Topic: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Started by: Stephen
Started on: 2/17/2004
Board: The Riddle of Steel
On 2/17/2004 at 8:34pm, Stephen wrote:
A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
A suggested alternate magic system for worlds with a slightly different flavour – ones where magic can be more visible and more chaotic, though just as deadly and dangerous.
This magic system works on the assumption that the Gift which grants magical ability is the power to literally wrench the energies and substance of reality itself to your will. As such, the price of that power is paid not in personal loss of lifeforce and youth, but in a growing weakness and instability in the nature of reality itself which, while it makes magic easier, can also cause a dangerous backlash when too much magic is worked in too short a time. This requires the introduction of three new terms: Threshold, Strain, and Backlash.
Threshold
For this system, the Target variable is replaced with a Threshold variable. This represents the local “toughness” of reality, its durability and resistance to magic. Like other CTN variables, it ranges from 0 to 3. The lower the Threshold, the easier magic is, as follows:
0 – Faerie rings, druid stone circles, ancient sites of sacrifice, sorcerers’ lairs or towers.
1 – Remote wilderness, superstition-laden villages, deep caverns, graveyards.
2 – Medium-sized towns, settled farmlands, universities and schools, army camps.
3 – Great cities, busy market squares, well-attended churches, sophisticated palaces, armies in battle.
This is based on the principle that what “toughens” reality is the attitudes, beliefs and weight of human minds in the area. The more people, the more hardheaded they are, and the less open they are to the idea of magic, the harder it is to affect reality around them. This can reflect either the conflict and “static” of a great many colliding worldviews, the strength and focus of a single common belief system, or simply so much fear, panic and pain (as in, for example, the middle of a battle or a natural disaster) that the psychic currents of power are “fogged up”.
The Threshold of an area can also fluctuate. On old holy days or calendar turning points, the weight of ancient history makes reality weaker, and magic easier. Thresholds may drop by 1 on key days of import, or may drop by 1 for specific types of magic during specific astrological periods (T drops by 1 for summoning magics on Hallowe’en, drops by 1 for elemental or fertility magics on Beltaine, etc.) Magics opposed to the favoured magics of a location or time may gain +1 to Threshold. The minimum Threshold for a specific area is 0, the maximum is 3.
(Some people may be so strong in their self-confidence that they actually gain their native Threshold as bonus dice to magic resistance rolls -- Conan often defied the magic of the East because he and his people had never been culturally conditioned to fear or accept it. This option may be added by the Seneschal to make cultural context very important to sorcerers.)
Strain
Instead of aging, each month accumulated by an anti-aging roll represents a point of Strain inflicted on reality’s local fabric. (The “Mana” refreshing spells inflict 1, 2 or 3 points of Strain automatically, before the anti-Strain roll.) Reality can take only so much distortion, warping and wrenching before it snaps; ironically, the lower the Threshold and the more amenable to magic, the less room one has for error and clumsiness.
Strain capacities, by Threshold, are as follows:
Threshold 0: 10 Strain points, draining at 1/second.
Threshold 1: 20 Strain points, draining at 1/minute.
Threshold 2: 35 Strain points, draining at 1/hour.
Threshold 3: 50 Strain points, draining at 1/day.
Strain accumulates from a starting point of 0 with every spell cast in that area – two duelling sorcerers can rip reality apart much faster than a single cautious mage! Strain is also specific to a fairly small area, a dozen metres/yards wide or so – sorcerers fighting on the run can leave a “trail” of Strained reality behind them.
Reality “relaxes”, undoing Strain points, at the rate shown above for each Threshold level. Any sorcerer can sense the Threshold and current Strain (if any) of an area with a successful roll of ART vs. TN (4 + Threshold).
Backlashes
When an imperfect casting takes the local accumulated Strain over the maximum capacity for the area, a Backlash is incurred. The size and effect of the Backlash depends on how far over the Strain capacity one has gone, the strength of the local Threshold, and the nature of the spell being cast. Rather than make up a list of random effects, Seneschals should improvise the exact effects for each Backlash, within the following guidelines.
Overstrain by 1 – A minor effect, more distracting and spectacular than anything else.
Overstrain by 2-3 – A more significant effect, causing some temporary inconvenience or hindrance.
Overstrain by 4-6 – A dangerous effect, potentially causing injury to the sorcerer or to nearby innocent bystanders.
Overstrain by 7-10 – A cataclysmic effect, causing great environmental damage and potentially causing serious or even fatal harm to the sorcerer and others nearby.
Overstrain by 11+ – Nobody’s certain, but it’s rumoured this is how the Sea of Fallen Gods was created….
Backlashes in areas of Threshold 0 are usually somewhat lessened in scope, due to the flexible nature of reality there. Backlashes in areas of Threshold 3 are usually significantly greater in scope – when a calcified reality breaks, it breaks hard.
