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275647 Posts in 27717 Topics by 4285 Members Latest Member: - Jason DAngelo Most online today: 89 - most online ever: 565 (October 17, 2020, 02:08:06 PM)
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Author Topic: Building a Tempted Dog  (Read 6237 times)
Levi Kornelsen
Member

Posts: 210


« on: December 12, 2005, 11:43:05 AM »

So, chatting with my players about "what this game is about", in preparation for making characters, a question came up.

One of my players was curious about demons.  Specifically, he was curious if his character could have a stormy relationship with a demon - the demon would have a name, the Dog would consider him an enemy, but the demon would want to tempt and claim the Dog personally.  This would lead to plenty of potential conflicts, one of which might be the "fall from grace" of his character, either because he resorts to doctrinally 'bad' practices to bind or destroy the demon, or because he gives in at some point to some degree.  I thought the idea was pretty good, but wasn't sure how it would play out in relation to everything else - especially because demons in the game often strike me as being more of an "allegorical force with teeth" than specific individuals in the setting.

However, he wanted to know if having something like that running in the background would interfere with the way the game is supposed to run and feel overall - a question I couldn't answer.

So.  From the point of view of more experience people with this particular game, would this be just plain good, or more trouble than it's worth?
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coffeestain
Member

Posts: 165


« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2005, 11:51:16 AM »

Levi,

If I'm understanding you correctly, what your player is interested in doing is supported entirely by the rules.  You simply have to have the character take a relationship with the demon and then he's a sorcerer.  If he decides to call on the powers of the demon, he receives the same benefits any other sorcerer would.

Somewhere around here, I'm pretty sure there's an actual play account with a Dog who did exactly that.  I believe this is it:  http://www.indie-rpgs.com/forum/index.php?topic=14494.0

Let me know if that scratches your itch.

Regards,

Daniel
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coffeestain
Member

Posts: 165


« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2005, 11:52:24 AM »

Levi,

Oh, in addition, remember that your Dogs can have relationships with sins.  Pay careful attention to how those relationships can be brought into play, as it might also cover what you're interested in introducing into your game.

Regards,

Daniel
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Levi Kornelsen
Member

Posts: 210


« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2005, 12:01:03 PM »

If I'm understanding you correctly, what your player is interested in doing is supported entirely by the rules.  You simply have to have the character take a relationship with the demon and then he's a sorcerer.  If he decides to call on the powers of the demon, he receives the same benefits any other sorcerer would.

That makes sense.

If the character is, in rules terms, simply a sorcerer that didn't ask to be one, and who refuses to actually use the demon and perform sorcery... at least at first... Yeah, that's quite nice.

Thanks!

(And yeah, the sin-relationships, those I'll be watching for).
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coffeestain
Member

Posts: 165


« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2005, 12:13:30 PM »

Levi,

Yeah, there's always going to be that huge temptation there - bigger than any gun, higher than any escalation.

Just remember YOU can't judge him.  You can't tell him where his soul is going, you can't tell him God spurns him.  You just hand him the dice with a smile and wait to see what happens.

Regards,

Daniel
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Andrew Morris
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Posts: 1233


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« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2005, 01:40:59 PM »

Oh, and about having an actual personified demon...well, the level of...uhm...supernatural-ness in your campaign is really up to your group. If everyone's on board with the idea, then run with it. I thought I was going to be running a "demons are bad luck" style of campaign, but my players quickly threw in manifested demons, green puss, and all sorts of other nastiness.
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Joshua A.C. Newman
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« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2005, 09:56:43 AM »

Well, even if demons are the bad-luck sort, it's just an avenue for player authorship. I really don't see the harm in it.

I wanted a character at one point who was completely comfortable with the demons he'd exorcised. He was a badass exersiz0r. His Coat crawled with symbols, his bullets scream and left a poof of sacred earth when they hit, and he had a little pouch he used to keep demons in that he'd gotten from a Mountain Person. I never played the dude — there are only so many hours in a day and I don't get to do all the role-playing I want — but the plan was to take demons as Traits. Having particular demons as Relationships is a gnarly idea that I didn't think of.

Now, here's a technicality: does this mean that, as soon as that dude does something with his demons, everyone's witnessed sorcery, so the dice go up on the Town's side, too? Is that the sorcery version of the d4 added to guns?
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the glyphpress's games are Shock: Social Science Fiction and Under the Bed.

