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Topic: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H
Started by: johnthedm7000
Started on: 8/1/2010
Board: First Thoughts


On 8/1/2010 at 1:27am, johnthedm7000 wrote:
My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

I'm currently in the process of developing rules for a pen and paper fantasy RPG that I haven't come up with a name for yet (please, anyone feel free to suggest one). I'm going to need a lot of help and feedback on this, not the least because I have a horrible habit of starting projects up and then not finishing them because something else catches my attention. But I'm dedicated to this, and if anyone has any ideas, questions or comments please give them to me, no matter how harsh. Below is a general outline, formulated as my answers to 19 questions that I found on a tremendously helpful RPG design website. Also, if anyone who comments on my post needs any assistance whatsoever with developing their own game or ideas, please don't hesitate to ask.

1. What is your game about?
Heroes and Villains (the main characters) known as the Willful who attempt to shape a cooperatively created fantasy world that has long since been warped and twisted to their liking. The Willful all have some sort of grand purpose or destiny, and with effort and practice can warp the skein of reality itself, but the twisted world opposes them in a myriad of ways most notably through their Flaws.

2. What do the characters do? Attempt to survive and thrive in a dangerous world while working towards their Purpose, which is a singular goal or destiny for the individual character and which always results in some sort of substantial change to the world or a section of it.

3. What do the players and the GM do?
The players navigate the hazards and challenges of the world that they have cooperatively created with the GM and which the game master has twisted or corrupted during the first stage of play, while working to achieve their character's purpose.

4. How does your setting (or lack thereof) reinforce what your game is about? Since the players and the GM cooperate to create the world and setting they can focus on individual player and character motivations. The final stage of world creation (wherein the GM twists the design decisions the characters have made) also provides an impetus for the players to work to change the world so that it more closely aligns with their original visions.

5. How does character creation reinforce what your game is about? Character creation is point based and flexible to allow for a wide variety of characters and accommodate a wide variety of fantasy settings. Character creation also encourages characters with who are focused on a certain goal and who have strong and complex personalities through the use of the Purpose, Virtue, and Flaw mechanics.

6. What types of behaviors/styles of play does your game reward (or punish)? My game rewards thoughtful actions, especially those that work towards an individual character's overarching goals and those that align with the individual character's personality. It discourages rash action and "screwing around" (i.e doing random crap for no reason).

7. How are these rewards and punishment manifested? Characters who act according to their Flaw and Virtue are rewarded with Will points, which are used to improve die rolls. Characters who accomplish goals that bring them closer to accomplishing their Purpose, or which exemplify their Flaw or Virtue are granted Improvement Points, which are used for character advancement. Moving closer to accomplishing a character's Purpose also grants the character Destiny points, which are used to change narrative elements in scenes, and to alter the nature of the world around the character (sometimes permanently). Characters who simply defeat challenges that do not bring them closer to their Purpose, and that do not exemplify their Flaw or Virtue gain a much smaller reward, and obviously risk the negative consequences of failure, meaning that it's best to focus on actions important to your character rather than "screwing around".

8. How are narration and credibility handled? Narration of player actions after the GM has described the mechanical effects are up to the Player in question.

Example:
GM: You fail the Athletics check by 3 stages. You fall 40 feet and take 4 lethal damage, and the "broken bone" injury.
Player: Augustus slips upon a moss-covered stone right near the top of the wall of wailing sorrow and lets out a baleful curse as he tumbles to the hard earth and hears a cracking noise explode from his right shin.

Narration of NPC actions and background events is determined by the GM, but may be altered by the expenditure of Destiny points. Credibility is determined by die rolls and by GM arbitration (the player in the example above could not of narrated a situation in which Augustus did not fall, because such a narration would contradict the results of his die roll, although a Destiny point expenditure would have enabled him to rewrite the scene).

9. What does your game do to hold players attention and engagement? What makes them care? Players have a stake in the world through it's creation, and a desire to push it closer to how they envisioned it because of the GM's twisting of their design decisions in the first stage of play. They gain rewards for doing so, and have the opportunity to declare what manner of stories they find interesting through the designation of their character's Purpose, Virtue, and Flaw. Players also have the ability to further alter the world and story through the expenditure of Destiny points.

