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When I joined the Forge, I largely wanted to flesh out the RPG designs that I made while I was bored off my ass at Ft. Huachuca.  I considered myself a writer, and gaming was a fun passtime, a way to tell stories with a living, breathing, cast.

Since I've joined the forge, however, I've begun to see the opprotunity in professional publishing.  It looks like something I could enjoy.  I've designed a pen-and-paper RPG and I'd like to see it in a complete form.

So basically, I was wondering what the essentials are to RPG Publication?  Where can I find an artist?  How should I lay out my website?

Basically, now that I'm done, how do I get my game out there?

There are degrees of publish.

Do you mean get the game out there and played?

Do you mean sold?

Do you mean in Book format or PDF?

Whatever the case I'd suggest taking a look back through the topics in this forum, or search it for: web sites, PDFs, artwork, print on demand, print quotes, print runs, editing, and so on.

-Matt

such an odd question, considering the answers are all over this forum.

http://www.indie-rpgs.com/resources/

the resource library is a good place to start.

Dave Sim's Cerebus' Guide to Self-Publishing[/b] is invaluable if you're planning on going that route.

However, the best piece of advice that I can give you: There is no one answer. Just do it the way you want to.

-L

Hmmmm, I guess I could do it that way.  I already have a game plan for publishing my book and I guess since there's no right or wrong way to do it, I'll just go ahead and move with what I'm doing.

Well, I'm curious to here what you've planned (if you don't mind sharing). <g>

Hello,

WildKarde, I do recommend considering that, although there's no single way to "publish right," there definitely exist ways to publish which are very unlikely to work out well. Some of these bad ways are bad for anyone - they just don't fly at all. Other ones are only "bad" if they don't suit your personal goals.

So the first questions I'd need to ask, in order to help you, are these:

Where do you want to see your game available? Internet, stores, both, other?

What does it look like, and what is the medium? PDF, website interaction, book, series of pamphlets, other?

How would you most prefer to be paid? Check from a distributor, direct from customer, consignment from retailer, other?

Armed with your answers (and there are no wrong answers here; this is a matter of personal goals and preference), I think you'll be astounded at what this forum can offer.

Specificity is good, though. "Oh, whatever, any of them, I guess," isn't going to help much. If you're not sure what the options are about, in each case, just ask.

Best,
Ron

I've had to do a little more research in order to answer your questions intelligently.  I've never tried to publish an RPG and I only have the experiences from self-publishing a novel to guide me.  After my first self-published book, I decided to turn to professionals (or at least experienced individuals) at every turn.

Your link to RPGHost's print-on-demand service was very helpful...if only for the fact that it was far less expensive than Authorhouse.  My original plan of going with them has been scrapped for a more hands-on approach.  Besides, their cost for printing pictures in their books is ridiculous.

I'd like to see my game available on the internet and in stores.  As far as retail sales go, I'm thinking of going to AAFES (it's the corporation that's behind the military PX on every American Military Base in the world) because the concentration of roleplayers on military bases is very high.  If you train your eye for it, you'll see miniatures, dice, and guidebooks almost everywhere in a barracks.  Boardgames get a little boring after playing them every night for a week.  The money I saw spent on RPG's within my own company would be enough to cover nearly any print run.

And, if the number of self-glamorizing "I was an airborne-scuba-ranger" memiors is any indication, AAFES is very friendly to self-published authors.

But as far as internet distribution goes, I'm lost.  I have my own ideas, but I'm not familiar with those tried-and-true methods you were referring to.  When I first came to the Forge, I was hesitant to post my ideas for fear of "reinventing the wheel" and now I'm in the same boat with my publishing methods.  As far as getting the book on a store shelf, I already know a retail chain that services a high number of roleplayers.

"Hoooah!"

But when it comes to other, simpler things, I'm pretty out of it.  I just saw a PDF for a game called Eclipse that left me with my tongue hanging out.  I haven't a clue how to make something that looks like that.  I don't even know where to get the software that makes things that look like that.

And payment...

Checks from a distributor would be great, but I'd like to also have the ability to sell directly through a website.  Again, no clue on how to do either of these things.

The format of the book will be pretty simple.  It'll be...oh yeah I already said it...a book.  I was thinking 8.5x11 sized pages...color cover and a color insert so my artist can just show off.  With all that extravagance, it still costs far less than what I'd planned to do.  With my old plan, each book would've cost roughly $25.00 to make.  Thanks to the Forge, I can do it for about $8.70.

