Topic: First attempt at producing an RPG
Started by: Ardwen
Started on: 1/24/2003
Board: Publishing
On 1/24/2003 at 2:03am, Ardwen wrote:
First attempt at producing an RPG
I'm not sure if this is where a post like this should appear but, here goes.
I have recently had the opportunity to have a RPG printed and perhaps distributed.
After researching some more it appears I'm better off finding a publisher to do all the work for me because the expenses and work involved in publishing a book is vast.
My question to the forum is this.
Is it worth it?
I'm not entertaining any thoughts of making a profit or getting noticed in the larger market. I simply want the satisfaction of having a book produced in a professional manner.
The printer is really positive and has contacts for promotion as well as offering to colour any pics etc. Printing however, is only one part of the greater whole.
I'm sitting on the fence right now. Not sure where to go from here.
On 1/24/2003 at 4:53am, Valamir wrote:
RE: First attempt at producing an RPG
The problems are not nearly as vast you might think. You have a TON of alternatives that I'd highly advise checking out before committing to anything. Three off the top of my head.
1) A POD service like RPGnow that minimizes the capital investment you have to make up fron while still producing a printed product and most importantly maintaining 100% ownership of your work.
2) Consider starting with PDF distribution. Sell it for cheap for a year or two, support the game with a website and forum and you'll wind up with alot of buzz, and feedback. You may find the game sucks which would be sad but at least save you from a bunch of needless expense. You may find ways to make the game better. You may get the best outcome of converting the built up success and buzz from the PDF into a successfull print copy in the future, like Sorcerer managed.
3) Print runs themselves are not all that difficult or expensive to do yourself. Wizard-attic has a ton of printer resources at their site including a service where you entire the parameters of your job and printers bid on it. Definitely shop it around, which doesn't take any more effort than responding to emails and a couple phone calls. Different printers price quotes can vary enormously for the same job. I did Universalis this way. Started with a small print run which only cost about $600, distributed it solely through the website recieving paypal payments and I broke even in 3 months, sold out in 4 and just shipped out the first batch of orders from the second print run. No publisher, no outside party taking a cut. Its certainly possible.
On 1/24/2003 at 5:09am, Jack Spencer Jr wrote:
RE: First attempt at producing an RPG
You may have already, but in case you haven't, you might want to check out the Articles section and read the various articles there, including the two Fantasy Heartbreaker articles, War Story, Nuked Apple Cart.
Forge Reference Links:
On 1/25/2003 at 7:19am, Sidhain wrote:
RE: First attempt at producing an RPG
Hey Ard!
Good to see ya.
Truth be told, I'm not there yet either, I'm moving towards it, but frankly publishers fail. I've had not one, not two, but three (including one big one) wig out on publications I wrote for them. One simply vanished (I still respect the person who asked me to write for them.), One simply got shuffled around and bought and rebought, and something (they sorta exist and are big, but will my work see the light of day? or will I eever get paid my something like 5.00 for it *L*), the last one I contracted with, wrote stuff for them /at their request/ and stuff I wanted of mine out, then the person behind it realized he'd simply taken on too much and couldn't do it. I was dissapointed, so my experience with publishers is batting .000 for them.
This is why my superhero game, and my frpg are going the me publishing route, I didn't really want to, but I think I can manage it, and since my aim is to put out my ideas and hope people like them, use them, or at least occasionally pay to read them, I'm ok with that.
The truth is no matter which route you take it will be hard work.
Is it worth it? Yes, just for the few happy snippets of praise from people who've read Hearts and Souls, for that is enough. I want it finished and out now, but we can't have everything.
On 1/25/2003 at 5:25pm, rafael wrote:
Re: First attempt at producing an RPG
Ardwen wrote: I'm not sure if this is where a post like this should appear but, here goes.
I have recently had the opportunity to have a RPG printed and perhaps distributed.
After researching some more it appears I'm better off finding a publisher to do all the work for me because the expenses and work involved in publishing a book is vast.
My question to the forum is this.
Is it worth it?
Oh, yeah. It's worth it. Lots of fun, great learning experience, you meet the nicest damn people. And it's a rush. You can point to your book and say, I did that! It's so worth it. Assuming, of course, that you take it seriously and do your best. Goes without saying, but I say things that go without saying.
Ardwen wrote: I'm not entertaining any thoughts of making a profit or getting noticed in the larger market. I simply want the satisfaction of having a book produced in a professional manner.
The printer is really positive and has contacts for promotion as well as offering to colour any pics etc. Printing however, is only one part of the greater whole.
I'm sitting on the fence right now. Not sure where to go from here.
I'd say, look around. There's probably a lot of printers you could work with. I spoke with (and obtained quotes from) a few dozen printers before I settled on the one I'm using.
I went with a color cover, black-and-white interior. Color interior art is quite expensive.
Now, of course, you have to ask yourself what kind of distribution model you want, and what kind of print run you're talking about, and what type of advertising you're going to be doing.
Personally, I printed a 180-page book, started with a print run of 50, sold 'em, and printed 50 more. I sell them on a site, and a couple local stores. It's totally cool, and I've made enough to pay my artists and justify the project. You want to print more than a couple hundred, it gets really tricky.
I'd say, if you're going to spend a few hundred bucks to do it, consider it money spent. Like buying an X-Box. If you're spending a lot more, think of it as a business investment, and take it very very carefully. Read everything on this forum six or seven times, and ask everyone you know to tell you what they think. Don't believe everything you hear, but listen carefully and consider it objectively.
I say, on the small scale, yes, it can be done, it can be a blast, you can make a few bucks and maybe get a few artists a little indie-scene recognition (if you use art in your book), and it can be a thrilling experience. On a big scale, I don't know personally, but I've seen others pull it off really well. Sorcerer, for instance.
Also, playtest the bastard a lot. With people who don't know much about RPGs, if at all possible. That worked like a charm for me, because people without preconceived notions can offer some startling feedback.
Above all, good luck, and vaya con dios. I got more useless answers if you got more questions.
Word is bond,
Rafael
On 1/25/2003 at 8:17pm, Pramas wrote:
RE: Re: First attempt at producing an RPG
There's one fundamental question you need to answer for yourself before you start: is this going to be a business or a hobby? How you answer is going to inform your next move.
If you are serious about starting a company and running a business, then start planning now to go the GAMA Trade Show in Las Vegas this March. Doesn't matter if you have anything to show yet, GTS is the only trade show in the biz and it's somewhere you can meet distributors, retailers, and other manufacturers. This is a small industry and people are generally pretty free with advice and tips. There are some classic mistakes that new companies make that it's pretty easy to avoid if you talk to a few people first.
If this is going to be a hobby for you, then you can worry less about business and more about personal satisfaction. From your message, this seems to be where you are coming from, but you may find it difficult to produce your book to a professional standard. If you are going to go the Print on Demand or PDF route, it'll be challenging to recoup the costs of good art and design (unless you have talented friends; always a plus).
Is it worth it? Well, it certainly can be. I've been doing game design professionally for a decade now and it's still exciting to crack open a box fresh from the printer and see my new book for the first time. While there are days I wonder why I bother, the good outweighs the bad and I can't think of anything else I'd rather do for a living.