I design books like Dogs in the Vineyard and The Mountain Witch.
Andrew Morris
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« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2005, 10:14:53 AM »

Now, here's a technicality: does this mean that, as soon as that dude does something with his demons, everyone's witnessed sorcery, so the dice go up on the Town's side, too? Is that the sorcery version of the d4 added to guns?

I don't have the rulebook handy, but I'm pretty sure the dice get added as the players find out more about how far the "something's wrong" list goes. The sorcerous Dog wouldn't be part of "something's wrong," so, from that interpretation, the Dog using sorcery wouldn't add to the dice for demonic influence. Thematically, too, the Dogs are part of "something's about to get set right," so it seems to work from that point of view as well. By default, everything the Dogs do is the will of the King of Life, and if he wants this Dog here to use demons to fight those other demons over there, well, then that's all well and good.
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Joshua A.C. Newman
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« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2005, 10:21:07 AM »

Right on, Andrew. Totally makes sense.
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the glyphpress's games are Shock: Social Science Fiction and Under the Bed.

I design books like Dogs in the Vineyard and The Mountain Witch.
Vaxalon
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Posts: 1619


« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2005, 05:46:47 AM »

What if another Dog sees the first Dog summoning demons, decides that's "Wrong" too?  I think that might put a whole new cast on what level the demonic influence is at.
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"In our game the other night, Joshua's character came in as an improvised thing, but he was crap so he only contributed a d4!"
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Joshua A.C. Newman
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« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2005, 07:14:50 AM »

That's regular ol' Dog vs. Dog stuff. If I don't like you swearin' and drinkin', I kin take you to task fer that, too.
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the glyphpress's games are Shock: Social Science Fiction and Under the Bed.

I design books like Dogs in the Vineyard and The Mountain Witch.
Vaxalon
Member

Posts: 1619


« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2005, 07:17:57 AM »

Hm, I wonder if it isn't more than that.

In fact, I wonder if a group of Dogs (what's the venereal word for Dogs in this context?)  could be a "Town"? 
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"In our game the other night, Joshua's character came in as an improvised thing, but he was crap so he only contributed a d4!"
                                     --Vincent Baker
Joshua A.C. Newman
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« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2005, 07:31:26 AM »

If the Dogs in question aren't protagonists, sure. Otherwise, it's regular conflict between Dogs. I mean, if you're not having throwdowns between Dogs in your games, I don't know why you're playing.
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the glyphpress's games are Shock: Social Science Fiction and Under the Bed.

I design books like Dogs in the Vineyard and The Mountain Witch.
Pôl Jackson
Member

Posts: 33


« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2005, 12:51:23 PM »

One of my players was curious about demons.  Specifically, he was curious if his character could have a stormy relationship with a demon - the demon would have a name, the Dog would consider him an enemy, but the demon would want to tempt and claim the Dog personally.

Not only would this be OK, but it would also be totally awesome.

Now, technically, he can't do this when he's first assigning Relationship dice. My copy of the rulebook (First Edition, p. 14), under "Relationships", reads: "...In play you can give your character Relationships with institutions, demons, places, and even sins, but for now stick with people." So if you're playing by the book, you can't initially assign Relationship dice to a demon.

He could take it as a Trait, of course. "That demon wants to tempt me to sin." (Or, "That demon will never tempt me to sin." or "I want that demon to tempt me to sin."...)

This would also work: during the "Accomplishment" step of character creation, he could ask for a scene that introduces the demon in some way. Then, either during or after the scene, he can just assign one or more of his free Relationship dice to the demon. (Is this legal? I certainly think so!)

Or you could ignore the rule and just let him have a relationship with a demon right off the bat. It probably wouldn't do any harm. But I think it would be much cooler to do it in play, where everyone can see the Dog and his demon in action.
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Mark Causey
Member

Posts: 99


« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2005, 02:14:29 PM »

Hm, I wonder if it isn't more than that.

In fact, I wonder if a group of Dogs (what's the venereal word for Dogs in this context?)  could be a "Town"? 

I think you mean the word for the group of Dogs, which I think would be a pack. But the online dictionary said you mean the word for Dogs relating to sexual pleasure or indulgence, which I wouldn't know.
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--Mark Causey
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