10. What are the resolution mechanics of your game? 2d10+Modifiers compared to a Target Number, which is either a static number or an opposed roll. For every 2 points by which the roll exceeds the Target Number a stage of success is declared and the primary effect is increased by 1 (such as damage for a weapon attack or the speed with which a character can run), and for every 1 point over the Target Number, a mark is declared which influences the secondary characteristics of the result (such as duration for spells). Some rolls (including many uses of Skills) have a chance for stages of failure, which are calculated in the opposite way (so for every 2 points lower than the TN you have one stage of failure, and for every 1 point lower, you have a mark of failure).

11. How does this manner of resolution reinforce what your game is about? Using 2d10 means that results tend towards the center of the numerical distribution, rewarding sound decisions, preparation, and working towards a character's purpose over luck, while still making it possible (if unlikely) for a less powerful character to triumph over a more experienced one.

12. Do characters in your game advance? If so how? Characters receive Improvement Points for accomplishing goals and overcoming challenges. Characters spend Improvement Points to improve the traits that were used in accomplishing a given goal or overcoming a given challenge. Characters gain Destiny points when they make progress towards or act according to their Purpose. These points are used to manipulate the Narrative structure and to change the world and setting.

13. How does the method you chose for character advancement reinforce what your game is about? Character advancement in my game is based primarily on the accomplishment of goals relating to a character's Flaw, Virtue, and Purpose. A character will advance slowly if they attempt to simply "farm" IP. This encourages driven characters that seek to change the world for good or ill. Restricting IP spending to traits that were used in the accomplishment of the goal that they were gained through also discourages min/maxing and irrational ability picks as well as helping to distinguishing characters from one another.

14. What sort of effect do you want your game to produce in or for your players?
I want players above all else to be invested in both their characters and in the world that they've created. When something changes with either I want them to really feel it.

15. What areas of your game receive extra attention or color? Why?
World creation, as it creates investment in the world for all involved, Mechanics dealing with personality and motivation, to ensure that players act to change the world and act in accordance with their vision of their character, and conflict resolution (both social and physical) to ensure a high degree of detail and grittiness.

16. What part of your game are you most excited about? Why?
I'm most excited about the shared world creation minigame, the Purpose and Destiny mechanics, and the combat and spell casting systems. The first two because they encourage player interest and investment in the game and the last two because I feel I've hit upon a system that's simple and intuitive while still allowing for a large amount of detail and variety.

17. Where does your game take players that other games can't, don't, or won't?
My game offers a way for players to definitively state the sort of game and character they want to play, provides mechanical impetus for that sort of declaration, and then challenges them to bring the game and the game world closer to their vision.

18. What are the publishing goals for this game? Unknown

19. Who is your target audience?
Gamers who enjoy fantasy roleplaying games who enjoy having a stake in the world they play in, who embrace strong and detailed characterization, and who enjoy a mix of simulationist, narrativist, and gamist play.

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On 8/1/2010 at 4:36am, dugfromthearth wrote:
Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

sounds interesting.

I'm a bit confused about #1.  It sounds there like an Amber style grand adventure with the world twisting and all.  But the mechanics sound more typical of heroic fantasy.

What powerlevel are the characters?  Are they trying to end slavery and save their people?  Or close the portal to hell?  Or restore light to the world and reduce gravity to half its level?

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On 8/1/2010 at 8:36am, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

Well basically I'm trying for a mix of world-twisting shenanigans and more typical fantasy fare (although the mechanics are more suited for a gritty game than for a D&Desque one). I'm thinking that I also want this game to allow for all sorts of character types as far as morality goes, from straightforward "good guys who want to restore the world to it's former perfection" to "scumbags who want to reshape the world to suit them" and everything in between. Perhaps one of the moral issues that I'll bring up in the game is the discussion of how being a Willful one interacts with free will, and whether it is moral (for example) to edit someones behavior, land, etc just because it brings you closer to your vision of how things should be.

Player characters would start out as roughly equivalent to skilled soldiers, competent spellcasters etc, and could advance from there to levels of power undreamed of by common people. I think it should be one characteristic of the Willful that while they start as normal mortals they're able to go far beyond that as they attempt to fulfill their Purpose. As for the character's goals, those would be decided by the character's Purpose and shaped by his or her Virtues and Flaws. Say that during the creation stage, player 1 created an island nation filled with peaceful arboreal creatures skilled in magic and lore, who guarded a mystic tree that served as a living god. By the end of the creation stage, the island nation has been twisted by the GM and other players into a tyrannical police state, where the Arboreal creatures live in fear of a tree-god that acts as "big brother" and it's council of sycophant magi. The player might then create a character whose purpose is to liberate the island nation and either revert the tree-god to it's natural state or destroy (and perhaps replace) it. The goals of players, and of the group are determined individually and cooperatively, based primarily on the events that took place during the creation stage (and which serve as the world's history).