Once a Backlash has occurred, the Strain for an area is considered to be at its maximum rating – i.e. any spell not cast absolutely perfectly will trigger another Backlash! Overstrain is not accumulative from spell to spell.
Variations
To increase or decrease magic’s power, the Strain capacities and recovery rates for each level of Threshold can be dialed up and down. Alternately, the nature of what separates Threshold 0 zones from Threshold 3 zones can be changed; in a Warhammer-like world, for example, Threshold 0 zones would indicate warpstone-contaminated or Chaos-heavy areas, while Threshold 3 zones would be healthy natural areas.
At the Seneschal’s option, to portray the physical effort of wrenching at reality, sorcerers may also suffer 1 level of Fatigue (see the combat rules) for every 2 points of Strain they incur.
On 2/18/2004 at 7:03am, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
I like these rules. However, one thing I'd like to comment on: I think the Target variable for the spell still needs to be there - if it isn't, affecting a castle would be as easy as affectin a rock. Perhaps include both Target and Treshold modifiers, but use a -1 modifier to the Treshold values. (Yes, that would mean that the 0 Treshold would become -1 - but hey, it was supposed to be easy there!)
Other than that - cool. I'll definitely use this in some game.
On 2/18/2004 at 12:29pm, BirdMan wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
This looks interesting... but could you break it out with a few "in-play" -style examples?
On 2/18/2004 at 2:18pm, Lxndr wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
I'd be tempted to use Threshold to replace VAGARY LEVEL, instead of TARGET. After all, you're already paying the price once for Vagary difficulty, simply through SAs. So instead of it mattering whether you use Growth 1 or Growth 3, it matters WHERE you are when you're using Growth, regardless of Vagary level.
That little nitpick out of the way, I love the idea (although personally, I believe I would get rid of the "minimum" and "maximum" threshold values).
As for the cultural context of individual threshholds... what about a major and minor gift, as well? Major: Threshold +2. Minor: Threshold +1. Gifted: Threshold -1. Fae/Halfling: Threshold -1 (cumulative with Gifted). Cultures: Threshold +1/-1.
Thus there's a maximum of 3, and a minimum of -3. :D
On 2/18/2004 at 2:56pm, Stephen wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Thanaeon wrote: I like these rules. However, one thing I'd like to comment on: I think the Target variable for the spell still needs to be there - if it isn't, affecting a castle would be as easy as affectin a rock.
That's covered by the Volume variable, not the Target variable.
On 2/18/2004 at 6:16pm, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Stephen wrote:Thanaeon wrote: I like these rules. However, one thing I'd like to comment on: I think the Target variable for the spell still needs to be there - if it isn't, affecting a castle would be as easy as affectin a rock.
That's covered by the Volume variable, not the Target variable.
Ah, true! My bad.
I do still kind of like that distinction too - I guess that's setting-related and a matter of opinion whether it should be included.
On 2/18/2004 at 7:10pm, kanseg wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
I like this system. As you pointed out it would tailor the magic system for settings like Warhammer, where aging is not part of the magic concept.
Good work there - I will have to playtest it.
On 2/18/2004 at 10:33pm, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
I do have one concern about the system, though - I'm afraid often the Strain penalty would not be enough to discourage a player from using magic, especially if he's in a stable area - what's using all your sorcery pool on casting the spell if that's all you need to cast and the Strain Treshold of the area is 20 and your spell TN is lower? (As it usually would be...)
Still, all in all, a very nice system. I might use it in another, homebrew, setting, at least after some minor tweaking.
On 2/18/2004 at 11:23pm, Stephen wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Thanaeon wrote: I do have one concern about the system, though - I'm afraid often the Strain penalty would not be enough to discourage a player from using magic, especially if he's in a stable area - what's using all your sorcery pool on casting the spell if that's all you need to cast and the Strain Threshold of the area is 20 and your spell TN is lower? (As it usually would be...)
Well, bear in mind that the first spell is always easy, even in the official system. It's the second, third, and fourth spells in a row you have to worry about.
Remember that although high-Threshold areas can take a lot of Strain, that Strain doesn't go away for a long time (one point per hour or day). And it still takes an hour per die to refresh the Sorcery Pool -- and using refreshing spells keeps accumulating the Strain automatically, in addition to whatever Strain other spells might incur. It's actually remarkably easy to run through even 35 or 50 Strain points in only a few spells if you don't bother trying to control it.
Moreover, in my "default" above, the higher-Threshold areas are always the ones with lots of people around -- people who usually don't like magic and will react badly to its display. So you may rip off one spell carelessly, but then you have to cast another spell to deal with the consequences of that first one, then another to deal with those consequences, and so on and so forth....
Again, it's not the single careful spells this system's set up to penalize; it's the careless overuse of too much magic too quickly.
