. Please, would it be at all possible to make a sturdier "deluxe" edition as well as the ultra-cheap booklet edition? I totally agree with making it ultra-cheap to make it natural for everyone in the group to get a copy, but me, I'd gladly pay up for a copy with better paper and some sort of proper cover. Perhaps some sort of Lulu-solution would be possible?

Thanks again for your work! Looking forward to the new Near-text as well.
Yours,
Simon

That's not impossible, I guess. But tell you what - the pretty thing about the Creative Commons license is that anybody can take Solar System and make a prettier version. It could be you, if you have a vision.

Still, I guess I could also see myself being the one to do it at some suitable juncture if there is desire for such. What do you see as the benefits to a prettier book? Would you show it around to people, or would it be more pleasant to use? Would the contents be organized differently? Would there be more or less stuff in it?

At first glance, a deluxe edition is something I'd probably want to make as a "2009 edition" or some such, after letting the current version settle for a bit. Who knows, the system might develop in actual play and take some new direction.

Yeah, I was thinking about doing it myself if you weren't going to.

What I would do with that book? Mainly one thing: be able to carry it with me, shoving it into bags and generally be able to throw it around without it coming to pieces waaay to quickly. :)

So, a "2009 Edition" that is prettier and generally more luxurious is certainly a nice idea. But what I, for my part, whant as fast as possible is a sturdier edition.

Since I like the inside the way it is, if I would be the one to conjure up a Heavy Edition I would probably beg you your version as a pdf to upload to Lulu together with some simple cover. If anyone more than me would be interested it would even be possible to make one Heavy and one Medium version, one with hardcover and one paperback. (Though I understand that at 86 pages, calling it "Heavy" is a bit of a hyperbole! .D )

Ah, I guess Lulu isn't an impossibility. I understand that there are no set-up expenses per se, so it's really no skin off my nose. So let me look into this when I get back north to my workstation - we'll need to figure out some suitably nice looking cover art, but other than that just putting a sturdier cover to this and allowing people to order that from Lulu seems like a no-brainer.

I should note, though, that the cheap booklet provides an excellent opportunity for some handicrafts if you want a cheap & sturdy edition with a stylish cover - just get imaginative with your own cover stock: make a cover out of cardboard, wooden panels, dead cats or whatever happens to be at hand. I'd probably print out the map of Near or something like that and stick it on a cardboard cover, which I'd then stitch on. Then color that with crayons for that childish look. Yeah, that's the ticket.

I'm probably going to make an improvised cover for the booklet in any case, using plastic film in some way, but a bound book from Lulu would be so much sexier.

What I'd like to do most of all is to make a nice, clean minimalistic cover in black and white, using the logo you've got, and just get it finished as fast as possible. I think there's something intrinsically problematic about cover art for generic rules books. I'd also like to see how readable the text gets if I'd shrink the size to 6" x 9". It wouldn't be smaller than many textbooks on my shelves, i think...

Do you know what happens with the ISBN if you reprint a publication with only a different cover?

The ISBN thing is far from objective - if the publication changes enough to make it a different "edition", then the ISBN changes as well. I'd say that this case would qualify; an useful guideline is to think of whether you'd care about the changes if you were buying the game just on the basis of the ISBN. Obviously you would, if the other version had a different binding and separate covers.

Right, thanks for that about the ISBN.

So, what do you think of the whole idea about just getting Lulu to do it's thing with you booklet? Would you be cool with me at least ordering a couple of different test versions to see how they feel? The thing is that I'd like to simply use what you've already done with layout and everything, since I have no inclination to redo those parts. So the question is, would you like to send me your version as a pdf? I'd need you to ask Jari and Pyry as well, since it's only the text that is released under CC, as far as your page one says...

That's pretty much right - insofar as the text goes, feel free to put up your version; I can send you the stuff in some sort of electronic format (QuarkXPress tag file, likely) for the purpose. Or I can send you the pdf, but you'd need to get permissions from Jari, Pyry and the guys who wrote the vignettes - or you could just cut the vignette pages, in which case just asking Jari would be sufficient. (Not a bad idea to cut the vignettes, if you already know the game and such - they mostly serve as examples and flavour.)

I don't have an electronic version of the game at hand here in Helsinki, though, so I can't get anywhere with this before I return up north at some point next week. And when I do get there, I can try my hand with the Lulu thing myself as well, I think. Unless you already have some particular inspiration with the cover and want to do it?

If you would like to do it yourself, I'd be more than happy to just be the buyer. .D

But I'd also be happy to take care of it. I've been looking forward to putting something together myself but haven't finished anything worth printing yet. I'll put together a cover I like and present it to you, see what you think about it. If I'm going to do the thing I'd probably ask you for the participants' mail adresses so I can ask their permission to include the vignettes as well. I really like them as a complement to the rules text.

I will have cover art for Solar System … some day.

Bringing these old questions up again...

Eero, you've said earlier you're anxious to see the rules wikified. I now have a wiki for the purpose. Like me to put it there? If so, think you could send me some kind of electronic document so I wouldn't have to type it in word for word? Or would you rather have the first electronic version appear somewhere else?

I'll get you an electronic version at some point. I'm supposed to be putting out a pdf version, which I'm going to do whenever I get it together. This month, I imagine. I'll send you that when it becomes current.

Great.

Hello Eero...

It's funny that I had similar idea of separating Solar system from Near setting back in september 2007. Actually I released slovak version of Solar system almost 3 months ago. But it is not a complete rewrite, mostly translation with added clarifications.

If you're curious, you can find it here: http://warheart.rpg.sk/solar/solar.htm (click on Stiahnite si Solar systém v slovenčine)

I am looking forward to pdf/wiki version. I will most probably incorporate your useful additions into my slovak version.

Please do. I'm not much for reading Slovak, but it's nice to see that the game is finding fans all over Europe.

Hi Corvus69,
I'd be interested in hearing what you thought needed clarification and how you did it. I don't speak sovak, so I cannot check myself.

Regards,
    Harald

Basically what I did was that I read through TSOY forum and randomwiki and wrote down everything people were confused about and added clarifications to the translated text. for example I added Eero's excellent actions table.

Plus I corrected and expanded faulty BDTP example. I was even thinking about writing completely new example...