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On 8/2/2010 at 9:05am, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

Also, just to clarify my previous post, I've included a more robust system than AMBER and similar "world altering" RPGs is because the choice to do things "the hard way" and the choice to warp the world to suit yourself (even if it's warping the world back to the way it was) is a moral and ethical issue that I want players and GMs to explore during play. Offering a mix of ways to achieve one's objective also means that my game will have more valid play styles than just "acquire destiny points, throw them at the problem". For example, a character with the purpose of making the nation of his homeland into an outlaw's paradise (with himself as the head honcho of a massive criminal syndicate) could work on building up destiny points and then eventually alter his nation into that outlaw's paradise.

Or he could work to bring down reputable authorities, put patsies in their places, make the average citizen fear to go outside at night without having paid protection money and then reinforce his work with destiny points to prevent it from being easily changed by rival willful. Such an endeavor is harder than just altering the nation through pure destiny point usage, but it's likely more durable and from a certain point of view is more defensible ethically (not that the up and coming bandit lord is likely to care). The point is that the two paths are equally viable ways of getting what a character wants, and have their upsides and downsides.

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On 8/6/2010 at 11:13pm, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

So I wanted to put out my rough draft for the world-creation mini game that will begin any Skein (I figure that because fate and destiny are so important to the game's concept that I'd include a somewhat pretentious and cool-sounding name for "series of interconnected sessions"). Please feel free to pick apart the mechanics, and suggest any improvements.

World Creation


World creation is a group exercise wherein Players and the Game Master take turns creating and altering the proto-world by expending Influence. The act of world creation is broken up into four stages, which determine the cost of various actions of world creation:
The Primordial Age
The Legendary Age
The Historical Age (Need a better name for this)
The Twisting

The first three stages are equally shared in by the players and the GM while the Twisting stage is the GMs alone, representing the desires of the world and the vagaries of fate that corrupt (or "Twist") the world's original Purpose. Note that this may not be a matter of moral evil or corruption. The twisting stage is more about the end of the world's original purpose and a corruption of that purpose. At the beginning of each stage each player receives 50 influence points and the GM 50 influence points as well. Fifty points are added to each player's pool and the GM's pool after the start of the first three stages. Unused points carry over from stage to stage. During the twisting, only the GM gets 50 additional points. Each stage other than the twisting, players and the GM take turns creating, altering, elaborating upon, and destroying features of the world by spending influence points. During each round, a player or the GM can take one of the following actions:

Create: Creates a feature whether that feature be a continent, a landmark, a physical law, a metaphysical law, species, organization, or civilization. When a player or GM creates a feature, they describe the general details of that feature as well as how (in the game world) that feature came to be created.

Elaborate: Adds on to the description and details given to a feature, whether one created by the one doing the elaboration or another player or the Game Master's. Elaboration can only be used to add details, not subtract them and cannot add details which contradict details described earlier.

Alter: Changes a detail of a given feature without changing the basic identity of that feature. For example, if a player creates the metaphysical law "Magic requires sacrifice" then another player (or the GM) might use the Alter action to change that to "Magic requires sacrifice of life force".

Destroy: Destroys a feature. The player or GM is required to describe how in the game world the feature was destroyed (judgment by the gods, natural disaster, famine etc.)

Reinforce: Uses Influence points to increase the cost of the Alter or Destroy actions targeted against a given feature by the number of points invested.

Wait: Choosing not to spend Influence points in a given round. A player or Game Master may only Wait two times in a row before they must spend points in some fashion or Cede the stage.

Cede: Choosing to end point spending for that stage.

A record should be kept of the process of world creation, and used to create a history of the world. Details on specific features that are left vague are left up to the individual with the most points invested in that given feature (including points spent to alter, and elaborate, and points spend to reinforce but not points spent because of other people's reinforcements).

Point costs for various actions in the 4 stages of world creation are to come, as I'm tired and my girlfriend and I need to go to bed. Please give me any suggestions, questions, and comments that you might have.