On 2/19/2004 at 6:59am, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
I realise this. My problem isn't the "single careful spell" - it's the single careless spell. Say you're in a Treshold 1 area that you know has been magically inactive recently. There's no one else around, and you know you're not going to need to cast any other spells for after this one. (Say, a ritual.) Is there any reason for the character to use any dice for resisting Strain if he knows that it won't surpass the Treshold anyway?
Perhaps add in a Treshold-dependent Momentary Treshold - any spell that doesn't surpass the Treshold but does surpass the Momentary Treshold still generates Overstrain equal to the difference. Say, an area has a Momentary Treshold of 6+Area Level. How does this sound? It necessitates using a bit of caution even when using single spells and represents spells powerful enough to just warp the fabric of reality around them.
On 2/19/2004 at 2:02pm, Lxndr wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
But that kills half the reason to GO to a threshold 1 or threshold 0 area - to allow for more carless/powerful spellcasting. Y'know?
On 2/19/2004 at 7:18pm, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
To a degree, I guess. My point was just this:
In the original model, if you don't spend any dice on resisting casting a CTN 6 spell, you automatically age 6 months and have to roll knockout.
Under these new rules, if you don't spend any dice on resisting casting a CTN 6 spell, you do 6 Strain, but in the middle of nowhere, that just really doesn't matter, since you just recite you favourite verse of poem and everything is back the way it was (a few seconds), and you can cast another one just like it. In fact, if you decrease the local Strain by one a second, it decreases as fast as a single sorcerer can make it!
I do like the basic mechanism of how it works, my main point of contention is that even the original rules make sorcerers pretty powerful - with these new rules, in many cases, the sorcerer really doesn't need to "waste" any dice for resisting the Strain.
Well, it's the GM's duty to decide it, I guess. Just my thoughts on the subject. Generally, I like the idea pretty much.
On 2/20/2004 at 3:34pm, Stephen wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Thanaeon wrote: In the original model, if you don't spend any dice on resisting casting a CTN 6 spell, you automatically age 6 months and have to roll knockout.
Under these new rules, if you don't spend any dice on resisting casting a CTN 6 spell, you do 6 Strain, but in the middle of nowhere, that just really doesn't matter, since you just recite you favourite verse of poem and everything is back the way it was (a few seconds), and you can cast another one just like it. In fact, if you decrease the local Strain by one a second, it decreases as fast as a single sorcerer can make it!
I do like the basic mechanism of how it works, my main point of contention is that even the original rules make sorcerers pretty powerful - with these new rules, in many cases, the sorcerer really doesn't need to "waste" any dice for resisting the Strain.
This is true, and intentionally so: this is meant to simulate the tradition of sorcerers being extremely dangerous on their own home turf, or in places of power. Essentially, a single sorcerer in a Threshold 0 zone can cast any one spell of CTN 10 or less with his entire Sorcery Pool without having to worry about negative effects, as long as he doesn't cast more than one spell per minute or so -- and if he's under attack, he'd better make sure that one spell can take out everybody, because even five or six seconds' delay is enough time for a blade or an arrow to get a lethal impact in.
If there are subsidiary sorcerers around to cover each other, then the Strain accumulates much faster, and Backlashes become much more common. This was my original thinking; only two or more sorcerers casting at a time should be able to provoke Backlash in a Threshold 0 area -- and that Threshold 0 areas should be rare.
But a "Straindrain" rate of 1 point per 10 seconds, rather than 1 second, might be more appropriate for the preferred style -- after all, these are totally unofficial rules and open to all the tinkering anybody likes.
It's also true that single spells can be carelessly ripped off in low-Threshold areas away from civilization, but again, that's deliberate. The system is not set up to penalize use of magic but to penalize overuse of magic. In the original system, after all, there are plenty of situations where a sorcerer may decide it's worth sacrificing six months of his life to guarantee that this particular spell has no chance of failing, on a one-spell-at-a-very-occasional-time basis.
On 2/20/2004 at 4:47pm, The Heretic wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Well, I like it. It allows for sorcerous wars to gain control of "places of power". But Im kind of inexperienced with the system so...
On 2/20/2004 at 9:56pm, Thanaeon wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Stephen, you argue well - I think I'll accept your reasons for it, or at least set the Overstrain limit higher, if I use it.
And to make sure you understand my opinion, the system definitely rocks.
On 2/20/2004 at 10:00pm, Stephen wrote:
RE: A variant sorcery system (with recognizeable influence....)
Thanaeon wrote: Stephen, you argue well - I think I'll accept your reasons for it, or at least set the Overstrain limit higher, if I use it.
And to make sure you understand my opinion, the system definitely rocks.
Thank you kindly -- certainly I'm not saying this system is better than the original or that it's perfect as it stands, just explaining my reasons for the design choices I made. Don't hesitate to twist it to your liking if you want to take the idea and run in a different direction with it.
That's the beauty of unofficial or variant rules, after all. :D