But essentially, I'm lost on layout, payment, compensating the nice people who're helping me, and the assorted legalities that are bound to rip a good 'un outta my ass if I ignore them.

So....there we are.

Hi WK,

My apologies for being a wee bit rushed in this post ...

The big point is that it's actually very easy, especially if you follow a good progression from (1) Adequate to (2) Damn Good to (3) Outstanding for each of the following topics. If you make sure to pursue each topic, yet not freak out because you're not at (3) yet for any of them, then you can "ride success" at each step, as you move on to the next steps.

WEBSITE
Here's where "adequate" really is the starting point. Website design, usage, and traffic should always be rated in terms of "better than yesterday," rather than "must be perfect now." And there are lots and lots of resources for you, both generically and specific to independent RPG publishing.

Hosting is probably your first issue, and I recommend asking Clinton R. Nixon about some of the options. Not only does the Forge provide hosting, but he will also give good advice for other options with no hard feelings - a very virtuous and useful trait.

ART
Most folks agree that art is a major issue for RPG design. Did you want to discuss the options for payment, leasing, and so forth? If so, that's worth some thread-hunting and we can pursue it here if you like.

FORMAT/FILE
Have you read Clinton R. Nixon's article about PDF-making at reasonable costs? That might allay some of your fears a bit. I also suggest that this step should come a little later in the process than many people think ... all too often, I see people obsessing over margins and how to shade inset-boxes when they really ought to be playtesting the game itself.

Other people to talk to about this issue include Matt Snyder and Paul Czege.

LAYOUT/LOOK
Fortunately, some folks here at the Forge offer great layout services for nominal fees, and there are even some who'll do it for nothin' if it strikes them as fun. The downside is that everyone is time-constrained and even if they did a great job for someone last year, might not be able to help this year.

But make your needs known, and you might be surprised. Another good thing for this issue is that at the moment, it's not the King Hell Final Design you're looking for - just a good one that will serve the needs of whatever particular step you're at.

Again - although this is a very important feature of publishing, it's also the most fun and reasonable if you rely on some reciprocity and some networking via this site and others.

PRINTING
I suggest that the very best deal currently available is through Express Media, which offers an excellent POD service for reasonable prices. Other people have had good experiences with a variety of other options, and it looks as if you're already doing all the necessary research to learn about them.

Since it's all a new technology and a new set of options, my real advice is merely to pick & choose as you see fit, with an eye on

When the time comes, though, I suggest learning about making good decisions about print run size - good people to consult with about that include Jake Norwood and Ralph Mazza.

FULFILMENT/DISTRIBUTION
Since you're talking about website and store sales, you'll need to consider some interesting issues.

1. The possibility of working with a fulfilment house, who will warehouse your books and ship them to places, whether those places are stores, distributors, or private individuals. There are plenty of upsides and downsides to this tactic, but it seems to be nearly-required for store-level distribution.

(Note that a fulfilment house is not necessarily the same as a distributor; the latter term is very specific.)

2. Website traffic and sales - your own, or someone else's? This is another one of those "changing technologies, changing options" decisions. Some of us have done very well to restrict website sales to our own sites, and merely rely on public site interaction to bring people to those sites. Others have tried more of a "join the on-line store" approach, with mixed results.

3. I strongly suggest considering attending the GAMA Trade Show in March of whatever year your books become available to distributors, and to use that as a major promotional push to generate sales for your first print run.

Anyway, I hope some of these points are reassuring rather than daunting. Please feel free to tag any of them for further discussion.

Best,
Ron

Wow...if that was rushed, I wonder what an "involved" post looks like.

Hmmm, As far as art goes, I'm completely in the dark with what to pay and how to pay.  If I were hiring a writer, I'd be fine, my Writers Market tells me what to pay and how.  I don't want to scare an artist off (and I've really only got one interested party) by making insultingly low, or unrealistically high offers.  I also don't want to unwittingly sell them my firstborn in the process.

Telling me about the GAMA trade show allows me to set release dates.  I didn't know the market well enough to know when a good time to release my game might be.  Actually, I didn't know the market well enough to know to ask that question.

Is there a post or an article where Mr. Nixon discusses having the Forge host a site?  I hate asking questions that have been answered elsewhere already so if I can look it up instead of buggin' him, that'd be cool.

Oh, is this the Express Media you were talking about?  I can't seem to find their POD services.

No, I believe the site you're looking for is www.expressmedia.com. Someone correct me if I'm wrong?

Quote from: WyldKardeWow...if that was rushed, I wonder what an "involved" post looks like.

