Greetings All,

I hope this isn't out of place.

In another thread Andy Kitkowski observed that "At the Forge, you have the ernest newbies, meaning here folks that really want to design a game (whether they've really thought it all out or not) but haven't completed or published yet. They too listen to the regulars, the folks who have published, and look for feedback for their own games."

And a little further on wrote: "What is the threshold for "proving themselves"? Well, publishing is a given. But people need not go that far: Resources, writings, a Clear Idea of the game and where it's going, a committed release schedule ("Here's my idea, I'm looking to publish in 2 months"), solid proof that the project is in motion (well past the "initial spark" stage), or maybe it could be an idea that's just too good not to comment on (perhaps an idea that the designer entertained themselves). In the cases with the newbies who show some of the above "proof of commitment", they clearly get more feedback from other deisgners. Maybe they even have to PM some designers at first to draw attention to their project (I assume), but again, show the proof, you get the feedback."

All this talk of publishing and release schedules got me thinking, first about the games I have in the works, and secondly about just what is considered 'published' and how to go about seeing your work published. Now, with fiction, being published is usually seeing your work in print. Though most might not really consider themselves published unless they got a good healthy check for their work.

Of course with fiction you can also do a bit of online research and easily find places to submit your work, be it a magazine or book publisher. Heck there's even 'writer's resources' sections in most search engines web directories. But you know, where games are concerned, I don't think there is anything at all like this.

That realisation gave me pause. So, in typical youthful enthusiastic ignorance (Hey, you're only as old as you think you are!) I thought I'd bring the subject up here. Since this is the publishing forum and, hopefully, there are actually guys and gals out there who know the industry from both ends. Being publishers or having been published.

Basically what I am asking if for anything you think that would help designers toward their goal of seeing their game in print, as a PDF, or otherwise published. For example...

What sort of resources are available? How might they be found?

Is it necessary to have a full fledged game- either in MSS form or mocked up and ready to play- ready to submit or do you prefer to see simple synopsis outlining a potential game concept?

Or is self-published a better route? If so what does a would be start up game publisher need to know to jump start their business and actually get units produced?


Kind Regards,

Kester Pelagius

I'm really not sure what the question is, so I'll relate my little publishing experience.

Ralph wrote the game as a word doc. We got some art by contacting James V. West, who put us on to David Hedgecock. When we had the text and art all together, we sent it to Matt who did the layout, creading the PDF, including the cover. Then I did some research calling around and found a local printer (probably should have done more, but we did a tiny print run of only 100 copies). I sent them the documents, and they printed up books.

We picked them up, and took them to GenCon, and then afterwards Ralph set up the website with a Paypal button. We sold out in a couple of months. Ralph has since revised the text a bit (no content changed, just editing, really), and printed a much more substantial run from another printer.

I have to say that using the resources available here made the process extremely easy. Selling PDFs would be even easier. There are some small pitfalls, but after doing it once, I'd have no hesitations going through it all myself again.

Anyhow, there exist resources here in this forum and the contacts forum as well as just well-known individuals that can make the whole process about as painless as it can be. I can only recommend that people finish their projects and publish them.

Mike

First Publishing doesn't necessarily mean for pay. Putting up an html on a website is published.

http://www.wizards-attic.com/Publishers.html
This site currently hosted at the old Wizards-attic domain (who knows for how much longer) has a ton of good info.

www.printindustry.com
I used this service to request bids for the Uni project. Within a couple of days about 8 printers had responded with quotes.

Greetings Mike,

Mike Holmes wrote: I'm really not sure what the question is, so I'll relate my little publishing experience.

Greetings,

Valamir wrote: First Publishing doesn't necessarily mean for pay. Putting up an html on a website is published.

Well.

First: The old adage about growing to hate the project before you're done with it is true. After a while the honeymoon is over and you're just left with a marriage that you now have to make work. This I think is why most projects wither on the vine. Once the blush of the intial passion wears off, you realize that what you're left with is actually work. If you can't stomach the times when you'd rather be having a root canal than typing one more word about your project, you aren't ever going to finish it.

Second: If its going to be a for pay game...buy art when the game is about 1/2 finished. Buy a goodly amount of it. Pay a few hundred dollars for some decent artwork. Why...because when the project becomes work and you're thinking of chucking it...knowing you just wasted $400 on art is pretty good motivation to get you to suck it up and finish the thing so you can get your money back. When I was a broker, new brokers were advised to buy a car they couldn't afford and a new high end wardrobe complete with rolex...the debt motivated them to work that much harder. Crude but effective.

Third: Don't be afraid to set the project aside and come back to it. Not abandoned it forever on the pile of unfinished ideas...but getting some distance is a good thing

Fourth: Edits and reworking the text will only get you so far and leave you with ALOT of legacy stuff. The best way to go from rough draft to final copy is NOT to open up the draft file and start perfecting it. Instead start with a blank file and rewrite everything from word one. Pain in the ass? Yup. But assuming you actually played the game thoroughly while it was in its draft stage you should have a good enough handle for how the game actually plays to write it up from memory. If you can't you probably didn't play it enough. Someone I told this to replied "but how do you remember all the rules you wrote and worked on in order to get them into the game from memory correctly?" To which I replied "if the game designer can't remember his own rules after working on the game for months, than how do you expect the game players to remember the rules enough to play after reading the book just a couple of time".

That would be my quicky list of advice.

First, everything that Ralph is said is true. Especially motivation.

To that end, I find it useful to have a "nagging" partner. This is someone who is willing to make sure that I'm actually doing work on the game. I performed this service for Jason Blair for Little Fears, and he is currently returning the favor for me with Legends of Alyria. Spooky Fanboy lives up to his name by doing this as well. Get him interested, and he'll do it for free. ;-)

Seriously, the buzz of "I'm designing a game!" wears off quickly, and you need to be willing to pony up and finish what you started.

Seth Ben-Ezra
Great Wolf