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275647 Posts in 27717 Topics by 4285 Members Latest Member: - Jason DAngelo Most online today: 76 - most online ever: 565 (October 17, 2020, 02:08:06 PM)
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Author Topic: [Trollbabe] How versatile is it?  (Read 9374 times)
montag
Member

Posts: 172


« Reply #15 on: July 09, 2004, 04:47:52 AM »

Quote from: ethan_greer
Angel is a Trollbabe.
AFAIK the big secret is that _everyone_ is a Trollbabe, given the right perspective.
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markus
------------------------------------------------------
"The real problem is not whether machines think but whether men do."
--B. F. Skinner, Contingencies of Reinforcement (1969)
Bailywolf
Member

Posts: 729


« Reply #16 on: July 09, 2004, 06:02:02 AM »

Neato.

How about 'Wizkids' about powerful but young magical prodigies?  Not adults, but not quiet kids, as powerful as Wizards, but perhaps not as wise.  Important to the adult world for many different reasons- the affection of parents, the manipulation of devious senior sorcerers, the fear of the mundane populace, the respect of grown-up wizkids... important to other kids as role-models, friends, or rivals.  A normally marginalized class of people- preadolescents- with the power and strength not to be marginalized, ignored, or abused if they choose to exert it.  

Ron- I entirely dig what you are saying, so please don't interpret these questions as me not 'getting' your whole Trollbabe mojo.  Its just the more I like a game, the more I like to monkey with it.

Thanks all- you've sold me Trollbabe.

-Ben
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Bankuei
Guest
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2004, 08:38:53 AM »

Hi Andy,

Correct, we changed magic to Chi Powers and altered the specialities.  The key point in what I'm saying is that using actual Trollbabes works for all the reasons Ron points out, if you are using that setting... it's a quick and easy way to establish things to non-gamers.  

Now, all the other setting ideas, like Planescape or Vampire, etc.  work ONLY if everyone "gets" the gist of it.  If you slap down 120 pages of necessary reading into the setting, most new folks will simply not play.  The reason any of the other settings work(mine as well) is because you're primarily dealing with folks who have genre familiarity.  Without that, it becomes an uphill battle to communicate the setting to new players.

The other big feature of TB's setting as stands is that it is divorced enough from any other mass media pop genre, to where its also free of the genre expectations that come with it.  In D&D, you expect crazy wizards, dank dungeons, a lich and a dragon.  They pretty much HAVE to show up for it to be D&D.  With vampires, there has to be angsty romance.  

With TB, there's... um, well, yeah.  There's no set genre expectations, added with the unique character, not only do you have a blank slate to play your character, you also have a pretty blank slate to define the world.  Notice that in the pictures, you have Trollbabes, humans, or trolls.  There's no giant dragons, serpents, or undead running about.  In the text we get a brief mention that weird stuff is about, but no definition.  It's up to you and your group to draw that for themselves.  Ron pretty much designed everything to be a frame, and you provide the picture.

Chris
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sirogit
Member

Posts: 503


« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2004, 09:58:28 AM »

I do see the payoff in play of the specific definitions that Ron puts in Trollbabes, and how trying to change what a Trollbabe is removes something of the appeal. Ron seemed a little presumptious on why people wouldn't want to play Trollbabes, as I think there's a myriad of reasons that people are uncomofrtable with playing Trollbabes.

The thing about Trollbabe is that like Sorcerer, its very focused on creating the type of play that it professes through every choice of the game design, but contains some revoloutinary, very fun ideas that may be used more generally.

People who dig the concept behind Trollbabe first and foremost benefit the most, they get a game system that translates it clearly to actual play.

But there are alot of people that are attracted to those fun ideas without being totally sold on the concept. And they can use the rules to have fun. It just isn't likely to get that Zen moment where you, the other players, and the game designer know exactly what you want to do and do it without any hurdles whatsoever.
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xiombarg
Member

Posts: 1183


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« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2004, 01:12:18 PM »

Quote from: sirogit
But there are alot of people that are attracted to those fun ideas without being totally sold on the concept. And they can use the rules to have fun. It just isn't likely to get that Zen moment where you, the other players, and the game designer know exactly what you want to do and do it without any hurdles whatsoever.

Exactly. I think the only reason we don't see even MORE monkeying with Trollbabe is, unlike Sorcerer, Trollbabe has a tightly-coupled setting, and Ron thinks your being a gamer dork when you try to monkey with it when, in fact, you might get the core of the game and just not like the trappings.
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Tim Alexander
Member

Posts: 304


« Reply #20 on: July 12, 2004, 06:25:46 AM »

Personally I keep running into the idea of adapting Trollbabe to noir as I think the reroll mechanics lend themselves nicely to the detective genre. Replace magic with 'investigate' or 'hunch' or some such and you get players elegantly creating the clue path for Sam Spade that is so normally tedious to go through in your run of the mill RPG. On top of that, the relationship mechanics are perfect parralels to the kind of entanglements those tough guy PIs are always roping themselves into. I haven't sat down and done it yet, but it's certainly in the back of my mind.

-Tim

P.S. - I love Trollbabe as it stands as well. Ron pushes a whole lot of angles with this game, and monkeying with it will often remove some of those angles. The big one that's often stripped off is the 'babe' portion, and Ron (from what I've gathered via posts and just from talking to him) is really wedded towards pushing against that particular button. I think it's a worthwhile button to push, and people ought to run the game straight just to see how it resonates unmodded.
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C. Edwards
Member

Posts: 558

savage / sublime


« Reply #21 on: July 12, 2004, 08:15:44 AM »

Hey Tim,

I'm a noir fiend, so if you work something up I'll find some people and force them to play test it with me. Get crackin'!