Hmmm, As far as art goes, I'm completely in the dark with what to pay and how to pay.  If I were hiring a writer, I'd be fine, my Writers Market tells me what to pay and how.  I don't want to scare an artist off (and I've really only got one interested party) by making insultingly low, or unrealistically high offers.  I also don't want to unwittingly sell them my firstborn in the process.

There's a wide range of possibilities here.  Hire a "name brand" artist to do your cover and your looking at several thousands of dollars.  Hire a local community college art student whose primarily interested in being published and building a portfolio and you're looking anywhere from free to $10 or $20 per illustration.  Hire an established (but not 'name brand') illustrator and you'll pay somewhere in between.

When on a budget its all a matter of negotiation and finding an artist who a) isn't in the middle of other important projects, b) is eager to work, and c) is enthusastic about your project in particular.  You'll find lots of artists friendly to small press types willing to work at reasonable rates.

One method is to just offer a flat dollar amount and say "how many illustrations are you willing to give me for $100"

Another method is pay in tiers where the artist is willing to cut you a bargain discount rate up front with the understanding that upon meeting certain sales goals (like different break even points) you'll pay them another installment.

Its really all a question of negotiating with the artist.  To find an artist, check out the connections forum or the Resource Library here, or browse any of the inumberable gallery websites looking for amateur talent that catches your eye.


All of the above also applies to finding Editors and Layout people as well.  Y

QuoteTelling me about the GAMA trade show allows me to set release dates.  I didn't know the market well enough to know when a good time to release my game might be.  Actually, I didn't know the market well enough to know to ask that question.

GAMA would be the least of my worries.  I'm kind of surprised Ron recommended it.  Unless your primary concern is printing a large amount of copies and getting them into traditional distribution channels and your FLGS, GAMA is fairly pointless.

I'd encourage taking either a PDF approach for sale through a venue like RPGNow, or the Forge Bookshelf, or manually from your own website, or a POD print approach sold through a venue like RPGMall or manually from your own website.

If you REALLY want to get into distribution you'd need to either do a tremendous amount of homework (which would include visits to GAMA) or, (what I think is the better option) hook up with a group like Key 20 Direct, or Impressions, or Tundra to represent you, and let them do the GAMA distributor interface stuff for you.

QuoteIf you REALLY want to get into distribution you'd need to either do a tremendous amount of homework (which would include visits to GAMA) or, (what I think is the better option) hook up with a group like Key 20 Direct, or Impressions, or Tundra to represent you, and let them do the GAMA distributor interface stuff for you.

This worry should be at the very bottom of your list. In fact, I'd make a new list of worries and leave this one off. Distro just isn't something you need to be worrying about right now.

IF you actually develop a cool game and generate some interest (aka, sales), then Distro will come to you. Otherwise, screw 'em.

Focus on producing a clean, playable, readable product. Don't worry about art or distribution until you've got a couple of years of playtesting under your belt.

Focus.
-L

Well distribution is something that'll come later on in the process.  Perhaps in a product that deems such measures practical, or perhaps in this product if it should generate enough interest later on down the line.  

Art however, is somewhat less "optional" in my opinion.  While I don't think I need the best in the industry for my first book, I think that creating an attractive product is part of creating a good one.  Even without a lot of artwork, a cover illustration is definately a neccesity.  It would be nice to toss in a few black and white sketches here and there throughout the book, but it's not key.  If the cover and the first few pages don't get 'em...a picture referencing some obscure passage in the text probably won't do the trick either.

Oh yeah, I don't know if I made any reference to the game I'm talking about here, so I'll make a link to it now.

I agree, art is integral to producing a nice, for-sale rpg. However, it's not something you have to worry about until 3-6 months before your press date. Until that time, it's playtest, revise, edit, playtest, revise, edit, ad nauseum.

Your friends should live in terror of your game! They are your guinea pigs. No free time is safe!

good luck,
-L

Wow...this is embarassing but I'll go ahead and toss it out there instead of getting it horribly, horribly wrong and not finding out until after I've printed a bunch of books.

Okay, here goes...

How do you pull all this info together?

What I mean is, how does one organize the information in their game?How do you put this info down in a simple, readable format?  I've never had to write a document that was so information heavy.  Unlike a novel where I get to gloss over what's not important in the moment and go back to it later in the text, I have to get all my important information that falls under certain headings and make sure it's all there.  I've also got to make sure that the information given makes sense in the order it's given.  Is character development more important than combat?

So basiacally, if anyone wants to stoop to answer this fairly basic question?  What's the usual way to structure and categorize your game mechanic?