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Author Topic: Quick etiquette question  (Read 2701 times)
Callan S.
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« on: March 19, 2004, 11:27:11 PM »

I just blundered into the 'no bumping rule' in RPG theory. I can't find the rule in the 'Etiquette at The Forge (policy)' thread, so I'm wondering where it is. Where ever it is, it may have related rules near it I'd prefer not to suddenly blunder into ignorantly, latter on. So I'd like to find it so I can be sure of any other rules like it that I wouldn't normally expect. Or is it simply the empty post rule (which references two word positive affirmations) that applies here?
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Ron Edwards
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2004, 09:08:43 AM »

Hi Callan,

It's a combination of empty posting and no-resurrect posting, the former more than the latter.

Best,
Ron
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Callan S.
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2004, 06:13:35 PM »

Hi Ron,

Hmmm, I posted to it while it was still showing on the front page, as it'd been five days, which I thought is fine but I'm caught by surprise again.

Anyway, next time people ask me to do a lengthy play mock up and I take the time to do it, I'll PM them for discussion if there's no responce after posting it.

Regards,
Callan
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Ron Edwards
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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2004, 09:02:31 AM »

Hi there,

Callan, I think I'm going to have to be a little blunt in this post.

There can be no legalistic "but the guidelines say" debate here at the Forge. It's a dictatorship, in terms of moderation. All circumstances are subject to my local interpretation of what the site is about. Those guidelines are not a constitution, but rather an attempt to get across what my standards are as an absolute-authority moderator.

So the guidelines do not cover every last detail of how to post. Nor do they serve as absolute cutoffs for what you can and cannot do. As I say, they indicate, if possible, and if read correctly, where I'm coming from as moderator. To put it baldly, I'm not constrained by the guidelines - I can apply them any way that seems right to me, in a particular situation. And there's no court of appeal besides asking me to look at it again.

When you read all those guidelines, here's what I hope you can perceive across all of them: keep the discourse clean. That's what it's all about. So if you are about to post X, and "X" isn't covered by or seems to slip through or just past the guidelines, you are still expected to use that principle to judge whether to post it.

And "Hey! I posted! Talk to me!" is not keeping the discourse clean. It just isn't. It doesn't matter whether Article III (A) ii (b) of the guidelines covers such a post or not. All the existing points in the guidelines are all about one, single thing - and you have to use your judgment in keeping any post, even if it's not mentioned there, in line with that single thing.

And when I decide that your judgment didn't work out well - then my judgment rules, absolutely. I'm not totally without reason, and I know that sometimes I make mistakes. But until you internalize the principles of the guidelines and apply them to your own posts, there's no hope for you or anyone else to appeal to the etiquette rules. It won't work, because they are only part of the reality here: that I make all final calls about content. Until that internalization happens, you'll keep running up against my calls - and who knows, maybe perceive them as arbitrary, or mean, or arrogant, or whatever. That's fine too; lots of people leave the Forge after a few posts because they can't handle that.

So: without sugar-coating it, your post which I objected to is an "attention-post." The Forge isn't about getting attention. It's about discourse. Is my interpretation of your post utterly arbitrary? Yup. Is it probably unfair to your intentions? Yup. Is it something you have to eat without salt? Yup. Suck it up, move on, learn from it, and post as constructively as possible.

Best,
Ron
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Callan S.
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2004, 03:25:16 PM »

Hi Ron,

I don't mistake who's the controlling authority here...I'm not trying to say 'hey, YOU didn't follow the rules', as I'm quite aware the rules are what you decide. I just wanted to find out where there was a rough guide to how you handle bumping, in case there was a rough guide to other stuff I should know about near it.

On my post. I think my post was somewhat like "Hey! I posted! Talk to me!". It was in the range of "Hey! I posted that thing you previous posters asked me to write! Talk to me!".

I was asked twice to write up a mock up of play, which are always lengthy. No one has to respond to a post they didn't ask for. But you'd think that if they ask for a post/mock up, they would respond once its provided for them. Okay, perhaps I'm unreasonable on that...but I've been saying here that next time I'll PM about it (and only once, I'll now add). I'm not saying everyone should follow my expectations (though I'd love that...oops, typed that instead of just thinking it!).

I understand the bump is noise rather than signal to you, now. It's just that those other posters, by asking for a write up effort but not replying, are creating noise for me. Ironically, instead of getting annoyed with a forum who's posters gave me noise, I tried to do something about it...which ended up being noise as well.

I understand as a moderator dealing with blighters who question your every move is a pain in the arse. But although my first post in this thread is a little bit tense, I wanted to basically ask 'how/where can I learn more to avoid making noise in the future'. And as the dictator in terms of what I meant (though sadly, not a dictator on how it is taken :( ), I'm certain that's what I meant. :)

I've eaten up enough of your time now (go write some more cool stuff! :) ), and having learnt all I can to avoid my mistake in future (clearly, I made a mistake), I will now run off into the night laughing madly.

*Callan runs off into the night, laughing madly, as he is prone to do*

Regards,
Callan
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Ron Edwards
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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2004, 04:49:11 PM »

Thanks! I do appreciate the reply; it helps me understand what's up.

Yeah, it seems to me as if the folks who requested the material are fallin' down on their implicit contract ... neither of us can do much about it, you understand, but morally-speaking, I guess I'm with you.

Thanks again for seeing my POV about it.

Best,
Ron
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