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On 8/8/2010 at 8:42am, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H


Point Costs For Various World Creation Actions
Stage
Action Primordial Legendary Historical
Create Continent 7 14 21
Elaborate upon Continent 2 1 4
Alter Continent 3 2 9
Destroy Continent 10 20 30
-----------------------
Create Law of Nature 10 20 30
Elaborate upon Law of Nature 5 10 15
Alter Law of Nature 8 7 12
Destroy Law of Nature 12 24 36
------------------------
Create Species 6 4 8
Elaborate upon Species 4 6 2
Alter Species 5 5 3
Destroy Species 12 6 8
-------------------------
Create Organization/Civilization 6 4 2
Elaborate upon Organization/Civilization 3 2 1
Alter Organization/Civilization 4 3 2
Destroy Organization/Civilization 4 2 3

Note: During the Twisting, the GM has access only to Alter and Elaborate, and uses the cheapest costs listed for those actions.

A description of features:

Continent: A landmass, whether naturally appearing or created by the hands of gods or mortals. The details (terrain, climate etc.) are up to the creator, as altered by other players and the GM.

Law of Nature: A physical or metaphysical law that governs the reality of that world.

Species: A life form, whether magical or mundane, singular or legion.

Organization or Civilization: A community, fraternity, cult etc. of creatures created using the species feature and the create species action.

Please give me your feedback on both the process of world creation and on the costs-it'd be most appreciated!
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On 8/8/2010 at 4:44pm, Paul Czege wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

The idea of taking player created setting details and twisting them seems like a good recipe for player engagement. And if you manage to achieve focused purposeful reworlding from the players, as opposed to crazy Amber-esque freeform play ("I just want to win this conflict, I don't care how stupid my explosive kitten henchmen are."), it'll be great.

Heck, consider this a title suggestion: The Reworlders

Paul

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On 8/8/2010 at 7:31pm, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

Yeah one thing I was worrying about when I created the world creation system is how to prevent that sort of "I want to WIN!" mentality that might interfere with building a semi-coherent world. I definitely like "The Reworlders" as a title-thank you so much for your help Paul.

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On 8/28/2010 at 1:49pm, Spooky Fanboy wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

What other help are you looking for? My apologies, I just discovered this and I am intrigued by the concept.

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On 8/31/2010 at 7:52pm, johnthedm7000 wrote:
RE: Re: My outline for a fantasy RPG, please P.E.A.C.H

Well I'd love some feedback on the costs and set up for the world-creation minigame. It's going to be an important part of the play experience, and as such I want to make sure that it's enjoyable and functional. Secondly, I've developed the premise a bit more working on exactly what the characters are. Here it goes:

The Willful
You hear about them all the time in the real world. People who cut a swath through destiny, who for good or ill reshaped the world in their image. Larger than life, compelling, and in the end more legend than mortal man or woman. Some fizzle out and die young, some linger on in old age but all had a certain spark, whether saint or demagogue, warlord or religious figure. These are the sort of people that the players assume control of, the Willful who are born with (or who obtain) a great destiny (called a purpose) and who have the ability to reshape the world with their will alone. They come from all races of the world that the player has created, and seek to change it on a fundamental level.

(Important story-based statistics) While the Willful possess normal attributes such as Strength, Dexterity, Agility, Presence, Intellect, Willpower and Stamina they also possess attributes that normal creatures do not, or that are not as significant to them. They are:

Defining Virtue and Flaw: Describes what is best about the Willful personality wise and what is worst. These are determined by the player and can be any conceivable flaw or virtue. Indulging in these and suffering a set-back as a result is the way that the Willful regains Willpower, which enhances die rolls.

Drives or Goals: Each Willful has 3 main goals, things about the world that he or she wants to change. They might be as simple as proving oneself to their parents, or as grand as conquering a nation or annihilating all magic. Accomplishing Goals gives the Willful Legendry, and working towards them grants a Willful Destiny points.

Destiny Points: A pool of points the willful spend to reshape the world.

Destiny Rank: A measure of how effective the Willful is at reshaping the world using destiny points. Increased by fighting against or going with one's destiny.

Destiny: A grand destiny for the Willful in question. Working towards it or fighting against it increases Destiny rank. High destiny rank willful are nudged towards their destinies by other players and the GM taking the role of fate.

Legendry: A measure of the power of different legends about the Willful. Measured as a number, it serves as a pool of +1 bonuses that the willful can draw on for actions relating to the legend. So a willful with "Slayer of the Demon Wyrm" 5 would have a pool of 5 +1 bonuses to apply to anything that could relate to that legend, such as slaying dragons, or opposing demonic forces. Increased by accomplishing goals and by spreading word of the character's exploits.

So what do you think?

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