-Chris
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b_bankhead
Member

Posts: 259


« Reply #22 on: July 12, 2004, 01:56:27 PM »

Quote from: C. Edwards
Hey Tim,

I'm a noir fiend, so if you work something up I'll find some people and force them to play test it with me. Get crackin'!


-Chris


Well actually the Nightbabe game I am playing in with Paganini is tending Toward a Noir direction. Once we get enough scenes under our belts we should post an actual play for this game.
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Bailywolf
Member

Posts: 729


« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2004, 05:07:09 AM »

I finally have Trollbabe, and have been devouring it like a fiend...

I was struck by how excellent a Kung-Fu chopsocky game it could make... or a Lord of the Rings (movie-flavor) game.

I didn't get a sense that mechanics were somehow melded into setting... you would get a different kind of dynamic if everyone in the game is a martial artist rather than a Trollbabe, but it wouldn’t be a better or worse game...just different.

For a Middle Earth kind of thing, you replace Magic with Lore and it becomes a catchall for magical objects, secret knowledge, actual spells and invocations, or mesmeritic power (depending on your Specialty).  Fighting remains unchanged, as does Social.

The Remembered Spell reroll can be used to activate a magical object you carry around.

The Ring is a relationship for all who have come into contact with it.

Social would be based on the higher of Fighting and Lore.


For a Kung Fu game, I’m not sure what you would do with Magic... its all about Fighting after all.  Perhaps breaking it into Hard and Soft?  Or simply ditching it and making it Kung Fu and Social (roll over, or roll under).  

Remembered Spell becomes Secret Technique


Ron- thanks for writing this gem.  I'll have a blast running it as-is, and another entirely separate blast fiddling with the system.

-B
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b_bankhead
Member

Posts: 259


« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2004, 12:29:54 PM »

How about when you are doing those ' Crouching Tiger,Hidden Dragon abilities like running up walls and balancing on a blade of grass that aren't actually fighting. If your character was a ninja then magic might be 'ninja training' and it might deal with stuff like 'melding with the darkness' or 'ninja gadgets'....
Its interesting to note that 'magic' abilitites scale bsed on the scale of the adventure so their range of effects depends on how important what is going on is.....
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Bailywolf
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Posts: 729


« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2004, 12:47:07 PM »

Hmmm...  How about Fighting, Wuxia, and Social?

Wuxia for all that mystic-fu stuff... and Wuxia+Fighting battles would be of the bamboo-forest or water-skipping type.  Otherwise, Wuxia is used for mystical/sneaky stuff (meditation, awareness, athleticism, sneaking etc)

Golden Sword Wan
Number:  5
Fighting: 1-4 (Sword)
Wuxia: 6-10 (Lightfoot)
Social: 1-5 (Charming)
Carries:  A sword of quality in a well-worn sheath.
Costume:  A simple long tunic and robe, trousers, and walking slippers.  
Looks:  A quietly charming man.  He wears his hair in a long qeue.

-B
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8bitjunkie
Member

Posts: 10


« Reply #26 on: July 15, 2004, 10:28:24 AM »

Quote from: Bailywolf
Hmmm...  How about Fighting, Wuxia, and Social?

Wuxia for all that mystic-fu stuff... and Wuxia+Fighting battles would be of the bamboo-forest or water-skipping type.  Otherwise, Wuxia is used for mystical/sneaky stuff (meditation, awareness, athleticism, sneaking etc)

Golden Sword Wan
Number:  5
Fighting: 1-4 (Sword)
Wuxia: 6-10 (Lightfoot)
Social: 1-5 (Charming)
Carries:  A sword of quality in a well-worn sheath.
Costume:  A simple long tunic and robe, trousers, and walking slippers.  
Looks:  A quietly charming man.  He wears his hair in a long qeue.

-B


I was thinking along the same lines the other day! Trying to come up with a mystical Usagi Yojimbo type of game for my little brother - although I don't mind, playing a 'babe' would be out of the question for him heh. I read somewhere (???) on this board about using Usagi with Trollbabe but I needed a way to explain the magic and Wuxia styles seems to work.
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Bailywolf
Member

Posts: 729


« Reply #27 on: July 15, 2004, 11:04:35 AM »

I'm reading Bridge of Birds by Barry Hugart right now- the first in the Master Li and Number 10 Ox books (set in a "China that never was.").

Brilliant, and the Trollbabe system is the one to use for this kind of quirky, sneaky, and darkly funny work.

The three action types are Brawn, Guile, and Fight.  You roll under your Number for Brawn, over for Guile, and the HIGHER of the two plus the number for Fight.  Which ever one you favor determines your style of fighitng.

Compare Master Li and Numebr Ten Ox.  Kao Li would have a 2, and would roll over it for going sneaky, devious, or clever things.  His fighting is also devious, and his throwing kinves are deadly (Fight of 2-10).  Ox is a big strapping honest peasant sort of lad who solves problems best with phsycial solutions.  He would be an 8, and his fighting style is all main strength and raw power for which he rolls 1-8.

Less extreme characters are certainly possible, but unlike the tweked Trollbabe, this one favors extreme characters in two areas.

Something I was thinking about while walking back from lunch.

-B[/i]
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Mike Holmes
Acts of Evil Playtesters
Member

Posts: 10459


« Reply #28 on: July 15, 2004, 11:44:18 AM »

Hmm. Ron comes in and suggests that Trollbabe only makes sense as written. This prompts a bunch of people to post about how it can be used for all sorts of things. Now, people will buy it to play whatever, and if it goes wrong, Ron can say, "Toldyaso!"

Well done, Ron, well done. :-)

Mike
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