Topic: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Started by: Jay Turner
Started on: 4/29/2003
Board: RPG Theory
On 4/29/2003 at 6:08pm, Jay Turner wrote:
Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
I'm working on a game that's a bit more freeform-Gamist (the way I understand the terms), and its skill-system is such that the players are free to create their own skills. Experienced gamers should be fine with that, but I want to be accessible for newbies, too, and people who just want to pick up a game and go at it. I have a couple of options I'm kicking around (and I'm going to "debut" the game in the Indie Game Design forum soon) to help ease players into the setting and the skill system, and I wanted to get your opinions on them.
1) Splats: By this I mean setting-based "Clans" that include a short list of skills that each Clan member has. For example, a member of the Strong clan might have "Wield huge weapon: 2" and "Hulk Menacingly: 2" for free, among other skills. They'd all have a history and a place in the world. The downside to this is that making splats commits me to inserting them into the setting, which is something I'm not sure I want to do. They seem to be setting-endorsed templates, but do they shoehorn concepts too much? Would the "freeform" skill system I have now become obsolete?
2) Templates: Make a few characters and essentially say, "Here's an example of a Strong character. Copy this down and spend the few extra skill points, and write your name at the top of your paper." This makes for easy character generation and doesn't railroad the setting, but this also might railroad character generation overmuch.
3) Kits: I like the Lego-like "kit" idea, in which you say, "My character is a Fighter and a Diplomat," and by choosing those kits, you get a handful of skills that help with those roles. The cool thing about that is that you get a feeling of "constructing" a character and you avoid the grainy feeling of sculpting one from scratch. Each one is like a mini-template, and you combine them to get a more customized character.
Do you think one of these ways is better than the others? What I'm trying to do is to have a freeform skill system, without making new players spend hours at the table going, "Hmmm" as they try to figure out which skills to get. How would you apply one of the above methods without making it seem like the be-all, end-all of chargen?
If it'd help to have my game to look at, I'll try and rush through getting it up online. I'm in the process of making sure the pre-alpha RTF is acceptably debut-ready. :)
On 4/29/2003 at 7:21pm, Mike Holmes wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
All this depends a lot on how you're going to expect the setting to be related to the players. If they'll have a good idea, I'd go with Kits. If they'll be getting the setting via chargen, then I suggest splats or templates.
Mike
On 4/29/2003 at 7:51pm, Jay Turner wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Mike Holmes wrote: All this depends a lot on how you're going to expect the setting to be related to the players. If they'll have a good idea, I'd go with Kits. If they'll be getting the setting via chargen, then I suggest splats or templates.
Mike
Good point. I'd like the players to have a decent beginning grip on the setting by the time they make their characters.
I like kits. I get the feeling that splats are being frowned upon these days. Does that seem so?
On 4/29/2003 at 8:57pm, Jeffrey Miller wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Jay Turner wrote: I like kits. I get the feeling that splats are being frowned upon these days. Does that seem so?
I tend to frown on them, mostly because I find them too limiting in terms of making a character - they are an attempt to provide stereo/archetypes for the setting, but they tend to stifle individual creativity, no matter the freedom allowed. I much prefer kits, if only because they tend to encapsulate the idea of related skill-sets. You did say you were aiming towards a skill-centric system, correct?
On 4/29/2003 at 9:07pm, Jay Turner wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Well, it's a system based around 5 Traits, with skills created with a pool of points based on the number in each Trait. For example, if you have a Smarts of 3, you have 9 points with which to create Smarts-based skills.
It's immensely flexible, especially thanks to the informal mood of the game (if you can talk your GM into saying "yes," then you can do it--and if not, you can spend an "Eff Point" to veto the GM), and I think that coming up with cool skills is half the point of my chargen system. After all, if you have two characters, one with "Shoot Guns: 2" and another with "Drill Bullets Into People's Heads: 2", which one would you prefer, in a game built for over-the-top, cartoony violence?
I want the templates/kits to provide a "quick-start" method for making characters, but I don't want to make the "create-your-own skills" idea to become obsolete.
Do I even really need a "quick-start" method? Do you think most gamers are capable of making their own skills in this way, right out of the box?
On 4/29/2003 at 9:13pm, Jeffrey Miller wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Jay Turner wrote: Do I even really need a "quick-start" method? Do you think most gamers are capable of making their own skills in this way, right out of the box?
I think that's completely a "YMMV" issue. Who is the target audience? Do you have a sense of who the game might appeal to? Generally I think that for Indie games, the audience is such that you neglect to have a "Roleplaying 101" section and not be harmed by it.
-j-
On 4/29/2003 at 9:58pm, John Kim wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Jay Turner wrote: I want the templates/kits to provide a "quick-start" method for making characters, but I don't want to make the "create-your-own skills" idea to become obsolete.
Personally, I would suggest templates for this. "Splats" are typically a required choice and don't actually speed up chargen per se (i.e. you still have to go through all the mechanical steps like attributes, skills, etc.). Templates are close pre-made sample characters, but specifically ones tailored to represent the genre.
Templates are almost always good, IMO -- they aren't a replacement for splats, since you can have both splats and templates. Templates provide actual quick-start if you want to try out the game, since you can literally pick them up and start playing. The reason for not including templates is if you don't want quick-start per se. For example, in HarnMaster there is something to be said that players should see the character creation process to get an idea of the world and assumptions.
On 5/1/2003 at 3:39am, Jay Turner wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Don't worry, I'm not really bumping the thread. :)
If anyone wants to see what I'm going for, I've debuted this game in Indie Gaming, in this thread, and the game is available as a PDF here.
The PDF has a couple of examples of the Clans and the complete character generation system in question. I'm just wondering if I should put in Kits or Templates to help speed chargen along.
Forge Reference Links:
Topic 6292
On 5/1/2003 at 3:55pm, Mike Holmes wrote:
RE: Character Generation: "Splats", Templates, or Kits
Looking at what you have, I'm going to agree with Jon. Templates. Players need to have a bunch of traits, and that's too much for newbies to come up with. What's also cool with templates is that it looks to me like you can just swap anything out for anything else? That's very easy for a newbie to grasp, and they can alter design as much as they're comfortable with.
Kit's would be more trouble than they're worth here, I think.
Mike