Topic: Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
Started by: Thirsty Viking
Started on: 9/13/2002
Board: The Riddle of Steel
On 9/13/2002 at 7:08pm, Thirsty Viking wrote:
Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
From a discussion outside the forge.
Originally posted by Scotty
Welcome Viking! Everyones input is welcome.
I think somewhere along the line we got confused. No you can only bond one animal at a time. That bond would exist until one of them dies, or one of the parties breaks off the bond. A tramatic experience either way. Generally the bond is mutual and for life. A weir with little or no morals could attempt to force a bond with animal of weak will.
The idea of having a group of animals to bond with was if one of your bond-mates died. Say that your a young Weir of 19 and bond with a Great Dane. I love Great Dane's, best dogs in the world. But unfortunately they have a rather short life span. But say this Dane live 11 years, a good life for a Dane. Our Weir is now 30, and hopefully has many years of life still left in him. So he goes on a quest to find a new familiar. In his travels he encounters a Wolf who is open to adopting the Weir as his pack. So our Weir doesn't have to bond another Great Dane after his first bond-mate passes on, he could bond any animal if the canine family. Of course we haven't decided to go in this direction yet. We may just for simplicities sake decide that after his Dane dies, our Weir could bond a crow or squirrel next if he desires.
I also picture the animals that are getting bonded as special, as the Weir is special. The bonded Great Dane would be smarter than the average Great Dane. And able to think in abstract concepts, and give ideas. Although he is going to come at situations and ideas from a different perspective, and have different motivations. But the animal has a personality and his own choice in matters. I view the familiar as more of an NPC, than a simple animal companion. Unless the bond is dominated by the Weir, which is a vile ugly thing. Other Weirs who discovered such a relationship, would do their best to "rectify" the situation.
It is important to remember that the bond animal is a living creature, not a tool. Anything that happens to the animal is felt by the weir also, unless they conciously try to mask the pain from thier bond mate. As a rule, any shock experience by the animal would affect the weir, reducing his die pools accordingly. Always. This would happen too fast to mask. Any pain experienced by the animal would also apply to the weir unless deliberatly masked. This can be done at any time. Also being a weir is probally looked down upon in most societys. Peasants would just look upon it as another type of sorcery, and try to lynch him. So it might be something that they would try to keep secret.
On 9/13/2002 at 7:09pm, Thirsty Viking wrote:
RE: Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
Originally posted by Scotty
The idea of having a group of animals to bond with was if one of your bond-mates died. .... So he goes on a quest to find a new familiar. In his travels he encounters a Wolf who is open to adopting the Weir as his pack. ... he could bond any animal if the canine family. .... [OR] our Weir could bond a crow or squirrel next if he desires.
Ok this is just flovoring then... While not addressed in the rules I think it reasonable that the Weire be allowed to find another one later... Perhaps the severing of the link by watever means causes the sorcerer to roll all the dice in his SP pool ... He loses the dice he rolls ones on and they return 1 a month afterward. Or on a different note, he is unable to use his Discipline State for casting spells of 3 or ritual magic for a periode of time due to the mental turmoil. This obviously has less effect on the non mage... but non mages benift less from the gift anyway. Reguardless during that periode of time the familiar can't be replaced I think.
Originally posted by Scotty
... But the animal has a personality and his own choice in matters. I view the familiar as more of an NPC, than a simple animal companion. Unless the bond is dominated by the Weir,
A very good idea.. the exposure so intimately to the Weires' mind should enhance the mind of the familiar... of course it retains it's unique animal perspective in most things. By dominating the bond... iassume you mean using the familiars' body as the vessel for the weires' mind ... Interesting... yes some cultures would view this as possession and evil... if they could tell... Curious side thought... while in their familiar... if the sorcerer body is killed... He may now be an animal PC untill he recovers mental balance and can find a village simpleton to bond... A new Quest... I like it. Also he may not be able to use his sorcery in animal form. Might have to rule this a major form though and charge the charachter another 10 SA's to upgrade it at the time of the charachters death. not enough SA's in his charachter..it doesn't work.
Originally posted by Scotty
It is important to remember that the bond animal is a living creature, not a tool. Anything that happens to the animal is felt by the weir also, unless they conciously try to mask the pain from thier bond mate. As a rule, any shock experience by the animal would affect the weir, reducing his die pools accordingly.
I think this is a little too strong.. Perhaps shock/2 or shock/3 would be transmitted to the mage. An alternative would be shock-WP (the mage can ignore his will power worth of shock transmitted through the bond) this has greator effect at low levels and extreme shock blows through and stuns the mage greator. I'll go with the shock-WP in my game. Same holds for the animals Pain level. Animal ignores his WP in pain, then the mage ignores his willpower in pain that the animal can't ignore. How do you think this sounds? Coupled with Penalties on the death of the animal... these would discourage familars being tossed whimsicly into battle.
On 9/13/2002 at 7:15pm, Thirsty Viking wrote:
RE: Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
I dropped ported these two posts here because I think they offer a nice expanded approach to weires and are worthy of consideration by the group at large. Expanded coverage of what all that is involved with weires might or might not be in the SatF, but IMO these are good background thoughts for any to consider in the charchters/campaigns.
On 9/13/2002 at 8:44pm, Thirsty Viking wrote:
RE: Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
I will bring some more posts over tomarrow, the thread has been fairly active in the other forum among 3 of us, but i'd like to hear the thoughts of a more diverse group of RoS players.
On 9/14/2002 at 8:03pm, Vanguard wrote:
RE: Thoughts on Weires and Familiars
I like all the ideas above, as well as the concept of having a familiar.
Regarding renewing a bond with a new animal, should the other had died or you haven't started with the gift, it could all be dealt with by sorcery.
Level 3 conquer to implant a part of your spirit into the animal. Level 3 vison in order to perceive your familiar's thoughts and perceptions. Level 3 imprisonment to bind the whole process. Level could be reduced to generate a less than ideal bonding.
Either way, there is cost and risk involved. This thus justifies having familiar still remain as a minor gift despite having a spell that can replicate the effects. And through this spell can far more animals be eventually bonded - a white wizard maintains a coterie of squirrels, rats, wolves, eagles and bears giving him a wide range of potential. The evil wizard, however, (a la Saruman) could invest his powers into owning a flock of crows for the sake of spying purposes...
Any feedback welcome.